Transwomen are not Women - Part 15

[Thermal]

Because you claimed that she never suffered from gender dysphoria.

Black claimed the trans journey was a positive experience, not me.

Then again, we haven't definitively proven that he didn't shoot JFK, so a presidential assassin shouldn't be taken at his word?

 

[Emily's Cat]

I've explained it repeatedly. They should be able to go to the places that align with their gender, just like everybody else.

And before you drolly say "they can go where their sex matches, just like everybody else ", yeah no ◊◊◊◊, that's what the thread has been about for ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ years. And that's what makes it disingenuous; you know that damn right well.

Thermal, you complain that we keep treating you as if you're a trans privilege activist, and we're not giving you enough credit for you agreeing with most of our positions.

This is why. You just wrote that people who self-proclaim themselves to be trans should be able to go to places that align with their gender.

This quite literally means that males who claim to have an inner essence of womanliness should get to use female showers, changing rooms, shelters, and sports among other things. This is the absolute direct opposite of what you keep saying you actually believe. You cannot rationally believe both things at the same time, as they are antithetical positions.

 

[Thermal]

And who purportedly told a Tish Hyman that "most women like to see dick" when Hyman objected to the presence of a fully intact male in the female gym showers watching her bathe without consent.

Hymab purportedly physically assaulted Black in a previous altercation.

Are we only taking Hymens word (or anyone's but Black's) as credible?

 

[Emily's Cat]

Pretty sure he beat his wife, are we? The police don't think so. Only a conservative tabloid asserts so, with zero evidence.

I mean, here we've got a male who doesn't even remotely enter the vicinity of passing, who ogled a female in the female showers... but don't worry, you've got that male's back. That male hasn't done anything wrong, they're a petite delicate flower... unlike the evil bigoted female who you've speculated made the entire situation up or perhaps intentionally staged the incident just to be a bitch.

Tell us again how you oppose males having access to female single-sex spaces (except bathrooms)?

 

[Emily's Cat]

In rare candor, you do freely acknowledge that you don't want sex segregation, you openly want sex discrimination.

For ◊◊◊◊'s holy sake, we want to retain sex-discrimination in intimate areas and in sports and in situations where sex actually ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ matters.

 

[Thermal]

This is why. You just wrote that people who self-proclaim themselves to be trans should be able to go to places that align with their gender.

Read harder (and I already addressed this directly): they should be able to. Whether or not that is practical.or do-able is another matter.

 

[Emily's Cat]

The primary definition of discrimination, and the sense it's used in this discussion, is "the unjust and prejudicial treatment of different categories of people". That's what the ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ word is understood to mean, especially in a discussion where sex discrimination laws are frequently discussed.

If you want to use a secondary definition to play word games and try to conflate meanings, knock yourself out. I'm done.

For someone who goes on and on about different meanings of words, it seems like you should be able to cotton on to the usage in this context as being the act of making or perceiving a difference : the act of discriminating

 

[smartcooky]

Having trouble reading yet again? The sources all cite the same story, which is being laughed at for not providing any evidence, and its facts are contradicted by the actual Ohio correctional records.

Where do you see Freeman serving this one year stretch?

They quoted official government documents.
If those quotes are faked, that's a whole shipload of trouble for the journalist concerned.

If the NYP report was false, Black would have refuted it... he hasn't.

If the NYP report was false, Hamilton County's Court Clerk's office would have refuted it... they haven't.

 

[smartcooky]

I do, and sympathize greatly. I don't want women to feel unsafe, nor do I want to ◊◊◊◊ on transpeople. That's why I'm looking for Option 3.

There is no option 3

 

[d4m10n]

Black claimed the trans journey was a positive experience, not me.

Anyone who finds dysphoria to be deeply unpleasant—which it is more-or-less by definition—will find the easing of dysphoria to be a positive experience.

Then again, we haven't definitively proven that he didn't shoot JFK

Whenever someone brings up crime (especially serious crimes against persons) it tends to prime us to think in terms of criminal law. I don't think we need anything like proof beyond reasonable doubt to evaluate your claim that Ms. Black never suffered from any mental illnesses, though. She is (or perhaps was) on a treatment regime designed to treat a specific mental illness; we can draw the obvious conclusions.

 

[theprestige]

I do, and sympathize greatly. I don't want women to feel unsafe, nor do I want to ◊◊◊◊ on transpeople. That's why I'm looking for Option 3.

There is no option 3

There absolutely is an option 3: Transwomen are people, and should be treated with all the dignity and respect due to people, but they're not female.

The only person who thinks there is no option 3 is Thermal, who reclassifies any such option as ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ on transpeople.

 

[Emily's Cat]

I do, and sympathize greatly. I don't want women to feel unsafe, nor do I want to ◊◊◊◊ on transpeople. That's why I'm looking for Option 3.

Option 3 that doesn't require males to have to be partially nude in front of gender-non-conforming males? Protect the males from the dolls?

I dunno, I mean... how about males stop being ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ to males that don't conform to male stereotypes? Is that too much to ask for?

 

[Emily's Cat]

Read harder (and I already addressed this directly): they should be able to. Whether or not that is practical.or do-able is another matter.

