Luton Airport Car Park Fire

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Jack by the hedge said:
Very well then, what is your point on that matter? For example, tell us how many cars were already alight by the time the fire brigade's first fire fighting efforts began.
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Drawing from the Liverpool ECHO car park fire report by Merseyside Fire Brigade, actually being parked on a ramp is not good:

From initial observations, CCTV and open Social Media sources it could be seen that
the fire, once sufficiently developed, moved rapidly up through the structure. Early
thoughts around this concentrated on vehicles being parked on the ramps between
floors as a possible factor in fire spread.
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page 19


So, the Luton car, if the image is authentic (and this has not been verified), was parked at right angles to the parking bays on a ramp arriving at Level 3, where it is already on fire towards the front of the vehicle. The Fire Brigade would appear to consider such a 'parking spot' to be a factor in fire spread.


With flames shooting out to the sides low down and at the high temperatures associated with a lithium fire, then this would soon be uncontainable despite all best efforts.


Would sprinklers have helped? Almost certainly, if only to slow the spread down in other parts of the car park and other levels. Fire hates water.
 
Vixen said:
BBC reported an eye witness who saw the fire as he descended into the airport and he said he saw a fire engine on the top level, so they could get in.
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The eye witness was mistaken. There are height restrictions, and a fire engine exceeds them by miles.

For example, Birmingham airport:

The maximum height limit for Car Park 1 is 2.15m with bays being 2.9m in width x 4.82m in length.

The maximum height limit for Car Park 2 is 2.05m with bays being 2.8m in width x 4.62m in length

The maximum height limit for Car Park 3 is 2.05m with bays being 2.9m in width x 4.57m in length

link
 
GlennB said:
The eye witness was mistaken. There are height restrictions, and a fire engine exceeds them by miles.

For example, Birmingham airport:

The maximum height limit for Car Park 1 is 2.15m with bays being 2.9m in width x 4.82m in length.

The maximum height limit for Car Park 2 is 2.05m with bays being 2.8m in width x 4.62m in length

The maximum height limit for Car Park 3 is 2.05m with bays being 2.9m in width x 4.57m in length

link
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I am sure that is true for Birmingham but nonetheless an early eye-witness at the scene of the Luton fire states:

Russell Taylor, 41, an account director, saw the flames after flying in to Luton from Edinburgh.

He told the PA news agency: "There were a couple of fire engines with a car ablaze on the upper floor of the car park at just after 21:00
"A few minutes later most of the upper floor was alight, car alarms were going off with loud explosions from cars going up in flames."
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BBC 11 Oct 2023

Make of that what you will.
 
Vixen said:
I am sure that is true for Birmingham but nonetheless an early eye-witness at the scene of the Luton fire states:

BBC 11 Oct 2023

Make of that what you will.
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You've misunderstood the meaning or the witness has put it badly or the witness is simply wrong.

"Blue Badge parking spaces are available on Levels 0 & 1. There is a height restriction of 2.1m in Terminal Car Park 1. Terminal Car Park 1 charges at London Luton ..." etc etc etc . Google it yourself. It takes only seconds.
 
Vixen said:
BBC reported an eye witness who saw the fire as he descended into the airport and he said he saw a fire engine on the top level, so they could get in.
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If you're referring to this: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-67073446 I think you're mistaken. (Subject to confirmation by the 'fire chief' obviously.)

Russell Taylor, 41, an account director, saw the flames after flying in to Luton from Edinburgh.

He told the PA news agency: "There were a couple of fire engines with a car ablaze on the upper floor of the car park at just after 21:00

"A few minutes later most of the upper floor was alight, car alarms were going off with loud explosions from cars going up in flames."
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Mr Taylor plainly did not see the fire while in the air, he saw it after he flew in. And while what he said is ambiguous, I believe he described 'a couple of fire engines' dealing with a blazing car on the upper floor, not that the fire engines themselves were on the upper floor. Even if there was some route by which a fire engine could physically get up there, I find it scarcely imaginable the fire brigade would decide to park their engines above a fire.
 
Car catches fire in a parkade. Subsequent events occur as expected. The entire world bar one person understands what happened. One person, who sees conspiracies everywhere and is an expert on everything, views the event as nefarious and makes bizarre, uneducated and unjustified comments. 1300+ posts later nothing has been accomplished. Seems we have seen this before.
 
Jack by the hedge said:
You're striving hard to miss the point. The video illustrated how fiercely modern cars burn if they catch fire.
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Yes and we saw how quickly the fire brigade put it out when they arrived. Within five minutes.


Also, we are not told how long that car had been burning nor what was the cause.


Any fule 'no petrol cars burn vigorously. Why do you think the Yellow Vests enjoy setting fire to them for good effect in their demonstrations?
 
Steve said:
Car catches fire in a parkade. Subsequent events occur as expected. The entire world bar one person understands what happened. One person, who sees conspiracies everywhere and is an expert on everything, views the event as nefarious and makes bizarre, uneducated and unjustified comments. 1300+ posts later nothing has been accomplished. Seems we have seen this before.
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We are at the point at which a sorcerer controlling a fire elemental is more sensible than Vixen's musings.
 
Vixen said:
Drawing from the Liverpool ECHO car park fire report by Merseyside Fire Brigade, actually being parked on a ramp is not good:

page 19


So, the Luton car, if the image is authentic (and this has not been verified), was parked at right angles to the parking bays on a ramp arriving at Level 3, where it is already on fire towards the front of the vehicle. The Fire Brigade would appear to consider such a 'parking spot' to be a factor in fire spread.


With flames shooting out to the sides low down and at the high temperatures associated with a lithium fire, then this would soon be uncontainable despite all best efforts.


Would sprinklers have helped? Almost certainly, if only to slow the spread down in other parts of the car park and other levels. Fire hates water.
Click to expand...
You obviously misunderstand. The report is saying cars parked on the ramps between levels might have provided a way for fire to spread from car to car and thus from level to level.

I'm absolutely not going to take you as an authority on recognising a battery fire from any other type of fire.

I also note you don't know how many cars were already alight when the brigade's fire fighting measures began.
 
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Jack by the hedge said:
You obviously misunderstand. The report is saying cars parked on the ramps between levels might have provided a way for fire to spread from car to car and thus from level to level.

I'm absolutely not going to take you as an authority on recognising a battery fire from any other type of fire.

I also note you don't know how many cars were already alight when the brigade's fire fighting measures began.
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Redundant. Every response to Vixen could start with this.
 
Vixen said:
You re missing the point the fire brigade were there within minutes. Within half an houu they had to withdraw as the whole place was a raging inferno.

Have a look at this video at about 6:57 to get some idea of the sheer intensity of a lithium battery fire, which only needs some kind of pressure or internal fault to set it off.



https://youtu.be/t1j9TUV5coc?si=yhoi6xkgLrOcNlGB

This might help inform you why firefighters ended up being hospitalised with smoke inhalation within minutes and the entire fire brigade needing to withdraw to tackle the raging inferno from outside the building.

[qimg]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53275430148_51cb8f53fd_c.jpg[/qimg]JLR by Username Vixen, on Flickr

At this stage, subject to verification, the Luton fire is consistent with a diesel hybrid fire, emanating from the lithium battery.
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Amazing! The 'epicentre' of the fire looks to be coming from just right of centre of the engine bay (left from the perspective shown), which just happens to be exactly where the fuel lines run and enter the engine block on this particular car.
I wonder, is that a coincidence Vixen?
 
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