Cont: Luton Airport Car Park Fire III

[SpitfireIX]

Stop trying to shoe horn a straight forward current affairs item into a conspiracy theory.

Here, again, is the definition of "conspiracy theory" from Merriam-Webster, which, also again, is a respected American dictionary publisher. I'll include the entire definition this time, in order to head off any allegations of cherry-picking. All bolding, italics, and ellipses are original. The hiliting is mine.

conspiracy theory noun
plural conspiracy theories
: a theory that explains an event or set of circumstances as the result of a secret plot by usually powerful conspirators
the conspiracy theories surrounding Kennedy's assassination
also : a theory asserting that a secret of great importance is being kept from the public… is best known for … his conspiracy theory that a secret cabal of reptilian humanoids is running the world.
—Simon Little
… has often been criticized for promoting conspiracy theories such as "birtherism," the theory that President Obama was not born in the U.S.
—Grace Segers​

Here, also, is an excerpt from the description of the logical fallacy of "special pleading" from logicallyfallacious.com: "Description: Applying standards, principles, and/or rules to other people or circumstances, while making oneself or certain circumstances exempt from the same critical criteria, without providing adequate justification. Special pleading is often a result of strong emotional beliefs that interfere with reason."

So kindly explain to us, Vixen, how it is that you are not promoting a conspiracy theory, and you are not committing the fallacy of special pleading.

 

[Dabop]

As at 29:00 it states recommendations including that the initial firefighters should be there within three to four minutes of the first fire alert..

Depending on time of day and location, that would mean a Fire Station located practically every block or two!!!


(I have been stuck in peak hour traffic, at an airport no less, and ended up getting out of the car and walking- because we hadn't even gone a block in quarter of an hour!!!)

Maybe a squad of firefighters all on foot, carrying portable fire extinguishers with flashing red lights on their helmets going 'whoo, whoo, whoo, ding ding' at the top of their voices might be needed???

 

[SteveAitch]

Depending on time of day and location, that would mean a Fire Station located practically every block or two!!!


(I have been stuck in peak hour traffic, at an airport no less, and ended up getting out of the car and walking- because we hadn't even gone a block in quarter of an hour!!!)

Maybe a squad of firefighters all on foot, carrying portable fire extinguishers with flashing red lights on their helmets going 'whoo, whoo, whoo, ding ding' at the top of their voices might be needed???
[qimg]https://i.postimg.cc/Y9643qTc/toy-fire-helmet-flashing-lights-siren-radio-1-04b06a06a74b0672633b8bbce51c38e1-107185921.jpg[/qimg]

Or

 

[Darat]

Or

Good of you to provide the documentary used by some to come to their conclusions.

 

[SteveAitch]

Good of you to provide the documentary used by some to come to their conclusions.

One likes to help...

 

[EHocking]

Well, they weren't there in 3 to 4 minutes. What now?

The first responders to arrive got there in 8 minutes, travelling from Stopsley, 2½ miles away, and then found the car fire was not in an easily accessible area but 3 floors up in the multi storey car park.

So what point are you making? Do you wish fire engines could drive faster? Do you doubt the time response actually took? Do you think Rishi Sunak delayed them? It's not clear what point you want to make.

Does it need to be pointed out that a ******* UK gubmint actually owns the ******* Luton airport for you to understand this conspiracy theory current affair?

(with apologies for the rest of you dealing with ****, I don’t know anymore, nor do I care now)

 

[GlennB]

BBC:
...

As at 29:00 it states recommendations including that the initial firefighters should be there within three to four minutes of the first fire alert.
...

That would be a target, but not always a realistic expectation.

I live about 200yds from Abersychan fire station here in S Wales. There are many locations in the area where it would be the nearest fire station, but most of those could not possibly be reached within 4 minutes of a fire alert.

 

[Andy_Ross]

As I already posted,the average response time to primary fires was 9 minutes and 13 seconds, in the year ending March 2023. This was an increase of 23 seconds compared with the previous year (8 minutes and 50 seconds) an increase of 35 seconds compared with 5 years ago (8 minutes and 38 seconds)

That is from when they are notified. It doesn't mean from when the fire started.

 

[catsmate]

De minimis as in least number votes required to pass the threshold.

ETA this should read 'supporters' as defined by Brady, meaning Tory MP's votes rather than party members'.

No, just no. Stop demonstrating your abject ignorance.

Figure of speech for news items that the press will not publish because of 'orders from above'.

Evidence for this claim of yours?

 

[catsmate]

And you know it is wrong, how?

Read this and all will become clear as to why we have not been told what the brand of car was.

https://www.indiatimes.com/worth/ne...p-chairman-after-gigafactory-deal-609670.html


And the evasions will continue. The latest news is that the fire was due to 'a lack of sprinklers' and this will be rectified in future.

Indeed they do. You keep spouting debunked drivel about EV fires, and many, many, other matters on which you are utterly ignorant.

 

[catsmate]

See here from BBC News:

10 April 2024 https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-68716196

Note the avoidance of mentioning the elephant in the room? We have a diesel vehicle, lack of sprinklers and 'cars are a bit heavier these days'. Oh yeah, and EV's with 'different fire risks', by the way.

Reminds me of Basil Fawlty trying so hard not to mention the EV's war or Jaguar Land Rovers the Germans, our attention is irresistibly drawn towards these very things.

Yes, yes you do resemble him.
This doesn't effect the fact that the fire began in a diesel ICE vehicle. Despite your pathetic attempts at obfuscation.

Please provide a citation of which post of mine you claim to be referring to. You are making up your own stuff here.