From this I take that your actual belief, the principle that underlies your positions, is that males who profess female feelings in their souls should be allowed to use female single sex spaces.

That would imply that your prior statements that you think this shouldn't be allowed where nudity is expected was a false statement?

 

[Emily's Cat]

@Thermal - You previously claimed that you support retaining sex-separated facilities where nudity is expected. Furthermore, you asserted that even though we support that same policy, your reasons for supporting them are good reasons, and our reasons for supporting them are bad reasons.

What are your reasons for supporting sex-separation policies?
What do you believe our reasons are?

 

[Thermal]

I mean, here we've got a male who doesn't even remotely enter the vicinity of passing,

I dont think it's his job to comply with your personal stsndards of femininity.

who ogled a female in the female showers...

Unevidenced. Only claimed by the woman who screamed profanities in the gym so disturbingly that her membership was revoked.

but don't worry, you've got that male's back. That male hasn't done anything wrong, they're a petite delicate flower...

Disagreed, but ivr been arguing with enough voices in others' heads lately and am bored with it.

unlike the evil bigoted female who you've speculated made the entire situation up or perhaps intentionally staged the incident just to be a bitch.

Please don't lie. I said she knew what she was walking into, and walked in anyway. You can't buy a ticket for a XXX movie then stand cursing up a streak in the lobby, claiming you didn't know you would bd shown sexual content..

Tell us again how you oppose males having access to female single-sex spaces (except bathrooms)?

OK. I oppose males having access to female single-sex spaces. But including restrooms, unless the occupants have no objection (as I have no objection to women in thr men's room).

 

[Thermal]

From this I take that your actual belief, the principle that underlies your positions, is that males who profess female feelings in their souls should be allowed to use female single sex spaces.

I don't know what it means to be s male that professes to have female feelings in their souls. Another topic for another thread, perhaps in R&P?

That would imply that your prior statements that you think this shouldn't be allowed where nudity is expected was a false statement?

It implies nothing of the kind to anyone north of like a 5th grade reading level.

 

[Ziggurat]

I dont think it's his job to comply with your personal stsndards of femininity.

Indeed, it isn't. It's also not his job as a male to invade female spaces and make the females there uncomfortable. But he did it anyways.

Males who pass (and they do so by appearing biologically female, not by appearing "feminine") don't make women uncomfortable by their mere presence in those spaces. Men who do not pass often do make women uncomfortable by their mere presence. If you (the hypothetical you, not you personally) don't want to make women uncomfortable by your presence, then yeah, it actually is your job to pass. Saying it's not is an acknowledgement that Grant Freeman and a lot of other trans identifying males don't care about not making women uncomfortable.

 

[Ziggurat]

Of course it would. Broke ass Freeman against the Post's army of lawyers who will drag it out for years, hiding behind source confidentiality, and possibly being made to print a correction/retraction on their back page some day.

Lawyers take easy cases on contingency all the time, and this would be an easy case if they were actually lying. So the fact that he's broke isn't actually an impediment. And source confidentiality? There's no source confidentiality here. They're claiming the contents of court documents. For a case that he himself was involved in. That's VERY easy to produce in court. There's nothing for them to hide behind. And as I said already, this would defamation pro se, so we're talking actual monetary damages, not just a retraction.

You know what is an impediment to him winning such a case, or even a lawyer taking such a case? If the story is true.

Also, do you have a direct line to Freeman or his attorneys? Do you know if he hasn't settled the matter with them for a quickie check and a NDA?

If there was a retraction of the story, I could believe that maybe the matter was settled confidentially. But there's no retraction. Which is a pretty damn good indicator that there's no settlement. You're not going to get a settlement without a retraction, that's the easiest part of the whole thing.

This would be easy to prove: the claim is that these are public court records. Why are they not simply posted? Surprise, surprise, because they don't exist.

Or because they don't actually post all court records online. A lot of public records you can only obtain copies of if you pay to have the records reproduced.

Ohio provides an inmate search database. Why isn't Freeman's alleged one year stretch recorded?

Offender Search

"This site displays data on those offenders who are currently incarcerated in an Ohio prison, currently under Department supervision, or judicially released."
Their search database doesn't list past inmates/parolees, only current ones. And he's not a current inmate/parolee.

 

[Ziggurat]

They [trans-identifying males] should be able to go to the places that align with their gender, just like everybody else.

I oppose males having access to female single-sex spaces.

I cannot reconcile these two statements. They contradict each other.

 

[Thermal]

@Thermal - You previously claimed that you support retaining sex-separated facilities where nudity is expected.

I did not.

Furthermore, you asserted that even though we support that same policy, your reasons for supporting them are good reasons, and our reasons for supporting them are bad reasons.

I did not.

What are your reasons for supporting sex-separation policies?

The same as I have indicated for the past year (note that you ask a different question than above).

What do you believe our reasons are?

The same as you've indicated for the past year.

And as I have responded repeatedly, you don't get to demand I answer your questions when you don't show the courtesy to do the same.

"What questions?" she wails. The same ones that have been popping up on your alerts that you ignore. You're asking me to Rinse and Repeat for your personal Fringe Reset, and the answer remains NO.