Should sanctuary cities be tolerated?

sackett said:
It's been observed that "nihilism...lies at the heart of fascism."
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I don't buy that. I would probably describe myself as a nihilist. Nihilism means you don't believe in an inherent meaning to life. I don't. I believe that each of us ascribe its meaning.
 
Hercules56 said:
Sure, in Mexico.
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In Mexico, in Germany, in Gabon, in Indonesia, in Saudi Arabia. All human beings.

Article 2:

Everyone is entitled to all the rights and freedoms set forth in this Declaration, without distinction of any kind, such as race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status. Furthermore, no distinction shall be made on the basis of the political, jurisdictional or international status of the country or territory to which a person belongs, whether it be independent, trust, non-self-governing or under any other limitation of sovereignty.
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All humans are entitled to due process. Denial of due process is denial of a fundamental human right.
 
acbytesla said:
I don't buy that. I would probably describe myself as a nihilist. Nihilism means you don't believe in an inherent meaning to life. I don't. I believe that each of us ascribe its meaning.
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I was tiredlly adverting to herq's post #602. That was the style of 1930s fascist vaunting, before they had to put up their dukes.
 
sackett said:
I was tiredlly adverting to herq's post #602. That was the style of 1930s fascist vaunting, before they had to put up their dukes.
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I get it.

The problem I see so often today are these clever remarks made in the past. With their original context they make all the sense in the world. But without that context the meanings get twisted.
 
acbytesla said:
I don't buy that. I would probably describe myself as a nihilist. Nihilism means you don't believe in an inherent meaning to life. I don't. I believe that each of us ascribe its meaning.
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Not to start a new argument here, but I think you'd count more as an existentialist than a nihilist. I would expect a nihilist to dismiss meaning altogether, where some of us consider meaning to have meaning even if we find none in the universe. But that's for another thread, no doubt.

More to the point, I am sure many of us come up with different meanings for dehumanization, but I do not think it requires you to forget the people you're dealing with are human. Enslavers did not, and the exterminators of the Holocaust did not. Dehumanization, as I would define it, is disregarding the individual humanity of one's subjects. If you deal with people on the basis of their belonging to a group or a class or a race or a culture, and if that is the criterion by which decisions on their treatment are made, you are dehumanizing them. And I think that's true even if on balance you decide it's a good or a necessary thing to do. But if you gotta do what you gotta do, don't pretend you're not doing it.
 
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Nihilism is the philosophy that there is no meaning in anything. Existentialism holds that nothing has inherent meaning, but meaning can be found wherever you want it to be.

Not a philosopher don't @ me.
 
bruto said:
Not to start a new argument here, but I think you'd count more as an existentialist than a nihilist. I would expect a nihilist to dismiss meaning altogether, where some of us consider meaning to have meaning even if we find none in the universe. But that's for another thread, no doubt.

More to the point, I am sure many of us come up with different meanings for dehumanization, but I do not think it requires you to forget the people you're dealing with are human. Enslavers did not, and the exterminators of the Holocaust did not. Dehumanization, as I would define it, is disregarding the individual humanity of one's subjects. If you deal with people on the basis of their belonging to a group or a class or a race or a culture, and if that is the criterion by which decisions on their treatment are made, you are dehumanizing them. And I think that's true even if on balance you decide it's a good or a necessary thing to do. But if you gotta do what you gotta do, don't pretend you're not doing it.
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arthwollipot said:
Nihilism is the philosophy that there is no meaning in anything. Existentialism holds that nothing has inherent meaning, but meaning can be found wherever you want it to be.

Not a philosopher don't @ me.
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I'm not either. Maybe I am under a misapprehension.

But this is what AI came up with on Google.

"Nihilism is a philosophical belief that life has no inherent meaning, purpose, or value. It's often associated with extreme skepticism, rejection of traditional values, and sometimes, a belief in the ultimate destruction of existing social and political structures. While nihilism can lead to despair, some interpretations suggest it can also be liberating, allowing individuals to create their own meaning."
 
acbytesla said:
I'm not either. Maybe I am under a misapprehension.

