Trump's promised ICE raids have begun

Grizzly Bear said:
The failure of most in this discussion is that the incident is being argued based on emotion rather than the legal standard pr established facts of the case.

Let me guess... here ICE is seen as a rogue entity that isn't qualified as a legitimate division of law enforcement? It would seem that way if you you have party leadership constantly replacing the word "illegal" with "undocumented" to reference immigrants that donnot have a valid status, and when they constantly refer to immigration enforceras gestapos and neo nazis bent on public executions.

When you think from that state of mind it makes sense why impeding law enforcement, evading detainment, and assault with a deadly weapon (the vehicle) are downplayed as they are. Screw the legal standard in that case.
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Grizzly Bear said:
We could probably also benefit from people refraining from jokes about ICE performing summary executions while summarily dismissing the objective legal questions that would help people understand the case better. But I know that's a pipe dream.
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Or we could resist fascists like you and your ilk with any available force
 
ICE is targeting off duty police officers due to the color of their skin. Pulling them over, demanding proof of cirizenship.
Brooklyn Park Police Chief Mark Bruley: "The last 2 weeks we as a law enforcement community have been receiving endless complaints about civil rights violations in our streets from US citizens. What we're hearing is they're being stopped in traffic stops or on the street with no cause and being demanded to show paperwork to determine if they are here legally. We started hearing from our police officers the same complaints as they fell victim to this while off duty. Every one of these individuals is a person of color ... it has to stop"
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https://twitter.com/x/status/2013664998908739946
 
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Beelzebuddy said:
Yes, I understood what you meant. And I think you understand what I meant. It'll be on future historians to pinpoint exactly when the US government broke free of its own rule of law*, but we're clearly past it now. Telling each other "they can't do that it's illegal" unfortunately doesn't mean anything is going to stop it happening.

*I'd theorize it happened in 2008 with the "too big to fail" bailout. Different crisis, different actors, but it cemented the notion that rules don't matter if there are no consequences for breaking them.
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I reckon it was Iran Contra when all the "checks and balances" failed to stop every member of the Reagan regime from committing treason by working with and selling weapons to Iran.
 
Donald J. Trump
@realDonald Trump
The Department of Homeland Security and ICE must start talking about the murderers and other criminals that they are capturing and taking out of the system. They are saving many innocent lives! There are thousands of vicious animals in Minnesota alone, which is why the crime stats are, Nationwide, the BEST EVER RECORDED! Show the Numbers, Names, and Faces of the violent criminals, and show them NOW. The people will start supporting the Patriots of ICE, instead of the highly paid troublemakers, anarchists, and agitators! MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN
 
JayUtah said:
Yes, you and I are on the same page. But many Americans don't know how their government actually works. Consequently they're taken in by the false notion that the federal government has plenipotentiary authority. A number of people in the U.S. will be quite willing to endorse harsh retribution against Minnesota officials on the pretext that they disobeyed a lawful order to "stand down" and "surrender." Trump regime officials absolutely count on this ignorance to maintain public support. Hence there has to be a countervailing narrative, even if it seems rote and pedantic.
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Oddly, I don't recall a similar attitude when there was a confrontation between federal and state authorities at the border in Texas a couple years back. I guess Federal authority only trumps (pun intended) state's rights when it's (eta, *not*) Democrats in charge of the Feds.
 
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Gulliver Foyle said:
I reckon it was Iran Contra when all the "checks and balances" failed to stop every member of the Reagan regime from committing treason by working with and selling weapons to Iran.
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Even earlier, the pardon of Richard Nixon signaled that a President could commit crimes with impunity and get away with it. I think if he had gone to prison, this would be a very different world today.
 
Reformed Offlian said:
Oddly, I don't recall a similar attitude when there was a confrontation between federal and state authorities at the border in Texas a couple years back. I guess Federal authority only trumps (pun intended) state's rights when it's Democrats in charge of the Feds.
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Yes, the motives here are transparently political. There is a doctrine that flows from the 5th, 10th, and 14th amendments that requires the federal government to treat states equally. Thus singling out Minnesota and other Democrat-run states for aggressive immigration enforcement because of their politics (thanks, Sec. Noem, for saying that quiet part loud!) rather than the prevalence of or threat posed by its immigrants is ultimately actionable. But it probably will not be acted upon, as I'm sure the Supreme Court will cobble up a new court-invented doctrine to undermine it.
 
Andy_Ross said:
Donald J. Trump
@realDonald Trump
The Department of Homeland Security and ICE must start talking about the murderers and other criminals that they are capturing and taking out of the system. They are saving many innocent lives! There are thousands of vicious animals in Minnesota alone, which is why the crime stats are, Nationwide, the BEST EVER RECORDED! Show the Numbers, Names, and Faces of the violent criminals, and show them NOW. The people will start supporting the Patriots of ICE, instead of the highly paid troublemakers, anarchists, and agitators! MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN
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Thousands of vicious animals? Are there that many iceholes in Minnesota?
 
Andy_Ross said:
Donald J. Trump
@realDonald Trump
The Department of Homeland Security and ICE must start talking about the murderers and other criminals that they are capturing and taking out of the system. They are saving many innocent lives! There are thousands of vicious animals in Minnesota alone, which is why the crime stats are, Nationwide, the BEST EVER RECORDED! Show the Numbers, Names, and Faces of the violent criminals, and show them NOW.
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Minneapolis did that. They released the statistics showing that half the murders in the relevant week were committed by ICE.

But of course you can't release statistics for murders not committed because someone was detained and deported without committing those murders. The President's logic is impeccabl...y bad.
 
Andy_Ross said:
Trump says he feels horribly about Renee Good before mentioning her father was a Trump fan: Her father was a tremendous Trump fan. He was all for Trump, loved Trump. And, you know, it's terrible. I was told that a lot of people, they said, oh, he loves you. I hope he still feels that way

https://twitter.com/x/status/2013695710294925667
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STFU you deranged malignant narcissist.
 
Andy_Ross said:
Trump says he feels horribly about Renee Good before mentioning her father was a Trump fan: Her father was a tremendous Trump fan. He was all for Trump, loved Trump. And, you know, it's terrible. I was told that a lot of people, they said, oh, he loves you. I hope he still feels that way

https://twitter.com/x/status/2013695710294925667
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Oh, I'm sure he will once he's heard about how you made his daughter's murder about fluffing your ego. That always goes down well.
 
Gulliver Foyle said:
I reckon it was Iran Contra when all the "checks and balances" failed to stop every member of the Reagan regime from committing treason by working with and selling weapons to Iran.
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Selling weapons to Iran (via Israel!) is the lesser issue what about the drug smuggling in to the US?

CIA involvement in Contra cocaine trafficking - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
let alone funding Epstein
www.bunkhistory.org

Epstein, Israel, and the CIA: How The Iran–Contra Planes Landed at Les Wexner’s Base

Jeffrey Epstein helped Leslie Wexner repurpose the CIA’s Iran–Contra planes from arms smuggling to shipping lingerie.
www.bunkhistory.org www.bunkhistory.org
 
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