History Possibly Lost.

[Crazy Chainsaw]

Perhaps they don't want to be found?

Perhaps they jealously guard the cosmic secrets encoded in this fabled document, lest their lesser 'relatives' gain true, universal sentience, and thus the secret of unlimited rice pudding?

Perhaps they returned to their home planet?

[DorisDayMode]Perhaps... Perhaps... Perhaps.[/DorisDayMode]


I have no idea. Nor do you. All you have is an unevidenced, unsupported claim of a purported family story, and your baseless suspicions based on the assumption that that is true.

I have found evidence that the Map I saw was Correct and gave the Correct location of Pates Station lost since it changed hands to Eliss Lyons. The exact location has been lost since before the Civil War.

 

[Crazy Chainsaw]

Yes, they can be wrong. But since you don't even have the letter or Bible any more, what difference does it make? How are we supposed to come up with anything?

The Historical Marker is definitely wrong, it's only a Mile west from Pates Station To Patesville.

https://history.ky.gov/markers/town-of-patesville

 

[Crazy Chainsaw]

I think I will Just write a Book about My Family's History, not the sugar coated version everyone Likes but the real history.

 

[Thermal]

The Historical Marker is definitely wrong, it's only a Mile west from Pates Station To Patesville.

https://history.ky.gov/markers/town-of-patesville

Historical markers don't matter if you don't have the Bible/letter. And you don't. So there's nothing to discuss here?

 

[Thermal]

I didn't Inherit it, so can I be blamed my Grand Father wasn't the first born son?

Of course not. But there's nothing to discuss if they only exist in your memories.

 

[Skeptical Greg]

History Possibly Lost.

So far, it looks like it is definitely lost.

 

[theprestige]

History Possibly Lost.

So far, it looks like it is definitely lost.

Definitely lost, possibly history.

I'm still going with the hypothesis that CC's relative ginned up a fake narrative that made them look more important through association with Abraham Lincoln Thomas Lincoln Pate's Crossing.

 

[Crazy Chainsaw]

Definitely lost, possibly history.

I'm still going with the hypothesis that CC's relative ginned up a fake narrative that made them look more important through association with Abraham Lincoln Thomas Lincoln Pate's Crossing.

Why would he have done that what did the Reverend have to gain from pinning a letter on his hand drawn map, from a broke farmer who couldn't afford to buy a box of Nails? Why would he have wanted to make himself look more Important than the First Methodist Minister West of Fort Hardinsburg?
If he wanted to be Important Why didn't he fake a letter from Queen Victoria?
That just doesn't make sense.

 

[Crazy Chainsaw]

Definitely lost, possibly history.

I'm still going with the hypothesis that CC's relative ginned up a fake narrative that made them look more important through association with Abraham Lincoln Thomas Lincoln Pate's Crossing.

It's Pates Station the First Stage Coach Station west of Fort Hardinsburg, on the Hardinsburg Yellow Banks Road.

 

[arthwollipot]

How do I find Family that possibly have left no Heirs?

Look back at the records of common ancestors that you can find, look for records of their descendants. Registries of Births Deaths and Marriages, church records, newspaper archives are all useful. The field is genealogy and it can be a rich source of family knowledge.

I think I will Just write a Book about My Family's History, not the sugar coated version everyone Likes but the real history.

Just make sure you get a good editor and proofreader when you do.

 

[theprestige]

Why would he have done that what did the Reverend have to gain from pinning a letter on his hand drawn map, from a broke farmer who couldn't afford to buy a box of Nails? Why would he have wanted to make himself look more Important than the First Methodist Minister West of Fort Hardinsburg?
If he wanted to be Important Why didn't he fake a letter from Queen Victoria?
That just doesn't make sense.

My hypothesis is that the letter was pinned on the back of the map at a later date, after Lincoln became famous.

I am, however, open to the possibility that a relative of yours just came up with a nonsensical story.

 

[8enotto]

Historically nails were almost as valuable as coins in early America. The labor that went into hand cutting them was huge, when thinking in terms of building a house out of planks.

They are traditionally measured in "pennies" as that was the size as well as the price. Effectively cash in a pinch.

Machine made nails as we know them ended that. Not sure the time frame that happened.

