Kamala Harris Election Campaign

The Atheist said:
No comparison.

First off, Nader was a highly respected individual with a huge following. Kennedy's just a spoiler.

Secondly, not a single vote for Nader came from Republicans, while Kennedy seems to have drawn from both sides fairly equally, small though the numbers are.
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Also, voter suppression and general rat ******* from the GOP as well as the Democratic candidate taking for granted their association with Bill Clinton will carry them through to the White House.
 
From the Guardian today re: Oprah

In 2012, researchers at Northwestern University and the University of Maryland tried to establish the correlation, if any, between celebrity endorsements and votes.

They used Winfrey’s endorsement of Barack Obama ahead of the 2008 Democrat primary to examine whether it had any effect on the polls.

The researchers concluded that Winfrey’s endorsement was worth about a million votes for Obama, who beat his main primary challenger, Hillary Clinton, by about 270,000 votes in the states used in the sample.
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https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...national-convention-speech-trump-harris-vance
 
acbytesla said:
I pretty much agree with most of this post. And you're right. The Kochs don't benefit (at least immediately) from immigration policies.
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In the UK immigration is a very effective distraction from real issues. Never mind rivers and beaches full of sewage, food banks and NHS stretched to breaking, look at those immigrants trying to come here to build a better life. Or in the USA crumbling infrastructure, job losses, etc
Get people angry and they stop thinking. It's the heart of populism.
 
Wudang said:
In the UK immigration is a very effective distraction from real issues.
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It's my opinion that 99% of the time immigration has ever been brought up in politics anywhere it's to distract from real issues. The only thing I can think of that's misused more is generic "crime".
 
Wudang said:
In the UK immigration is a very effective distraction from real issues. Never mind rivers and beaches full of sewage, food banks and NHS stretched to breaking, look at those immigrants trying to come here to build a better life. Or in the USA crumbling infrastructure, job losses, etc
Get people angry and they stop thinking. It's the heart of populism.
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You seem to think that immigration doesn't tie into any of these other problems, particularly the ones involving welfare problems. I find that strange.
 
Ziggurat said:
You seem to think that immigration doesn't tie into any of these other problems, particularly the ones involving welfare problems. I find that strange.
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If you want to read https://www.ucl.ac.uk/impact/case-studies/2022/apr/evidence-proves-true-effect-immigration-uk

However my point is that in both countries it seems immigration is not discussed but is simply used to distract from discussing other issues which may or may not be impacted by immigration. The performative politics of the previous Tory government here is a case in point.
 
Donal said:
How do you think they tie in?
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On average immigrants make a higher net positive contribution (taxes paid minus benefits claimed) than native born Brits so the more immigrants, the more money there is available for welfare programmes. I'm sure that's what Ziggurat was referring to. :)
 
Wudang said:
If you want to read https://www.ucl.ac.uk/impact/case-studies/2022/apr/evidence-proves-true-effect-immigration-uk
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"The researchers showed that immigrants to the UK arriving between 2000 and 2011 were 45% less likely to be on benefits or tax credits than UK natives"

And how about now?

However my point is that in both countries it seems immigration is not discussed but is simply used to distract from discussing other issues which may or may not be impacted by immigration. The performative politics of the previous Tory government here is a case in point.
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There's a performative aspect in everything to do with politics. Any issue you can think of that anybody cares about gets exploited by politicians for gain. Noticing that isn't really an indication of how important the issue actually is.
 
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An actual objective criticism countered with a vague "But all politicians are bad / all politicians do it"

Everybody take a shot. We're gonna be drunk in no time.
 
Speeches last night were great.

The Dems talk about hope and progress.

MAGA talks about fear, hate, anger.
 
JoeMorgue said:
An actual objective criticism
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Uh... there was nothing objective about Wudang's criticism. He was making a very explicitly subjective claim about perception. Which is fine, but don't pretend it was something other than it was.
 
Mike! said:
I think you're right. There's a fair percentage of RFK supporters that were behind him simply because he wasn't Trump, and his endorsement of him now won't change that opinion one bit.
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Wait, has he actually endorsed Trump? WTF?

Funny, I was just thinking I hadn't heard much about or from RFK since Biden dropped out.

I tend to agree with you all. RFK's support was mostly folks that didn't like Biden and folks that don't like trump. Now that Biden's out, I expect a lot of that support has shifted to Harris.
 
I am not the least bit worried that RFK will steal votes away from Kamala Harris. For two reasons. One, I am thoroughly convinced that he would siphon far more votes from Trump than he would from Harris. And two, I will bet money that he will drop out of the race.

He has been trying to sell his endorsement to both Harris and Trump. Harris isn't buying. That means Harris is convinced that RFK Jr's support doesn't buy her anything.

I'll bet dollars to donuts that RFK will drop out and endorse Trump. There will be some kind of quid pro quo. Not that Trump will feel any obligation to keep whatever agreement they might make. Trump is the kind of guy who promises the world and delivers little.
 
acbytesla said:
I am not the least bit worried that RFK will steal votes away from Kamala Harris. For two reasons. One, I am thoroughly convinced that he would siphon far more votes from Trump than he would from Harris. And two, I will bet money that he will drop out of the race.

He has been trying to sell his endorsement to both Harris and Trump. Harris isn't buying. That means Harris is convinced that RFK Jr's support doesn't buy her anything.

I'll bet dollars to donuts that RFK will drop out and endorse Trump. There will be some kind of quid pro quo. Not that Trump will feel any obligation to keep whatever agreement they might make. Trump is the kind of guy who promises the world and delivers little.
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What do you think RFK would want? Some cabinet position? Trump would probably reneg on that, but I could definitely see him getting an ambassadorship. Maybe to England, wouldn't be any worse than his granddad was.
 
JoeMorgue said:
An actual objective criticism countered with a vague "But all politicians are bad / all politicians do it"

Everybody take a shot. We're gonna be drunk in no time.
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Yeah, I'm loaded from perusing a thread a few doors down.

It's not that Trump is a liar, he's also all the other bad things as well.
 
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