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What did Democrats do wrong?

What did Democrats do wrong?

  • Didn't fight inflation enough.

    Votes: 13 14.9%

  • Didn't fight illegal immigration enough.

    Votes: 24 27.6%

  • Too much focus on abortion.

    Votes: 2 2.3%

  • Too much transgender stuff.

    Votes: 31 35.6%

  • America not ready for Progressive women leader.

    Votes: 31 35.6%

  • Should have kept Joe.

    Votes: 3 3.4%

  • Not enough focus on new jobs.

    Votes: 2 2.3%

  • Nothing, Trump cheated & played dirty!

    Votes: 16 18.4%

  • Didn't stop Gaza War.

    Votes: 9 10.3%

  • I can be Agent M.

    Votes: 6 6.9%
  • Total voters
    87
ahhell said:
If you want to win elections. If not, meh.
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What specific rights or privileges are you willing to give up to make them feel welcome? What of yours are you going to sacrifice to bring them into the fold?
 
Donal said:
No, these were grown ass adults who were well aware of what they were doing. Also, my dog not coming when I call doesn't lead to anyone's death or harm. Promising not to vote for him after he's hit his term limits is pretty ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ hollow. they need to show they have actually grown and try to heal some of the the harm they chose to cause.

Should a battered wife take back her abuser because he's lonely?
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No, she shouldn't, obviously, but if she considers doing so, she isn't a 'never abuser', is she?

Donal said:
There were so many things that we said "after this, how can anyone support him?" The racist tirade to start his candidacy. The Access Hollywood recording. Mocking the disabled reporter. The various bizarre, unhinged rants and aimless babbling during speeches and debates. Baiting reporters to advertise his new hotel by talking about Obama's birth certificate...oh ya, the whole Obama's birth certificate thing.

And that's all before he was ever elected. He only got worse. But they never stopped supporting him. They never stopped buying his ◊◊◊◊◊◊ merchandise, holding parades for him, worshipping him, building golden idols in his image, praying to him, cutting off friends and family in his honor, making their lives about him, and taking the rest of us down with them.

We're supposed to just...let them back in to our good graces?
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What is smart to do depends on what their actual state of mind is, but you seem to be unwilling to distinguish between them. They are all them to you even though there are obvious differences between them. There is more than one kind of 'never Trumper'. It's not as if Biden/Harris voters can't be blamed for what they did. I doubt that most of them got what they thought they voted for, and yet it won't surprise me if they'll do the same thing again. Many of them no doubt will:
dann said:
As for the Biden administration allegedly "building a future dominated by renewable energy," it certainly wasn't a present built on renewables (see #2,052). In 2028, 'centrists' will present themselves as the environmentally sound alternative to Trump. I hope people won't believe them.
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Some Biden/Harris voters are aware that they didn't get what they expected to get from them (in the case of Harris, in spite of her teaming up with the Cheneys!), some of them will defend their vote as being for the least bad alternative and be willing to do it again for the same reason, and some have shifted to progressives like AOC and Sanders. They are as different in sentiments and intentions as never 'Trumpers' are.

Donal said:
No, they don't need a reason to vote for him. Just an excuse. And if we don't give them one, they'll invent one. ◊◊◊◊ them all.
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Yes, there are some of those, but does it make you feel better to treat them as if they're all the same, "◊◊◊◊ them all," because you're angry, instead of being rational? You can team up with them in some instances, e.g. the No Kings rallies, but it's important to remember exactly what they represent in others.

This discussion started when I mentioned Tim Miller, host of The Bulwark Podcast, and a 'never Trumper'. Here is what he says about himself:
Former Republican says IT'S OVER (David Pakman Show on YouTube, April 26, 2026 –23:24 min.)
11:23-->
Miller: Me personally, I've just kind of embraced the fact that I'm a like a liberal in this small sense, like, and that in a certain world, like, would have put me on the center right, and I think this, these days, kind of puts me on the center left, right? And I think that the way that things have changed that's
Pakman: Especially conceived as you are not authoritarian and this current MAGA movement is extremely authoritarian and like small L liberal quite literally places you opposed to that.
Miller: Opposite, yeah, in direct opposition to them, you know.
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I think he's honest about this. I also think that he voted for Harris/Walz/(Cheney) in 2024. I think Pakman did, too! (and took money from AIPAC.)
But where are the 'never Cheney' Democrats? There are far too few of them, but their number is growing.
 