I won't speculate on the letter, but documents over the battle at the Alamo surfaced from the winning side and it took three experts a decade
to authenticate them, none of which is acceptable in Texas.
In this case the map/document needs to be found before anything can happen. Meanwhile it's a cool story.

 

[Crazy Chainsaw]

Historically nails were almost as valuable as coins in early America. The labor that went into hand cutting them was huge, when thinking in terms of building a house out of planks.

They are traditionally measured in "pennies" as that was the size as well as the price. Effectively cash in a pinch.

Machine made nails as we know them ended that. Not sure the time frame that happened.

I won't speculate on the letter, but documents over the battle at the Alamo surfaced from the winning side and it took three experts a decade
to authenticate them, none of which is acceptable in Texas.
In this case the map/document needs to be found before anything can happen. Meanwhile it's a cool story.

This would have been 1816, when Thomas Lincoln lost the Farm he bought, he wasn't allowed to burn the House and recover the nails as nails in those days were Iron, not Steel. So you burnt Down the house when you moved collected the nails. and took them with you. Thomas Lincoln wasn't allow to burn the House he built on the Sinking Spring Farm, so he had no Nails to build a new Hone for him and Young Abraham. Lincoln was destitute, and had no money, he paid for his stay at Pates Station by working for William Pate. Reverend Abraham S. became Friends with Lincoln at Pates Station, and gave him the Nails he hand Cut on Pates Blacksmith Forge.
Reverend Abraham worked the Blacksmithshop though the week and Preached Fire and brimstone on Sunday at the station when he wasn't working on the Farm or building Roads.

 

[Crazy Chainsaw]

My hypothesis is that the letter was pinned on the back of the map at a later date, after Lincoln became famous.

I am, however, open to the possibility that a relative of yours just came up with a nonsensical story.

I actually saw the Map, and Lincoln is Known to have taken the Hardinsburg Yellowbanks road, and to have stayed at Pates Station. Abraham is also known to have been a Ferry Boy on the Taylor's Ferry.

 

[Crazy Chainsaw]

Look back at the records of common ancestors that you can find, look for records of their descendants. Registries of Births Deaths and Marriages, church records, newspaper archives are all useful. The field is genealogy and it can be a rich source of family knowledge.

Just make sure you get a good editor and proofreader when you do.

I have been doing that for months, even Found letter from one of My Ansestors asking the Governor for a Pardon in 1864.

 

[Crazy Chainsaw]

My hypothesis is that the letter was pinned on the back of the map at a later date, after Lincoln became famous.

I am, however, open to the possibility that a relative of yours just came up with a nonsensical story.

The whole reason the Expert thought it was fake was because of the evidence that Lincoln crossed the Ohio River at Cloverport, and wouldn't have traveled the extra miles to Pate Station, but all the evidence he crossed at Cloverport is also after the Fact with the Town and County wanting the Lincoln Trail Bridge built at Cloverport. Not where it was eventually built at Hawesville.

https://southernindianaconnections.com/history/journey-of-thomas-lincoln/

 

[Thermal]

Was a Letter from Thomas and Abraham Lincoln lost because of a flawed expert opinion?

At my last Family reunion I saw my Great Great Great Grandfather's Bible, and a letter that was supposed to be from Thomas Lincoln too him, this was in 1987-1988. It was written on back of a Map Drawn by him of Pates Station in Patesville Kentucky, to Taylor's ferry on the Ohio River. This was in 1816, when Lincoln Stayed at Pates Station to rest his Oxen who had an Injury too it's front hoof and had to have the hoof trimmed, and rested.
Lincoln Stayed in the Barn near the Blacksmithshop not in the Tavern. the letter was just a thank you note for the Reverend saying a Prayer for Lincoln, and his Family including his young son Abraham, and for drawing the map, and Gifting to Lincoln a Box of Nails that my Ansestor had Cut intending too use them to build his first barn on the old Family farm.
An Expert on Lincoln in Illinois was shown the letter and he said there was no proof Lincoln Stopped at Pates Station in 1816, and although the Thomas Lincoln Signature looked Real,and My Ansestor's penmanship was authentic, the letter was probably just a fake, drawn on an old Map after Lincoln's death.
He concluded that because the Note the 9 year old Abraham Lincoln wrote to My Great Great Grandfather encouraging him to Write Young Abraham was printed not Cursive, and thus most likely a fake.
I was wondering since my Great Great Grandfather would have been 5 years old at the Time would Abraham Lincoln have printed that part, because my Great Great Grandfather couldn't read Cursive?
Could a historical document have been lost just because of one experts opinion?
The Bible and the Letter are probably gone now, Lost to history, I haven't heard from that side of the family in decades.