We're still waiting for your 'home conversion' proof.

 

[catsmate]

Oh please. The fire was out of control within less than half an hour, with fire fighters overcome with fumes and having to leave the building. A diesel car fire is something a team of firefighters can put out within ten minutes.

There was a similar fire at Gatwick North Terminal. Eleven cars destroyed within minutes. News report: 'accidental ignition'. No mention it was a Tesla EV that was burnt to a shell.

Of FFS stop spouting these same, tired, lies. The fire started in a diesel ICE vehicle, and spread to others. Anyone with even a semi-functional brain can understand this fact.

 

[catsmate]

An eyewitness supplied a photograph of it.

Surely you're not relying on what some random posted on the internet?

Indeed, the hypocrisy is burning.

 

[catsmate]

News cover up.

Evidence?

So tell us the make and model of the car.

Already done. You just don't like the facts.

Stop being obtuse. Beds F&RS said that a sprinkler system would have massively reduced the impact of the fire, which - hello?- destroyed 1,500 vehicles, despite the driver of the original vehicle being present at the time.

 

[catsmate]

There is no sign of a fuel leak along the ground behind the vehicle in the CCTV clip, as was the cause of fire hypothesized in the Liverpool fire, and which had been smouldering for a while with no-one present.

Interpreting such data is far, far, beyond your competence.

 

[catsmate]

It most certianly relates to how the car owner was unable to put out the fire with a simple fire extinguisher as soon as he became aware his vehicle was on fire. It takes time for a vehicle to reach a sufficient temperature to radiate enough heat to cause nearby vehicles to ignite.

Bollocks.

That issue has been dealt with. 'Electrical fault' is the second most common cause of car fire and more often than not it is to do with poor maintenance and people messing about with their engines. My post merely pointed out any number of reasons it could have caught fire.

You're lying and fabricating again.

 

[catsmate]

It's antiphlogiston.

Now there's a word that didn't get out much in the last century.

 

[catsmate]

https://fullfact.org/online/electric-hybrid-did-not-start-luton-airport-car-park-fire/

What was claimed: The car that started the fire in the Luton Airport car park was electric.

Our verdict: Bedfordshire Fire & Rescue Service has said that the vehicle initially involved in the fire was diesel, and not a hybrid or electric car.

The local fire brigade, Bedfordshire Fire & Rescue Service, confirmed to Full Fact that the initial vehicle involved in the fire was a diesel, not a hybrid.

Andrew Hopkinson, chief fire officer at Bedfordshire Fire & Rescue Service, previously told the media: “We have no intelligence at this stage to suggest that this was anything other than an accidental fire that started in one of the vehicles that had not long arrived at the airport. It was not an EV. This was a diesel powered vehicle.”​

Case closed. If there is any organization who will know what started any given fire, it will be the organization (in this case, the Bedfordshire Fire & Rescue Service) that extinguished it, and investigated the cause.

(Unless, of course, Vixen claims that the omniscient, omnipresent, all-powerful and nefarious "they" have instructed the Bedfordshire Fire & Rescue Service to lie to the public.

In fact, the vehicle that started the fire was a 2014 Range Rover Sport TDV6 SE (a turbocharged diesel)

https://www.landrovermonthly.co.uk/articles/news/the-truth-is-revealed/

There was a conspiracy theory that the car which started the fire was really an electric vehicle, despite the fact Andrew Hopkinson, chief fire officer for Bedfordshire Fire and Rescue Service, said: “It’s believed to be diesel-powered.” Furthermore there was actual footage of the car first alight, which, based on the registration plate, was a 2014 Range Rover Sport TDV6 SE.
​

Paraphrasing the late SG Collins:

Once you are forced to hypothesise whole new conspiracies to keep your conspiracy possible, you have stepped over into the realm of magic, requiring of you a deep and abiding faith in things you can never know.

Good luck, but Vixen's been provided with all the facts before, and still spouts ignorant garbage.

 

[catsmate]

It could be a hoax, who knows? The problem with X-Twitter is that there are people who think it amusing to start a rumour, such as the 'Benjamin Cohen' one, or the person who claimed the Luton Fire was a Range Rover Sport 2014 with a numberplate that could be looked up on DVLA. Most likely someone wanting to wind up what they consider 'anti-EV gammons'. Look up a RR vehicle that was diesel only and apply that number to the fake video.

As Geoff Buys Cars acknowledges, it was a picture sent in by someone claiming to work at Gatwick. I don't think he was trying to start a hoax.

The idiocy, it burns hotter than a lithium fire........

The Land Rover Sport 2014 rumour and CCTV supposedly from the front of the vehicle was put out by a tweeter with 200 followers and this CCTV has not been picked up by any of the national press because it has zero authenticity.

Oh look, you're lying again.

 

[catsmate]

You seem not to understand the maths and physics. Steel is a mixture of iron and carbon that can melt at between 1,371-1,540°C. The melting point of steel can vary because of the different elements it contains, which can cause melting point depression. Diesel burns at a recorded maximum temperature of 1,150 °C under controlled conditions. This is insufficient even to buckle steel used in construction. However, a lithium-ion car battery burns much more fiercely. The burning lithium creates a metallic fire existing at temperatures of 2,000 °C. As you know, the steel rebars buckling caused the concrete floor/s to collapse and it is likely that the concrete itself didn't just spall, as in the Liverpool fire, but actually melted, although we shall have to see what the report says.

(Attempting to douse the fire with water is inadvisable since this could lead to a hydrogen gas explosion. However, the effect of cold water sprinklers can lessen the effect of other cars igniting so quickly.)

More pig ignorant bollocks.