“Woke”

[pgwenthold]

How did you determine that it was acceptable?

How did you determine that it was ordinary?

And, on the contrary, I don't care if another person thinks it is "acceptable." Acceptable is a value judgement.

Great, so this person thinks the gap is acceptable. YMMV

To bring this back to my previous comment, what Florida has done is to make a law that says that promoting the belief that the gap is unacceptable is illegal.

 

[Ziggurat]

To bring this back to my previous comment, what Florida has done is to make a law that says that promoting the belief that the gap is unacceptable is illegal.

No, it has not done that.

People are fixated on one of two quotes concerning the definition of the phrase "woke" (while ignoring the other), but "woke" doesn't appear in the text of relevant legislation, so neither of those quotes is even legally relevant.

 

[Hercules56]

A teacher in SF refuses to teach black kids proper grammar, as she feels it is all about white supremacy and colonialism. She thinks her students are just fine talking ****** English. Talk about "Woke".

 

[wareyin]

You claimed everyone agreed with you about my post. You haven't backed that up. Bummer, that.

If you honestly think that was my claim, you should be able to quote me saying it. The fact that I never said it means that I don't have to back it up. Funny how that works.

Look, you admitted even you see that your post was poorly written. Chalk up your point not being clear to your poorly written post, and we can call it a day. Pretending that even though you know your post was written poorly it's still anyone else's fault that your point wasn't made is just bad form.

 

[BobTheCoward]

A teacher in SF refuses to teach black kids proper grammar, as she feels it is all about white supremacy and colonialism. She thinks her students are just fine talking ****** English. Talk about "Woke".

English grammar is a description of how English is written and spoken, not a series of rules one has to follow. Language evolves

 

[wareyin]

No, it has not done that.

People are fixated on one of two quotes concerning the definition of the phrase "woke" (while ignoring the other), but "woke" doesn't appear in the text of relevant legislation, so neither of those quotes is even legally relevant.

People are fixated on the more broadly relevant definition, you say? Why ever do you think that might be?

And the word "woke" isn't in the text, so it doesn't matter anyway? What silly semantic nonsense.

 

[wareyin]

A teacher in SF refuses to teach black kids proper grammar, as she feels it is all about white supremacy and colonialism. She thinks her students are just fine talking ****** English. Talk about "Woke".

As you've provided no link, and judging by your history of taking right wing misleading sources/statements at face value and then repeating them here, I think it's pretty safe to say:

Yeah, sure that happened.

 

[Hercules56]

As you've provided no link, and judging by your history of taking right wing misleading sources/statements at face value and then repeating them here, I think it's pretty safe to say:

Yeah, sure that happened.

https://www.foxnews.com/media/calif...-grammar-is-part-white-supremacy-undermine-bs

A self-identified "cringey" California English teacher claimed she combats "white supremacy" "B.S." in her classroom by teaching students about the overemphasized importance of grammar usage and writing rules.

Marta Shaffer, a tenured English teacher at Oroville High School, began the 2022-2023 academic year by teaching parts of linguistics as a way of "fighting white supremacy in my classes," according to her posts on TikTok. The goal was to be "inclusive of all kinds of ways we use the language."

According to Shaffer, expectations for students to use proper grammar and syntax is part of White supremacy culture that "runs deep."

he said, "We study linguistics and the rules that we actually use to communicate instead of the made-up rules that White supremacy created for when we write papers and stuff, which is what scholars call the 'language of power.'"

The teacher praised students' academic essays for including "AAVE" language – African-American Vernacular English.

"As an educator I am constantly worried if I'm the problem. What do I mean by that? Well public education is an institution that upholds lots of problematic systems in our society like white supremacy, and misogyny and colonization, etc," she continued. "Well, let's look at how we write essays [where we] start with an introduction that includes a thesis, always cite your sources, use transition words like ‘however’ and ‘therefore.’ These are all made-up rules. They were created by Westerners in power. Which got me thinking, what if I started my school year with a unit honoring how we talk rather than teaching students how to write properly."

 

[wareyin]

https://www.foxnews.com/media/calif...-grammar-is-part-white-supremacy-undermine-bs

A self-identified "cringey" California English teacher claimed she combats "white supremacy" "B.S." in her classroom by teaching students about the overemphasized importance of grammar usage and writing rules.

Marta Shaffer, a tenured English teacher at Oroville High School, began the 2022-2023 academic year by teaching parts of linguistics as a way of "fighting white supremacy in my classes," according to her posts on TikTok. The goal was to be "inclusive of all kinds of ways we use the language."

According to Shaffer, expectations for students to use proper grammar and syntax is part of White supremacy culture that "runs deep."

he said, "We study linguistics and the rules that we actually use to communicate instead of the made-up rules that White supremacy created for when we write papers and stuff, which is what scholars call the 'language of power.'"

The teacher praised students' academic essays for including "AAVE" language – African-American Vernacular English.

"As an educator I am constantly worried if I'm the problem. What do I mean by that? Well public education is an institution that upholds lots of problematic systems in our society like white supremacy, and misogyny and colonization, etc," she continued. "Well, let's look at how we write essays [where we] start with an introduction that includes a thesis, always cite your sources, use transition words like ‘however’ and ‘therefore.’ These are all made-up rules. They were created by Westerners in power. Which got me thinking, what if I started my school year with a unit honoring how we talk rather than teaching students how to write properly."

And what do you know, you just proved me correct. The teacher isn't refusing to teach black kids proper grammar, and your source was right wing misinformation!

Thanks.

 

[Hercules56]

And what do you know, you just proved me correct. The teacher isn't refusing to teach black kids proper grammar, and your source was right wing misinformation!

Thanks.

She is teaching her students that English grammar is bad and evil.