The part that aggrivates the living **** out of me is that we are supposed to take CC's recollections as gospel, but according to the hilited, he literally does not remember who wrote the note. He says it was both written by Thomas Lincoln, then without explanation, attributes the writing to 9 year old Abe Lincoln.

At first I just thought "it's all nonsensical anyway so it doesn't matter. I've come to conclude that it doesn't ******* matter because it's all ******* nonsensical.

 

[Crazy Chainsaw]

The part that aggrivates the living **** out of me is that we are supposed to take CC's recollections as gospel, but according to the hilited, he literally does not remember who wrote the note. He says it was both written by Thomas Lincoln, then without explanation, attributes the writing to 9 year old Abe Lincoln.

At first I just thought "it's all nonsensical anyway so it doesn't matter. I've come to conclude that it doesn't ******* matter because it's all ******* nonsensical.

So the Lincolns wrote a note from Thomas to Abraham S. And Abraham L. Included a Side note to Delaney S. And you think that's unusual?
I was wrong about Lincoln being 9, he was only 7 while Delaney was only 5, and just learning to read and write, that may explain why Abraham L printed instead of writing in Cursive. The letter was probably rejected by the Expert because of the Belief Lincoln Crossed at Cloverport, which was a story from the 1930 well after the fact, by political figures wanting to play up their part in Lincoln's Story.
Until the !930, it was believed Lincoln crossed over on the Taylor's Ferry at Hawesville Kentucky to Perry County Indiana Following the old Hardinsburg Yellowbanks Road.
I just wonder if history was rewritten by political Figures trying to get the Lincoln Trail Bridge Moved to Cloverport before the Corps of Engineers decided to build it in Hawesville Kentucky and the Damn above the Bridge, raising the Water level at Cloverport?

 

[Thermal]

So the Lincolns wrote a note from Thomas to Abraham S. And Abraham L. Included a Side note to Delaney S. And you think that's unusual?

And now we've moved on to version three: this letter was in fact co-wrote by both Tommy and Abe?

I was wrong about Lincoln

You could've stopped right there.

...being 9, he was only 7 while Delaney was only 5, and just learning to read and write, that may explain why Abraham L printed instead of writing in Cursive. The letter was probably rejected by the Expert because of the Belief Lincoln Crossed at Cloverport, which was a story from the 1930 well after the fact, by political figures wanting to play up their part in Lincoln's Story.
Until the !930, it was believed Lincoln crossed over on the Taylor's Ferry at Hawesville Kentucky to Perry County Indiana Following the old Hardinsburg Yellowbanks Road.
I just wonder if history was rewritten by political Figures trying to get the Lincoln Trail Bridge Moved to Cloverport before the Corps of Engineers decided to build it in Hawesville Kentucky and the Damn above the Bridge, raising the Water level at Cloverport?

I don't see how any of that matters if you don't even have the letter. Your recollections, as have been noted across multiple threads now, are usually found to contradict themselves and ultimately found to be not even factually accurate.

Before speculating randomly about Pate's crossings and stuff, you need to find the letter. Any wonderings you might have don't mean anything till the actual facts are straightened out and confirmed as real.

 

[Crazy Chainsaw]

And now we've moved on to version three: this letter was in fact co-wrote by both Tommy and Abe?



You could've stopped right there.



I don't see how any of that matters if you don't even have the letter. Your recollections, as have been noted across multiple threads now, are usually found to contradict themselves and ultimately found to be not even factually accurate.

Before speculating randomly about Pate's crossings and stuff, you need to find the letter. Any wonderings you might have don't mean anything till the actual facts are straightened out and confirmed as real.

The Letter was never my personal property, and serious Problems Exist with the Idea that Lincoln Crossed the River at Cloverport such as a Slave Giving the Lincolns bread and Butter without the Masters approval First, they the Crossed with water low in winter by polling, on a log raft. Usually water would be low July, Agust and September. Not in winter.
The Taylor's Ferry was an established Ferry in 1816 with a good Road, the Road Lincoln is said to have traveled wasn't finished yet.