So what form does the resistance take?

[wareyin]

<snipped>

I wasn't pointing out your rabidly anti-trans position or pro poll tax positions, etc so that you could rant about them again, I was pointing out that they are in no way progressive, left of center, centrist, or even slightly right positions. You hold far right positions, and post them daily on this forum, but then still try to pretend that you're a centrist despite that being transparent nonsense.

 

[bruto]

That's a good point.

Looking back on this and amplifying it a bit, though much of the protest we're seeing seems performative and lacking substance, one of the more important things that's happening, and I think that is influencing public opinion, is that very fact. The bulk of protesters are visibly, conspicuously, and purposely, not doing much! By concentrating on observation and aid, rather than violence and inflammatory acts, they make it clear that the violence and escalation we see are done by ICE. Whatever your opinion of people's motives or of what is right and wrong, this has been a pretty successful bit of public relations. Eventually if you flood the media with images of ICEmen smashing into citizens' houses, threatening violence to protestors, and murdering even a small few, even people who favor a certain amount of tyranny and bias, as well as those who have just become inured to it, start getting upset.

 

[I Am The Scum]

I wasn't pointing out your rabidly anti-trans position or pro poll tax positions, etc so that you could rant about them again, I was pointing out that they are in no way progressive, left of center, centrist, or even slightly right positions. You hold far right positions, and post them daily on this forum, but then still try to pretend that you're a centrist despite that being transparent nonsense.

Oh, so I guess everyone with a swastika tattoo is a nazi in the eyes of the far left, huh?

 

[wareyin]

Oh, so I guess everyone with a swastika tattoo is a nazi in the eyes of the far left, huh?

I notice that since the group chat where all those Republicans talked about loving Hitler, we aren't hearing from the far right "centrists" about how bad/dehumanizing/wrong it is when we call them nazis anymore. Oddly enough, none of those far right "centrist" pearl clutchers ever admitted that maybe, just maybe, calling self described nazis as such is not wrong. Things that make you go hmmm

 

[Resume]

I notice that since the group chat where all those Republicans talked about loving Hitler, we aren't hearing from the far right "centrists" about how bad/dehumanizing/wrong it is when we call them nazis anymore. Oddly enough, none of those far right "centrist" pearl clutchers ever admitted that maybe, just maybe, calling self described nazis as such is not wrong. Things that make you go hmmm

I guess you're not allowed to call nazis nazis until they are finished with their nazism. You know, like at Nuremburg.

 

[Steve]

Oh, so I guess everyone with a swastika tattoo is a nazi in the eyes of the far left, huh?

Any person with a swastika tattoo very likely is a Nazi. Or at least a sympathizer with the tenets of Naziism. It's not too much of a stretch to think so, regardless of one's political leanings.

 

[Andy_Ross]

Oh, so I guess everyone with a swastika tattoo is a nazi in the eyes of the far left, huh?

You build one concentration camp ...

 

[P.J. Denyer]

You build one concentration camp ...

You're not allowed to call them that. It's the Alligator Alcatraz Extremely Focused Camp.

 

[autumn1971]

Fair, I guess. I'm a bit fed up with toothless performative virtue too. I would just prefer that people quit the revolutionary rhetoric... because realistically if they get on with the ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ revolution, a whole lot people people are going to end up dead. And rationality leads me to conclude that a whole lot of the revolutionaries are the ones who will end up dead, not the rest of us. Despite media portrayals and narrative manipulation, the revolutionaries are quite the minority.

We’re not a minority compared to ICE.
If they want to turn an American city into Fallujah we’ll give them 10,000 Fallujahs
Then the fascist ◊◊◊◊◊ will be a small and dead minority

 

[plague311]

I'm shocked that the righties and ICE are having morale issues. What did they expect? Did they think they'd get to brutalize people and no one would care because they were only doing it to immigrants? Yes, I know that's how some of them thought, but the lifers? The agents that had been there for a decade? They had to have known that this was going to go ass over tits.

 

[johnny karate]

Looking back on this and amplifying it a bit, though much of the protest we're seeing seems performative and lacking substance, one of the more important things that's happening, and I think that is influencing public opinion, is that very fact. The bulk of protesters are visibly, conspicuously, and purposely, not doing much! By concentrating on observation and aid, rather than violence and inflammatory acts, they make it clear that the violence and escalation we see are done by ICE. Whatever your opinion of people's motives or of what is right and wrong, this has been a pretty successful bit of public relations. Eventually if you flood the media with images of ICEmen smashing into citizens' houses, threatening violence to protestors, and murdering even a small few, even people who favor a certain amount of tyranny and bias, as well as those who have just become inured to it, start getting upset.

The people protesting and resisting the wildly illegal activities of ICE and CBP in Minnesota are the best and bravest of us. They are heroes who will someday be identified as such in history books.

 

[johnny karate]

No material harm or damage was done. That's a true statement.

Nah, I am mostly surrounded by you lot, and it's you lot who are busy insisting that I'm a "far right" wingnut. And not for any good reason either. You do it because I don't jump on board with your vilification of anyone who isn't progressive, I don't engage in slandering and insulting sitting politicians regardless of their party, and I think most progressive policies are poorly thought out social experiments that want to use actual people as lab rats without consent.

I am absolutely, and unabashedly, NOT PROGRESSIVE. But I'm also not far right. Except apparently to you and others like you who... seemingly... think that anyone to the right of you by even a hair is a far right nazi.

Doubling down on the ridiculous far right lie in the first sentence of this post seems kind of far right.