But this is what AI came up with on Google.

"Nihilism is a philosophical belief that life has no inherent meaning, purpose, or value. It's often associated with extreme skepticism, rejection of traditional values, and sometimes, a belief in the ultimate destruction of existing social and political structures. While nihilism can lead to despair, some interpretations suggest it can also be liberating, allowing individuals to create their own meaning."
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The font used here makes it hard to distinguish between AI and Al. Artificial Intelligence or Al the guy next door with the Ram truck on blocks, listening to talk radio, but then again I'm not sure it matters. I was going to go to the nihilist convention this year but there was no point.
 
theprestige said:
Sanctuary cities are kind of ironic:
  1. Don't help out with immigration enforcement.
  2. More work for the feds.
  3. More illegal immigrants coming to your city.
  4. More feds coming to your city to handle the additional work you're leaving for them.
  5. Even more feds coming to your city because, as Willie Sutton might have said, "that's where the illegals are".
  6. Many progressive idiot tears are shed over all the feds that are in your city.
I mean, I get not wanting to participate in ICE holds and whatnot. I can respect that as a principled position to take. What I can't respect is the unprincipled wailing and gnashing of teeth when the obvious consequences come to pass in due time. You don't want to do the feds' job? Fine. You want the feds to also not come and do the job themselves? Boop to that.
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There's nothing "unprincipled" about objecting to the presence of immigration goon squads, even if it's a necessary consequence of being a sanctuary city.

But these are far from necessary consequences, because there's a great deal of federal discretion involved here. Not to mention budgetary constraints.
 
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acbytesla said:
I'm not either. Maybe I am under a misapprehension.

But this is what AI came up with on Google.

"Nihilism is a philosophical belief that life has no inherent meaning, purpose, or value. It's often associated with extreme skepticism, rejection of traditional values, and sometimes, a belief in the ultimate destruction of existing social and political structures. While nihilism can lead to despair, some interpretations suggest it can also be liberating, allowing individuals to create their own meaning."
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That latter part is where I personally think that nihilism gives way to existentialism. Existentialism asks "I am here - now what?"
 
arthwollipot said:
That latter part is where I personally think that nihilism gives way to existentialism. Existentialism asks "I am here - now what?"
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Fair enough. I don't exactly follow a school of thought. The label is kind of irrelevant to me. The part I agree with the nihilist label is where there is no purpose or value to our lives handed down from most high. It's not inherent. The universe doesn’t seem to care about life or our lives specifically. Whatever value or purpose it may have we give it.

I absolutely see my life and the lives of others as valuable and precious though. But that is what it means to me.

If that is nihilism or existentialism, so be it.
 
I think I see what the problem is with asylum. Starting in the middle of the Biden administration, somebody let the whole world know that if people apply for asylum, they are allowed to stay in the USA while their court case goes through its process, even if it is ultimately determined that they're asylum application is absolutely bull ◊◊◊◊. So now everybody and their uncle and their second cousin is coming to the USA and it immediately applying for asylum, so they can stay here.

The problem with this is that it violates the international treaty on refugees, which clearly stipulates that people seeking asylum are required to apply as soon as they reach the first safe country.

And for almost all of the people coming from Latin America who are seeking asylum, the first safe country they encounter is Mexico. But they are not applying for asylum there because they really want to live in America. But that violates the international treaty on refugees.

Anyone who came to the USA through Mexico, and seeks asylum in America due to events in a third country, should be required to go back to Mexico and apply for asylum there first. Otherwise you are just taking advantage of the system and that is not fair.
 
sackett said:
It's been observed that "nihilism...lies at the heart of fascism."
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Fascists care far too much to be nihilists. Their powerful and pure nation is just another God. Tell them that there's no objective value in their goals, so maybe don't with the torture and the killing, and they'll have you executed on the spot as the moral degenerate you clearly are.
 
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