Brainster said:
Not interested in any of the pop-off valve parties. We can choose a red car or a blue car; there are no other real choices. For now I am a Democrat.
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Of course, 'we' have other real choices! For now, I ride a motorcycle when I don't ride a bicycle, walk or take the Metro.
Anyway, we know that you'll choose the red car again in Nov '26 and '28.
 
dann said:
No, she shouldn't, obviously, but if she considers doing so, she isn't a 'never abuser', is she?
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You missed who was who on that analogy
dann said:
What is smart to do depends on what their actual state of mind is, but you seem to be unwilling to distinguish between them.
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Welp, I'm not a mind reader, so I can only go with the evidence at hand. That would be the totality of their words and actions.
dann said:
They are all them to you even though there are obvious differences between them.
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No, I'm not playing that game with you. The whole point of Trumpism/MAGA/conservatism is putting down those "others".
dann said:
There is more than one kind of 'never Trumper'.
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I prefer the ones that shut up and get to work on the 50 years of damage the republican party has done.

dann said:
It's not as if Biden/Harris voters can't be blamed for what they did.
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voting for the alternative?
dann said:
I doubt that most of them got what they thought they voted for,
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Considering how the Democrats lost, that is a safe assumption
dann said:
and yet it won't surprise me if they'll do the same thing again.
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Its an unfortunate result of a 2 party system.
dann said:
Many of them no doubt will:

Some Biden/Harris voters are aware that they didn't get what they expected to get from them (in the case of Harris, in spite of her teaming up with the Cheneys!), some of them will defend their vote as being for the least bad alternative and be willing to do it again for the same reason, and some have shifted to progressives like AOC and Sanders.
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Those aren't exclusive. I'm going to vote for whoever is the top of the Democratic ticket, except for Rahm Emmanuel. That doesn't mean I don't want a more progressive ticket.
dann said:
They are as different in sentiments and intentions as never 'Trumpers' are.
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...and...?
dann said:
Yes, there are some of those, but does it make you feel better to treat them as if they're all the same, "◊◊◊◊ them all," because you're angry, instead of being rational?
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Anger is perfectly rational. So is distrust of someone who deserves to be distrusted.
dann said:
You can team up with them in some instances, e.g. the No Kings rallies, but it's important to remember exactly what they represent in others.
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No, they can shut up and do what they are told.
dann said:
This discussion started when I mentioned Tim Miller, host of The Bulwark Podcast, and a 'never Trumper'. Here is what he says about himself:

I think he's honest about this. I also think that he voted for Harris/Walz/(Cheney) in 2024. I think Pakman did, too! (and took money from AIPAC.)
But where are the 'never Cheney' Democrats? There are far too few of them, but their number is growing.
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You want to know who there are too few of? Never Trump Republicans. They make no difference at all in terms of numbers or influence outside of centrist circle jerks. They get far outsized attention and say from the media and Democrats.
 
I'm reading about AI and how they train themselves by reading everything. They are likely to have some MAGA views. So the programners go through a fine tuning process and apply some rules. The AI comes out liberal.

Can we do that with Trump voters?
 
Tero said:
I'm reading about AI and how they train themselves by reading everything. They are likely to have some MAGA views. So the programners go through a fine tuning process and apply some rules. The AI comes out liberal.

Can we do that with Trump voters?
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Forced re-education programs? That doesn't sound frighteningly authoritarian at all...
 
Emily's Cat said:
Doesn't it give you even a moment's pause that you end up advocating for the very things you say you oppose?
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I'm not sure it ever came out what I oppose or support. I oppose certain things that can be manipulated in my direction just by funding. The MAGA voters would not fund what I would fund. They think all off tax spending is ripping them off.
 
Barney Frank hits the nail on the head:

Frank: "That it is essential for the values that have driven me into politics to defeat right-wing populism, and that the major obstacle to doing that is the insistence by part of the left wing of pushing everybody to adopt politically unacceptable views. I'm not telling people I don't want them to advocate for those things — I filed a bill to legalize marijuana in 1972 and I didn't think it was going to go anywhere. My problem is that instead of treating some of these reforms as issues which are currently unpopular — for which you have to build support — they instantly make them litmus tests for everybody and therefore make it harder for us to win."
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Specific issues:

Frank: "Open borders is one. Defunding the police would be another, along with insistence on political correctness and transgender participation in girls' sports. And environmental issues like the Green New Deal — they just go too far."
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utter self-serving BS gaslighting.

there never was any attempt to create "open borders" or "defund the police".

There were efforts to reform Immigration and Law Enforcement, both things that cost homogenous amounts of money and do not deliver on their missions, instead causing massive harm to innocent people.

Frank is just lying because he has to keep his donors happy and doesn't want to get burned in effigy along with the rest.


You should never take anyone seriously who pretends to agree with you in principle, but can't support you because you didn't ask nicely enough.
Obviously he was never going to support you no matter what, and you have to be an idiot to think otherwise.
 
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