It's hard to say that's good news when it's the result of things so long, drawn out, reprehensible, and should never have happened in the first place.
Largest ever miscarriage of justice?
- Thread starter Garrison
- Start date
Carrot Flower King
Janitor of Lunacy
Beeb is reporting that the CPS is considering charges of corporate manslaughter over deaths of post masters caught up in the Horizon bollocks.
Watch this space, as this is going to get very interesting.
Watch this space, as this is going to get very interesting.
Carrot Flower King
Janitor of Lunacy
Sorry, it isn't the CPS but the police.
smartcooky
Penultimate Amazing
Good. They can start with the Vennels woman. Also, go after former Post Office General Counsel, Jane MacLeod, who fled to Australia to avoid consequences. A criminal charge of corporate manslaughter will open the door to extradition to face those charges.
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You have zero chance of getting the lawyer, they were doing their job as a lawyer advising their client, do you think that a legal system run by lawyers would ever allow a lawyer to be prosecuted because of the crimes of their client?
To be clear, I am not arguing about the morality, just the practicality.
They were an employee of the post office, not a retained solicitor, which means their liability is tied into their employer's liability. Not of course that will make any difference and sadly I have to agree with your conclusion.
smartcooky
Penultimate Amazing
When a lawyer is a participant in a criminal conspiracy with their client, that pierces the lawyer/client privilege - the shield they have from prosecution evaporates. This is called the "Crime-Fraud Exception to Privilege"... Legal professional privilege (LPP) does not apply to communications made to further an ongoing or future crime or fraud. Lawyers are not permitted to advise clients to engage in illegal conduct, nor can they assist clients in violating the law. This includes avoiding misleading the court or being complicit in a client's acts or omissions.
Trebuchet
Penultimate Amazing
Inspired by the bumping of this thread, I just started watching Mr Bates vs the Post Office on Prime. Only 30 min but it looks good, I'll continue watching as I do my morning pedaling.
I hope you don't need to watch your blood pressure, @Trebuchet , because it's really not good for that.
smartcooky
Penultimate Amazing
It will probably infuriate you.
Filippo Lippi
Philosopher
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Breaking - Channel 4 are reporting show a contract (?) between the Post Office and Fujitsu showing that both knew that the Horizon system was error prone and that the system could be changed remotely. It is dated while, and before, postmasters were being prosecuted.
Filippo Lippi
Philosopher
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Heads of Fujitsu and Post Office up before a Commons' select committee on 6th Jan
I'm not too surprised that it was known. I was at a Christmas lunch with some ex-colleagues last week, all working in IT, and one of them mentioned that the problems were known by the programming team quite early; the errors were very rare, but the vast number of daily transactions meant that the effects mounted up. My source wasn't in the team, but had heard from someone who was. Given that we're in the Thames Valley, it's quite believable that they heard this (I used to work in what is now the Fujitsu headquarters, though I left well before Horizon development started).
I believe it's fairly truthful overall, although the one part of the programme I have any knowledge of is Fujitsu HQ, which is shown as a modern, almost futuristic, building, with lots of shiny glass. In fact it's a late 60s brutalist concrete tower.
Fujitsu Building: My Favourite Bracknell Buildings
The Fujitsu building in Bracknell’s Southern Industrial Area doesn’t exactly scream innovation. I’ve talked before about Bracknell being a town of four-walled concrete buildings. Brutalist pedigree…
bracknellblogger.wordpress.com
BBC article confirming this:
Post Office had deal with Fujitsu to fix Horizon errors 19 years ago
The emergence of a document contradicts claims made by the Post Office over bugs in its IT system during criminal prosecutions.
www.bbc.co.uk
Andy_Ross
Penultimate Amazing
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Nigel says it's Starmer's fault.
Nigel Farage MP
@Nigel_Farage
The Horizon scandal is getting worse for Keir Starmer as it emerges that at least 27 cases against subpostmasters were brought by the CPS.
As the scandal grew, and hundreds of innocent people were convicted, he did nothing. Time for some answers
Nigel Farage MP
@Nigel_Farage
The Horizon scandal is getting worse for Keir Starmer as it emerges that at least 27 cases against subpostmasters were brought by the CPS.
As the scandal grew, and hundreds of innocent people were convicted, he did nothing. Time for some answers
And the answer is that since both the Post Office and Fujitsu lied consistently and presented false evidence.
malbui
Beauf
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- 4,675
Maybe I've spent too much time back in France over recent years but I'm itching to see heads on spikes.