 

[Resume]

Doubling down on the ridiculous far right lie in the first sentence of this post seems like kind of far right.

Smashing windows and doors, smearing walls with ◊◊◊◊, damaging artwork and furniture to the amount of at least $3 millions, which we footed, isn't material damage to a <snicker> centrist, I guess.

 

[johnny karate]

I'm shocked that the righties and ICE are having morale issues. What did they expect? Did they think they'd get to brutalize people and no one would care because they were only doing it to immigrants? Yes, I know that's how some of them thought, but the lifers? The agents that had been there for a decade? They had to have known that this was going to go ass over tits.

What is happening in Minnesota is a refutation of the MAGA world view. They genuinely think that everyone is as cruel and heartless as they are and are shocked to find out that most people have the empathy and courage they lack.

 

[Safe-Keeper]

Doubling down on the ridiculous far right lie in the first sentence of this post seems kind of far right.

'Oh, and I admit the Kristallnacht was pretty wild, but no material damage was done!'

ETA: Now that I look closer at it, I'm curious about the context of that photo. He seems to be standing in front of an Allied APC, and I think he's wearing a US uniform? Is he making the salute with a captured German helmet as a joke? In that case, I feel slightly bad about using this particular photo. Hope he doesn't see this post.

 

[johnny karate]

Smashing windows and doors, smearing walls with ◊◊◊◊, damaging artwork and furniture to the amount of at least $3 millions, which we footed, isn't material damage to a <snicker> centrist, I guess.

And committing over 1,000 assaults against law enforcement with flagpoles, pipes, batons, bear spray, etc. isn't "harm".

 

[P.J. Denyer]

The people protesting and resisting the wildly illegal activities of ICE and CBP in Minnesota are the best and bravest of us. They are heroes who will someday be identified as such in history books.

Luckily the government is compiling a database of these these people who will never have to pay for their own beer again.

 

[Emily's Cat]

I guess EC and I watched different news coverage back then, but the armed mobs breaking into the Capitol, vandalizing offices and trhreatening death to their enemies were not what I would call "wandering." I guess we also read different reports on the aftermath, as government agencies at the time set the basic property damage expense at about one and a half million dollars.

But no doubt there's a bothsides argument to be had. The representatives huddled in their chambers were probably wasting paper and using too many pencils.

Versus 1,000 times that during the Floyd riots... which were, as we all recall, described as "mostly peaceful".

George Floyd protests - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

arson, vandalism, and looting that occurred between May 26 and June 8 caused approximately $1–2 billion in insured damages nationally

Multiple police officers were shot or attacked during the protests. Four officers were shot in St. Louis after facing violent protesters who had been looting and vandalising local businesses. In Las Vegas, a policer officer was shot in the head at Circus Circus Hotel and Casino whilst they were fighting a suspect. Law enforcement officers were also injured by vehicles in Denver and New York City and hit by projectiles elsewhere in the U.S.A. In New York City, nearly 400 officers were injured following two weeks of protesting. Injuries resulted from being hit by moving vehicles and being hit in the head with objects such as bricks and bottles. In one incident in Los Angeles, two officers were shot whilst sitting in their patrol car and protesters blocked the responding ambulance from entering the hospital whilst shouting "we hope they die".

 

[Emily's Cat]

If there was no material harm or damage, why did the building have to be repaired to the tune of $3 million, with an additional $27 million to upgrade security?

Many of your positions are defensible, even if people to your political left don't agree with them. But this one smacks of outright denial.

It's not denial, it's evaluation of actual physical damage done, as opposed to the cost of the repairs. That's where the term "material" comes into play. There was damage, certainly. And the materials used in the capitol are very expensive materials, so repair costs would be expected to be high. But nothing actually structural was damaged, it wasn't set on fire, etc.

If someone breaks into a house by breaking a single window pane in a door, and then steals only a single TV, I would say that's not material property damage, and not material loss. But that doesn't mean that the losses are necessarily of the same economic value. If one house is a small one-bedroom in a rural area with a 27" CRT TV the value of the loss is going to be much, much lower than if the house is a 20 bedroom mansion made of marble with bespoke leaded glass panes and a wall-sized state-of-the art TV. But in both cases, the magnitude of the damage caused by the break in, and the property loss relative to all properties at risk is fairly small.

 

[Emily's Cat]

I wasn't pointing out your rabidly anti-trans position or pro poll tax positions, etc so that you could rant about them again, I was pointing out that they are in no way progressive, left of center, centrist, or even slightly right positions. You hold far right positions, and post them daily on this forum, but then still try to pretend that you're a centrist despite that being transparent nonsense.

How many times do I have to tell you that I am unambiguously NOT PROGRESSIVE?

I'm not anti-trans. I'm opposed to males being given legal right to violate female boundaries. You, on the other hand, seem to strongly desire giving males the right to override female consent. Why is that?

Pro poll tax? What are you even on about? There was a time ages ago when I briefly considered poll taxes to be the most equal means of taxation - and it is. But it's also unworkable and inefficient, and I've supported modern tax structures for ages. Hell, I believe I even proposed a scaled sales tax scheme that would make all basic necessities up to a certain per-person level completely tax free, including clothing and homes, thus eliminating property taxes on small single-family homes and making property taxes on huge mcmansions and larger much, much higher than they currently are.

I don't hold far right positions. You LABELING me doesn't make your LABELS true.

Take this from a different perspective. Without any individual person in mind, provide a list of policy views that you think are far right views.