The article I posted contained ZERO misinformation.

I understand you hate Fox News but that doesn't mean everything they publish is a lie. Such an attitude is a bit delusional.

 

[wareyin]

She is teaching her students that English grammar is bad and evil.

The article I posted contained ZERO misinformation.

I understand you hate Fox News but that doesn't mean everything they publish is a lie. Such an attitude is a bit delusional.

Dude, the quotes you provided were about a single unit that she taught, not the entire school year. And even then not one of them said that English grammar is bad and evil.

I understand that Fox "news" knows how to spin a story for the credulous, and we see it working every day.

 

[Hercules56]

Dude, the quotes you provided were about a single unit that she taught, not the entire school year. And even then not one of them said that English grammar is bad and evil.

I understand that Fox "news" knows how to spin a story for the credulous, and we see it working every day.

She said English grammar is directly connected to white supremacy and colonialism. Are you suggesting white supremacy and colonialism are not bad things?

 

[Ziggurat]

If you honestly think that was my claim, you should be able to quote me saying it. The fact that I never said it means that I don't have to back it up. Funny how that works.

I'm sure you didn't mean to imply that there was a discrepancy when you posted about different people giving different "versions", it's everyone who read your words that was at fault. As usual.

So you might be right, if you're the only person who read my post. Otherwise, well....

 

[Ziggurat]

And the word "woke" isn't in the text, so it doesn't matter anyway? What silly semantic nonsense.

"Woke" isn't in the text of the law, so there's no legal relevance to the definition of the word (and the definition of words that are in the law aren't determined by the AG anyways). You can call that silly semantic nonsense if you want, but that's the way the law works.

 

[wareyin]

So you might be right, if you're the only person who read my post. Otherwise, well....

Nope, still nothing in that post about everyone agreeing with me champ. The post pointed out that you blame everyone but yourself for your poor communication, sure, but that's a different claim that what you apparently thought I made. Then again, it's not like poor reading comprehension and a lack of ability to write clearly are completely separate things. I shouldn't be so hard on you.

"Woke" isn't in the text of the law, so there's no legal relevance to the definition of the word (and the definition of words that are in the law aren't determined by the AG anyways). You can call that silly semantic nonsense if you want, but that's the way the law works.

'Look, even though the lawmakers themselves used the word in relation to the bill, that doesn't mean that their definition of the word they publicly said the bill was meant to combat is relevant here!' he says, flapping his arms hard enough to cause a hurricane he hopes will distract his audience.

 

[Ziggurat]

Nope, still nothing in that post about everyone agreeing with me champ. The post pointed out that you blame everyone but yourself for your poor communication

You are the only person who seems to have a problem understanding what I wrote.

'Look, even though the lawmakers themselves used the word in relation to the bill, that doesn't mean that their definition of the word they publicly said the bill was meant to combat is relevant here!' he says, flapping his arms hard enough to cause a hurricane he hopes will distract his audience.

Relevant to what? I'm sure it's relevant to their efforts to fundraise and get re-elected. But it's not relevant to what is or isn't illegal, which is the subject of pgwenthold's post that I responded to. On that matter, you're the one flapping your arms.

 

[wareyin]

You are the only person who seems to have a problem understanding what I wrote.

"the only person taking you to task" =/= "the only person who saw your error"

Relevant to what? I'm sure it's relevant to their efforts to fundraise and get re-elected. But it's not relevant to what is or isn't illegal, which is the subject of pgwenthold's post that I responded to. On that matter, you're the one flapping your arms.

Relevant to the bill. Seriously, pretending that how the author defines the words he or she uses to describe the bill doesn't matter is about the most head in the sand way to look at it.

 

[Ziggurat]

"the only person taking you to task" =/= "the only person who saw your error"

As a logical possibility, yes. But no evidence of these other people has been presented. And you made the only demonstrable error in misinterpreting my post. At worst, my writing was not as clear as it could have been. Oh noes.

Relevant to the bill. Seriously, pretending that how the author defines the words he or she uses to describe the bill doesn't matter is about the most head in the sand way to look at it.

Again, matter to what, exactly? If a word isn't part of a statute, then it has no legal weight in regards to that statute. That isn't exactly hard to understand, and yet you still struggle.

 

[wareyin]

As a logical possibility, yes. But no evidence of these other people has been presented. And you made the only demonstrable error in misinterpreting my post. At worst, my writing was not as clear as it could have been. Oh noes.

So, if I were to post a link to a guy who says your writing wasn't clear, then I'd win? What about if I quoted him instead? Dude, it isn't an error to think you claimed one sentence was from pgwenthold and a different one from d4m10n when that's exactly what you wrote.

Again, matter to what, exactly? If a word isn't part of a statute, then it has no legal weight in regards to that statute. That isn't exactly hard to understand, and yet you still struggle.

Zig, where was this definition stated? Do you understand that testimony in a court case has relevance to that court case?

 

[Ziggurat]

So, if I were to post a link to a guy who says your writing wasn't clear, then I'd win?

"Win" is a bit strong, since there's no prize. But it would provide some support for your claim.

Dude, it isn't an error to think you claimed one sentence was from pgwenthold

It was from him, in the sense that pgwenthold first provided that quote here (and did not provide a link).

and a different one from d4m10n when that's exactly what you wrote.

I said it was from d4m10n's link, not from d4m10n (who never posted the quote). Seriously, go back and check exactly what I wrote.

Zig, where was this definition stated? Do you understand that testimony in a court case has relevance to that court case?

It's potentially relevant to that specific court case (but not automatically so). But so what? I don't think you understand what that court case was about. What it's not about is the "Woke" bill, or even a claim of illegal behavior on the part of Warren, which makes the definition of "woke" completely irrelevant to pgwenthold's claim.