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General Israel/Palestine discussion thread - Part 4

Again I guess this will just all keep going on and on until the God that doesn't exist finally gets around to coming down from Heaven and clarifying which herd of illiterate bronze age goat herders he really did promise that 25 mile strip of desert scrub land to.
 
It's true.
It's not true.
Lies.
Facts.
Lies.
Reality.
Misinformation.
Willful ignorance.
Regular ignorance.
Fake news.
Truth.
Not truth.
Denials.
Fabrications.
Cherry picking.
False.
Accurate.
Never happened.
Happened.
Believe your own eyes.
Don't believe your own eyes.

This is the entire discussion overall, in a nutshell (not just here, but all over social media).
 
JoeMorgue said:
Again I guess this will just all keep going on and on until the God that doesn't exist finally gets around to coming down from Heaven and clarifying which herd of illiterate bronze age goat herders he really did promise that 25 mile strip of desert scrub land to.
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Keep in mind that many Christian supporters of Israel do so with the belief that God will indeed come down and sort this out. (Armegeddon)
 
Leumas said:
It is totally not true... which is why you keep bare asserting despite the FACTS of international law and sanity.
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You really should not talk about international law until you expect the Palestinian Arabs to abide by it. Which Hamas and Islamic jihad and Hezbollah refuse to do.
 
As others have always asked what the solution NOW?

"So and so happened 50, 100, or a thousand years ago" is good context, but it's not a solution.
 
Hercules56 said:
You really should not talk about international law until you expect the Palestinian Arabs to abide by it. Which Hamas and Islamic jihad and Hezbollah refuse to do.
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Israel was created by international law... and it has not obeyed a single other ever since... and broken numerous ones.

The Palestinians were ****** by international law and dispossessed and made refugees... international law in fact fully allows their armed resistance as totally legitimate.

So I am afraid you have it totally all muddled up and topsy turvy... I suggest you learn the history and international laws on the matter... you very clearly do not know either.
 
Israel was 'created' in the late 1800's through the 1930's (a period of about 40 years).
Our Jewish State did not arise full-grown and complete in 1947, but rather, was a half-century in the making. While it may indeed be accurate to state that the voting of 57 UN member states on November 29, 1947 was perhaps partly because of international 'guilt' , by that point in time, Israel was already a Nation in statu nascendi and the main question remaining was 'in what boundaries' would the Jewish State exist within?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Partition_Plan_for_Palestine
 
JoeMorgue said:
Again I guess this will just all keep going on and on.
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Only because the venal governments of the USA and Europe and because of the demented Christian Zionists... and the "white guilt" of the less venal and less demented... but only in favor of the other whites of Europe who do not kiss the feet of a half naked tortured male statue... but no guilt whatsoever about the various colors of the Palestinians of course.

It all can be resolved in a few weeks if only the UN that created Israel and the concentration camps it created... could apply and enforce the scads of resolutions that Israel has laughed at and will never obey.

Or the International countries who created Israel in the first place would make it do what they made South Africa do.

Why was the world willing to force the Afrikaans to stop their atrocities but not the Zionists??? Hmmmmm!!!
 
Leumas said:
It is totally not true... which is why you keep bare asserting despite the FACTS of international law and sanity.
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Again, my most charitable interpretation is that you have once again lost track of the discussion.

Israel removed all its settlers from Gaza in 2005. Since then, Israelis have not occupied Gaza. That's a fact. Whatever it is you think Israel was doing, it wasn't occupation.
 
Leumas said:
Israel was created by international law... and it has not obeyed a single other ever since... and broken numerous ones.

The Palestinians were ****** by international law and dispossessed and made refugees... international law in fact fully allows their armed resistance as totally legitimate.

So I am afraid you have it totally all muddled up and topsy turvy... I suggest you learn the history and international laws on the matter... you very clearly do not know either.
Click to expand...

International Law is a funny thing, Leumas.
It's mostly dis-honored internationally.
And the mechanisms for enforcement are vague and timid.

While the Palestinians might actually trust and believe that the International Community is going to come to their aid, that is a dubious proposition, at best.

"ThePalestinians" were not dispossessed. A Palestinian from Haifa that went a few miles down the road to Jenin and became an 'internal refugee' (remaining within the boundaries of what had been considered HistoricalPalestine for many hundreds of years prior). He was indeed dispossessd of his home (and it may even have been a rental property) but he cannot be said to have left Palestine.
Same with Gaza. It's obviously part of HistoricalPalestine, so he's still 'at home' in his own land, no?

https://www.jpost.com/opinion/article-772528
Goodbye freedom, hello madness.
 
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"Palestinians" aren't really a thing that actually exists (in the context the term is used in discussion of this topic.) This has been explained multiple times.

Again pretending this is an "Israel versus Palestine" conflict and not "Israel versus the Entire Middle East" is basically Hamas propaganda trying to present the tiny postage stamp that is Israel on the coffee table is the Middle East as somehow the overdog (that still needs to be a word) in the conflict because Hamas knows damn well Western Liberals will just side with the underdog in the conflict and then stop thinking, exactly as they are doing now.

Again it's absurd piled on absurd and I don't know if it sadder that people are honestly falling for this or that people expect me to believe they are falling for it.

The Middle East is 2,782,860 square miles. Practically all of that is Muslim majority, Arabic Speaking countries. Israel is 8,555 square miles.

Every single neighboring Muslim country has made it their business to wipe Israel off the map as long as there has been an Israel in a modern nation-state sense of the term.

There's over 2.5 million square miles of ethnocentric Muslim mono-state and the simple idea that the solution to this crisis is for the tiny postage stamp full of Jews to give back some of their 8,500 square miles and that will solve everything is goddamn laughable.

Israel could be 12 square inches and the Muslim world would demand they give back 11 inches and that would solve it and we all know it.
 
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Ziggurat said:
Again, my most charitable interpretation is that you have once again lost track of the discussion.

Israel removed all its settlers from Gaza in 2005. Since then, Israelis have not occupied Gaza. That's a fact. Whatever it is you think Israel was doing, it wasn't occupation.
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And my most charitable interpretation is....
 
Leumas said:
Why was the world willing to force the Afrikaans to stop their atrocities but not the Zionists??? Hmmmmm!!!
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Because the people the Afrikaans were in a conflict with hadn't declared a Holy War on the entire world?

Because the people the Afrikaans were in a conflict with wouldn't kill me, you, everyone in this thread, and every Western Coffee Shop Liberal no matter how hard they simp for them?
 
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webfusion said:
You want to bring about the fiasco of tribal South Africa to the prosperous and stable and non-tribal Jewish State?
Not too convincing an argument, dude.
https://www.quora.com/Why-did-the-people-ruin-South-Africa-It-is-now-a-basket-case
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Yeah, I really don't get that. The more you draw a parallel to South Africa, the more Israelis are going to look at that and decide they want no part of it, because that's turned into a complete **** show. They literally can't keep the lights on anymore.

If you're trying to look for a success story to conflict resolution, Northern Ireland is a much better example. But that was still a very different sort of conflict, not a good parallel, and Hamas is clearly not willing to do what the IRA was willing to do in order to make peace.
 
Some people are obviously far more interested in writing a story with character arcs and dramatic irony about the Israelis because they think it's clever, they aren't actually just trying to describe the situations or come to a solution.
 
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JoeMorgue said:
Again people are trying to write a story with character arcs and dramatic irony about the Israelis because they think it's clever, they aren't actually just trying to describe the situations or come to a solution.
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They don't want a solution. They want a scape goat.
 
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