Does 'rape culture' accurately describe (many) societies?

[Poem]

Does the concept of privacy mean anything to you?

Privacy to upload to a 'reputable and law-abiding site' like Pornhub?
#2,055

 

[Poem]

'Reputable and law-abiding site' Pornhub have made it easy - indeed very easy - for kids (your kid) to watch their content.

 

[Darat]

Does the concept of privacy mean anything to you?

I'm assuming the names etc. would be for checking if there is a criminal investigation involving videos on a site. USA porn videos already have a "records are held at" statement don't they?

 

[arthwollipot]

I'm assuming the names etc. would be for checking if there is a criminal investigation involving videos on a site. USA porn videos already have a "records are held at" statement don't they?

A few of them.

 

[Ivor the Engineer]

Does the concept of privacy mean anything to you?

Yes. For example, my wife and I don't upload videos of us having sex because we wish to keep that part of our lives private.

On a practical level, the name and address could be encrypted with public key cryptography. A paywall would only need to be a nominal fee as it's purpose would be to use existing infrastructure to perform age verification.

If you want people to be responsible then you have to make sure they know that they are not anonymous and can be held accountable. Similarly the platforms have to be motivated to take responsibility. I realise this is not perfect and bad actors would migrate to the dark web, but I think if all social media operated this way then it would be a better place for everyone.

 

[Poem]

Yes. For example, my wife and I don't upload videos of us having sex because we wish to keep that part of our lives private.

On a practical level, the name and address could be encrypted with public key cryptography. A paywall would only need to be a nominal fee as it's purpose would be to use existing infrastructure to perform age verification.

If you want people to be responsible then you have to make sure they know that they are not anonymous and can be held accountable. Similarly the platforms have to be motivated to take responsibility. I realise this is not perfect and bad actors would migrate to the dark web, but I think if all social media operated this way then it would be a better place for everyone.

What prevents the dissemination of porn via USB flash drives if age verification is successful?

 

[Poem]

James Baker: Programme manager at Open Rights Group (which campaigns to protect privacy online):

...there’s the risk that children will share porn using memory sticks or peer to peer file sharing sites and won’t know what they’re downloading. Or, worse, what if they go onto the dark web and expose themselves to even more harmful content?

Baker is against age verification, but this quote highlights the fact that no child needs access to the net; they can get porn from a flash drive if necessary.

 

[Darat]

James Baker: Programme manager at Open Rights Group (which campaigns to protect privacy online):

...there’s the risk that children will share porn using memory sticks or peer to peer file sharing sites and won’t know what they’re downloading. Or, worse, what if they go onto the dark web and expose themselves to even more harmful content?

Baker is against age verification, but this quote highlights the fact that no child needs access to the net; they can get porn from a flash drive if necessary.

And what do they watch that on?

 

[arthwollipot]

Yes. For example, my wife and I don't upload videos of us having sex because we wish to keep that part of our lives private.

That's up to you. Other people, strange though it may seem, might like to upload photos and videos, and still keep their identities private. Yes, there are people who like to do that. Yes, though they are displaying their naked bodies to the world, their identities should still be private.

On a practical level, the name and address could be encrypted with public key cryptography. A paywall would only need to be a nominal fee as it's purpose would be to use existing infrastructure to perform age verification.

If someone else - anyone else - has the key, it's not private. It could be used for blackmail or worse.

If you want people to be responsible then you have to make sure they know that they are not anonymous and can be held accountable.

So no, privacy means nothing to you. Privacy (as defined in law in most jurisdictions) must include a guarantee of anonymity.

Say for a moment that we're not talking about nudes. Say for a moment that we're talking about whistleblower data. You have evidence that the company you work for has engaged in illegal activities. Would you turn over that evidence to the police if you did not have a guarantee of anonymity?

Similarly the platforms have to be motivated to take responsibility. I realise this is not perfect and bad actors would migrate to the dark web, but I think if all social media operated this way then it would be a better place for everyone.

It would not. It would be a nightmare. I don't think you've thought this through sufficiently.

 

[Darat]

This is a long thread so folk may not know but Poem's "consider the children" is a wedge strategy - Poem thinks all porn should be banned and would do even if you could have perfect controls that stopped any child from ever being able to access porn.

 

[Ivor the Engineer]

What prevents the dissemination of porn via USB flash drives if age verification is successful?

Nothing. It is typically only possible to reduce harm, not eliminate it. Trying to do so often is far more harmful than the harm you are trying to reduce.

 

[arthwollipot]

Nothing. It is typically only possible to reduce harm, not eliminate it. Trying to do so often is far more harmful than the harm you are trying to reduce.

Exactly. For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong.

 

[Poem]

This is a long thread so folk may not know but Poen's "consider the children" is a wedge strategy - Poem thinks all porn should be banned

I posted that I'm for a ban on the previous page. You make it sound like I'm hiding it.

and would do even if you could have perfect controls that stopped any child from ever being able to access porn.

You think the deleterious effects of porn are restricted to youngsters?

 

[arthwollipot]

You think the deleterious effects of porn are restricted to youngsters?

The deleterious effects of porn are limited to those people who haven't yet been educated to understand what porn is, what purpose it serves, and how and why it is different from real life intimate relationships.

Yet again, this is also why education is important.

 

[Poem]

And what do they watch that on?

A second hand laptop?

 

[Poem]

The deleterious effects of porn are limited to those people who haven't yet been educated to understand what porn is, what purpose it serves, and how and why it is different from real life intimate relationships.

Yet again, this is also why education is important.

You've decided not to back up your assertion that Pornhub is reputable and law-abiding?

 

[Ivor the Engineer]

That's up to you. Other people, strange though it may seem, might like to upload photos and videos, and still keep their identities private. Yes, there are people who like to do that. Yes, though they are displaying their naked bodies to the world, their identities should still be private.

And they would be, assuming their students, patients, neighbours, friends, relatives or work colleagues don't recognise them.

If someone else - anyone else - has the key, it's not private. It could be used for blackmail or worse.

Presumably you don't buy anything online or use any online banking services, etc. because if someone else - anyone else - has the key, your details are not private.

If you are posting anything online you implicitly expose yourself to someone else finding out details about you.

So no, privacy means nothing to you. Privacy (as defined in law in most jurisdictions) must include a guarantee of anonymity.

There can never be a guarantee of anonymity, only reasonable precautions. These have to be weighed against what the consequences are of anonymity being compromised.

Say for a moment that we're not talking about nudes. Say for a moment that we're talking about whistleblower data. You have evidence that the company you work for has engaged in illegal activities. Would you turn over that evidence to the police if you did not have a guarantee of anonymity?

Yes, if there was a reasonable expectation that my identity would remain private. If there was a data breach I would have recourse to compensation and/or protection from people who might like to hurt me.

It would not. It would be a nightmare. I don't think you've thought this through sufficiently.

I disagree.

 

[Darat]

A second hand laptop?

And they would get that where?

 

[Poem]

And they would get that where?

If you want to make a point please go ahead. AFAIK, Flash drives will work on mobile phones even if not connected to the net.

 

[Poem]

Nothing. It is typically only possible to reduce harm, not eliminate it. Trying to do so often is far more harmful than the harm you are trying to reduce.

Using a flash drive would be an easy work around for UK children who have grown up with porn. I don't see that you have demonstrated any 'reduced harm'.

We are teaching children that almost total unrestricted sexual freedom is just fine (the actors are real people having real sex after all). That should be a wake-up call.

Do you think that reflects well on humanity?