Transwomen are not Women - Part 15

[Mycroft]

What utter tripe.

Other members of the animal kingdom get along just fine with their "relationship to the world as a whole" without some made up, meaningless drivel like gender identity. Modern Humans have managed fine without it for all of the last 300,000 years barring the last 10-15.

Trans people have been around a lot longer than 10-15 years. Heck, the first modern surgeries were almost 100 years ago.

I think human social structure is more complex than most animals, but I could be wrong.

 

[Mycroft]

And yet you have opinions on who should use women's bathrooms.

Don't you too?

 

[Mycroft]

I see you still have not grasped the fact that a central basis of modern transactivism is that one does not need to transition at all, in any way whatsoever, in order to be trans.

I see this repeated again and again, and I don't see any reason to adopt it as my own opinion.

As I've said more than once, what transactivists do and say is a separate issue from trans-rights itself.

 

[Rolfe]

Only killing him can guarantee she doesn't rape again.

Look what I found when looking up the case.

"The case is believed to be the first time a trans woman has been convicted of raping women in Scotland."

Jailing of trans rapist Isla Bryson is 'shambles', says former prison chief

Isla Bryson should not have been sent to a women's jail, says the ex-governor of Cornton Vale.

www.bbc.com

Neither of the rapes happened in a public bathroom.

I thought Katie Dolatowski happened before that? And that did happen in a public bathroom. But perhaps I'm confused.

 

[Mycroft]

So far, all we seem to have achieved is...

TRAs (you know who you are): Some men want very much to use the women's facilities, and they'll be really upset if you don't let them. Have some thought for their feelings!
Women: We'll be really upset if men come into our single-sex facilities. What about our feelings?
TRAs: Sorry, what?

When you say "some men" you mean transwomen.

Also, when you say "women" you don't mean all women.

 

[Mycroft]

I don't care what the men's reasons are for wanting to breach our boundaries. I want all of them to stay out, regardless.

When you say "men's", you mean transwomen's.

 

[Mycroft]

Oh, you can have legal enforcement. But there are legal options besides "do nothing" and "criminalize any entry". But you're pretending that there aren't.

Wait, what? Isn't that the false-choice you keep pushing? Between "transwomen are anyone who says they're trans" and "keep everyone with a Y chromosome out"?

If there are legal options between those extremes, why not explore them?

 

[Mycroft]

They don't even have to say it. They just have to walk in, and nobody has any right to prevent them.

If Danny Trejo walked into a women's bathroom and you screamed at him to get out, what do you think would happen?

 

[Mycroft]

Please stop using demeaning terminologies and putting words in people's mouths that nobody has said.

The issue is females wanting to retain single-sex spaces where males are not allowed, irrespective of how those males feel inside their heads.

When you say "males", you mean transwomen.

 

[Mycroft]

JFC. I get that they have problems, and I would love to have a good solution to their problems... but insisting that females have to relinquish our spaces and put ourselves at a disadvantage, increase our risk, and reduce our ability to participate in society so that these males can feel better about themselves is irrational and borders on misogynistic.

When you say, "these males" you're referring to transwomen.

Just to be clear.

 

[Aber]

Don't you too?

Yes, based on listening to women.

 

[Mycroft]

Yes, based on listening to women.

I listen to women too. The women I listen to aren't bothered by transwomen in the woman's room.

What makes the women you listen to right and the women I listen to wrong?

 

[smartcooky]

When you say, "these males" you're referring to transwomen.

Just to be clear.

It is an observable, irrefutable, scientific reality that transwomen are biologically male, therefore, they are observably, irrefutably, scientifically men.

 

[Aber]

When you say "males", you mean transwomen.

I don't think she does; you seem to be confusing sex and gender again.

 

[Aber]

I listen to women too. The women I listen to aren't bothered by transwomen in the woman's room.

What makes the women you listen to right and the women I listen to wrong?

Because I also look at polling on the issue and find yours is very much a minority view, which suggests you inhabit a bubble.

 

[Mycroft]

I don't think she does; you seem to be confusing sex and gender again.

It is an observable, irrefutable, scientific reality that transwomen are biologically male, therefore, they are observably, irrefutably, scientifically men.

If we accept your definition of transwomen as a subset of men, then they're still a subset of men. They do not represent all men or men in general.

 

[Mycroft]

Why should they? Kids rarely, if ever, know whats best for them.

I don't think you read the question correctly.

Rolfe said parents were pushing their kids into transitioning. As though it were something the children didn't want to do, as though the idea of it originated in the parents head and not the child.

I don't believe that's very common at all. I think very few parents would even consider it if their children didn't lead the way.

Given that many of the aspects of transitioning are irreversible, and given the explosion in numbers of young adults detransitioning, there is no way that ANY minor should be allowed to transition medically until they reach the age of majority.

Letting puberty take its course is irreversible too.

A lot has been said in this thread about trans-people being easily distinguished from cis-people, but you're also stacking the deck against them by insisting the kids don't know anything and allowing puberty to take place.

 

[Mycroft]

Because I also look at polling on the issue and find yours is very much a minority view, which suggests you inhabit a bubble.

An appeal to popularity is called the bandwagon fallacy. Argumentum ad populum, if you want to sound fancy.

Argumentum ad populum - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[smartcooky]

If we accept your definition of transwomen as a subset of men, then they're still a subset of men. They do not represent all men or men in general.

A subset of "men" are still "men". That makes them biologically male

 

[Rolfe]

Transwomen ARE men. That is the Law where Rolfe lives.

Yay us. And to think that, as a supporter of Scottish independence, I was a bit miffed when the "UK Supreme Court" was imposed on us, interfering with the independence of the Scottish legal system. I'd still prefer us to be sorting out our own mess, but the SC has been extremely useful in this situation and I for one am not complaining.