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Does 'rape culture' accurately describe (many) societies?

Lithrael said:
I don't think he'd disagree. The mood in that part of the article is that young people are tired of the tiktoks etc shoving jiggly things in their faces whether they want it or not. Almost everyone in this thread has not only agreed but lamented that algorithmically shoveling things at people in the hope of farming engagement........
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Ignoring the fact that you are wrong, why are Art, Darat, Helen, The Common Potato and acbytesla wrong? - they do not think porn is stumbled upon (certainly not easily, anyway (they will CMIIW)).
 
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Oh, when I was a kid, I stuimbled on porn; or rather, boys of my age, and a little older, showed me very explicit porn mags. No idea where they found them - there was an urban myth about stashes of porn in mysterious woods, but my bet is they filched them from older brothers or dads - but find them and show them they did. And in my teens, there were films at parties from time to time. I didn't really enjoy any of it, but each to their own (the written form was my thing as i've said before). It certainly didn't harm me. I've quite enjoyed the real thing.
 
Helen said:
Oh, when I was a kid, I stuimbled on porn; or rather, boys of my age, and a little older, showed me very explicit porn mags. No idea where they found them - there was an urban myth about stashes of porn in mysterious woods, but my bet is they filched them from older brothers or dads - but find them and show them they did. And in my teens, there were films at parties from time to time. I didn't really enjoy any of it, but each to their own (the written form was my thing as i've said before). It certainly didn't harm me. I've quite enjoyed the real thing.
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A reply to your previous:
Helen said:
.......
I don't watch porn. I am a feminist.
.......
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would help since you appear to link the two statements.
 
Helen said:
Oh, the youth of yesteryear had every bit as much access to the real thing, and depictions/descriptions thereof, as the youth of today have to internet porn, if not more And no, I don't think it's the really troubling thing about the access to media kids have today. Nor do I think you have proved anything, except the fact that you and some othe people are troubled by it, but that no one, except for you, are calling for a ban on all porn.

I don't watch porn. I am a feminist. Thank you for your attention to this matter.
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I would argue that watching porn has no relationship to being or not being a feminist. Women watch porn. It's not just men. There is lots of porn that specifically cater to women. Now individually, it might not do anything for you. But even that is a generalization. You may have not found the right pornography for you. People, not women, not men, like what they like. I think it's also important to understand that our tastes change. What did it for you before is boring today. And things you couldn't imagine being interested in when you're younger now are delicious.
 
acbytesla said:
I would argue that watching porn has no relationship to being or not being a feminist. Women watch porn. It's not just men. There is lots of porn that specifically cater to women. Now individually, it might not do anything for you. But even that is a generalization. You may have not found the right pornography for you. People, not women, not men, like what they like. I think it's also important to understand that our tastes change. What did it for you before is boring today. And things you couldn't imagine being interested in when you're younger now are delicious.
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Oh i absolutely agree - it was separate statements in answer to eatlier questions from Poem. These days, there are feminists making feminist porn, and porn for women (not necessarily the same thing). Not all feminists are the same, despite what the manosphere thinks.
 
Helen said:
Oh i absolutely agree - it was separate statements in answer to eatlier questions from Poem. These days, there are feminists making feminist porn, and porn for women (not necessarily the same thing). Not all feminists are the same, despite what the manosphere thinks.
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I get it. (y)
 
Helen said:
Oh i absolutely agree - it was separate statements in answer to eatlier questions from Poem. These days, there are feminists making feminist porn, and porn for women (not necessarily the same thing). Not all feminists are the same, despite what the manosphere thinks.
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From someone who has never watched internet porn? You agree that you may not have found the right porn yet?

You actually want less porn (less ubiquitous were your words). If you agreed with that poster then you should be happy with more.
 
Oh dear Oden, this is dreary. I do not want less porn, I do not want more porn, I want exactly as much porn as people who want porn want, and the kinds of porn they want, as long as it is safe and consensual, and no one is exploited. Which is what i want for all other industries as well.

I want good sex ed in schools and homes, I want age restrictions on porn sites, and, even more importantly, on social media.

I do not want bans. I do not like bans. I do not think bans work. I want education, and I want children to feel that they can talk to parents, relatives, friends, teachers, whenever they are worried about anything on the internet and/or irl, without fear of being scolded, shamed, or punished.
 
Helen said:
Oh dear Oden, this is dreary. I do not want less porn, I do not want more porn, I want exactly as much porn as people who want porn want, and the kinds of porn they want,
as long as it is safe and consensual, and no one is exploited. Which is what i want for all other industries as well.
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Exactly!
Helen said:
I want good sex ed in schools and homes, I want age restrictions on porn sites, and, even more importantly, on social media.

I do not want bans. I do not like bans. I do not think bans work. I want education, and I want children to feel that they can talk to parents, relatives, friends, teachers, whenever they are worried about anything on the internet and/or irl, without fear of being scolded, shamed, or punished.
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Amen sister Freyja!

Shame, guilt, and prudish uptight, religious adults do far more harm to children than pornography ever could.
 
I could not agree more, even if I tried. Hang on a minute...

...I was right, I couldn't.

I think it's a good idea to talk to your kids about the more complex things in life, in age appropriate ways; sex and relationships, mental and physical illness, death, why we have to eat herring every time we celebrate something, and why sealed clamshell packaging is the devil's work. You know; the big stuff. Let them know that they can always talk to you, no matter what.
 
Helen said:
I could not agree more, even if I tried. Hang on a minute...

...I was right, I couldn't.

I think it's a good idea to talk to your kids about the more complex things in life, in age appropriate ways; sex and relationships, mental and physical illness, death, why we have to eat herring every time we celebrate something, and
why sealed clamshell packaging is the devil's work. You know; the big stuff. Let them know that they can always talk to you, no matter what.
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LOL!

Yes, yes and yes! Talk about everything! Especially if it makes you and or them uncomfortable. Make it real clear to your children that you love them unconditionally and it's OK for them to feel embarrassed. Everyone does about certain things. But that they should never let their embarrassment or anything prevent them from talking directly with you. You're on their side. You're not going to judge them. They're not perfect and you're not perfect. We all make mistakes. Sex and curiosity is natural and there is nothing to be ashamed about.
 
Poem said:
The conclusion that porn is ambient & algorithmically unavoidable is well supported.
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I'm unconvinced by the sources you have linked so far.

I don't think you did a very good job of parsing my post for what I actually said, by the way.

I'll give you that I was willing to entertain the idea that young people these days might end up with unwanted porn on their algorithmically driven feeds, since I personally avoid those and so don't have any personal experience, and don't care to do the work it would take to check for myself. I did mean 'jiggly things' literally, since I've had tiktok show me people twerking away in videos it served up when whatever video I followed a link to was over (with no account).

What I said everyone here agreed with is that sites that use algorithms to try to keep you on them like a casino tries to keep you in it, are bad for everybody.
 
Oh, I see plenty of jiggly things on my algorithmic feeds. I'm not on TikTok in any meaningful way so I can't speak to that, but my Instagram Reels and Facebook Stories are chock full of jiggly things. That's not porn, though.

ETA: in the interest of accuracy, it's Instagram Stories and Facebook Reels. I can never get it straight.
 
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arthwollipot said:
Oh, I see plenty of jiggly things on my algorithmic feeds. I'm not on TikTok in any meaningful way so I can't speak to that, but my Instagram Reels and Facebook Stories are chock full of jiggly things. That's not porn, though.

ETA: in the interest of accuracy, it's Instagram Stories and Facebook Reels. I can never get it straight.
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Exactly. I admittedly watch porn from time to time and I NEVER see porn suggestions or porn links being pitched at me. It just doesn't happen with Chrome, Opera or YouTube. You have to look for it to find it. Now, that wasn't true 25 years ago. But it certainly is today. But I can't say anything about TikTok, Facebook or every popular app out there that I don't use.
 
Lithrael said:
I'm unconvinced by the sources you have linked so far.

I don't think you did a very good job of parsing my post for what I actually said, by the way.

I'll give you that I was willing to entertain the idea that young people these days might end up with unwanted porn on their algorithmically driven feeds, since I personally avoid those and so don't have any personal experience, and don't care to do the work it would take to check for myself. I did mean 'jiggly things' literally, since I've had tiktok show me people twerking away in videos it served up when whatever video I followed a link to was over (with no account).

What I said everyone here agreed with is that sites that use algorithms to try to keep you on them like a casino tries to keep you in it, are bad for everybody.
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You are trying hard to disagree with me whilst not actually doing so.
 
arthwollipot said:
Oh, I see plenty of jiggly things on my algorithmic feeds. I'm not on TikTok in any meaningful way so I can't speak to that, but my Instagram Reels and Facebook Stories are chock full of jiggly things. That's not porn, though.

ETA: in the interest of accuracy, it's Instagram Stories and Facebook Reels. I can never get it straight.
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In other words your 'research' isn't reliable.
 
Helen said:
I do not want less porn, I do not want more porn, I want exactly as much porn as people who want porn want, and the kinds of porn they want, as long as it is safe and consensual, and no one is exploited. Which is what i want for all other industries as well.
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You just want it less ubiquitous though: as much as society wants but just not so in your face everywhere. Lots of barely legal, simulated violent, misogynistic, and incest porn. Essentially, rule 34 but behind a curtain please.
Helen said:
I want good sex ed in schools and homes, I want age restrictions on porn sites, and, even more importantly, on social media.

I do not want bans. I do not like bans. I do not think bans work. I want education, and I want children to feel that they can talk to parents, relatives, friends, teachers, whenever they are worried about anything on the internet and/or irl, without fear of being scolded, shamed, or punished.
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You want to ban porn for children though; if your age restriction is going to be effective, that is what you want.
Everyone here knows that age restrictions don't work.
 
Everyone here knows what happens when you click on suggestive 'jiggly things'.
 
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