johnny karate
... and your little dog too.
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This isn't last time. Many significant variables have changed.
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Trump's Tuesday announcement... what will it be?
This isn't last time. Many significant variables have changed.
Losing an election is not a punishment. Political failure is not a punishment.
To use the metaphor I did before. Imagine you are in a group and you are voting on what to have for dinner. 51% of you choose Pizza and 49% of you choose "Kill the other people and eat them for dinner."
Even if "Pizza" wins in the end you still a REALLY big problem that needs addressing.
"Reaching the limit of how much you are allowed to **** around" isn't the same thing as "finding out."
Thermal
August Member
The biggest one is that he still has supporters after J6. They don't care about democracy or have respect for our country, and are not even hiding it anymore. That's unnerving.
johnny karate
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I think many people are failing to appreciate just how historic and consequential the 2022 election was, and what it means in the bigger picture.
2020 felt like a by-the-skin of-our-teeth pushback against Trump and his cult.
2022 is a sound rejection of everything Trump and his cult stands for.
Look, I'm not trying to convince anyone to not feel bad about the prospects for 2024, I'm just saying that there are a lot of good reasons why you don't have to.
The election was like a week ago. Both sides haven't even had time to come up with narratives about it yet.
I'll feel bad until Trump, or really anyone, faces consequences that aren't "Well they reached a point where they had to stop doing it."
I'll feel bad until Trump, or really anyone, faces consequences that aren't "Well they reached a point where they had to stop doing it."
Thermal
August Member
Why would all those Alpha males want to vote for Trump when he was beaten by the Beta Biden? They don't want a loser!!
Of course I am
Of course I am
johnny karate
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I'm not saying that we don't have very serious problems to contend with regarding Trump and his cult. We do. The wheels of justice turn slowly, but they do turn.
What I am saying is that the American electorate has now rejected Trump and his brand of politics three times in a row, which each subsequent defeat more resounding than the last. It seems pretty clear that we're sick of this guy, and I don't see how that gets turned around in the next two years.
Thermal
August Member
I'd venture that a lot of Trumpsters don't vote midterms, because their boy is not on the ticket. Many of them don't want Republicans in office, per se. They want Trump and the neo-fascism he represents in the White House.
Also, it isn't uncommon to have one party controlling Congress and the other in the Presidency. This isn't over just yet
johnny karate
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No offense, but you weren't that concerned about the insurrection on January 6th as it was happening. The threat - while still there and still very potent - isn't somehow worse now. And MAGA cultists committing acts of terrorism isn't going to put Trump back in the White House.
And no offense but you're describing pretty much exactly where Hitler was roughly... about halfwayish between the Beer Hall Pustch and the first Jew going in the gas chamber.
And hell Hitler actually went to prison after he tried his coup.
And hell Hitler actually went to prison after he tried his coup.
johnny karate
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No one said it was over. No one said we shouldn't remain vigilant and continue fighting. We absolutely should.
And by the way, we don't have one party controlling Congress and one the other in the Presidency. And that is extremely, historically uncommon.
Also we are just conveniently ignoring that the Republicans own SCOTUS probably the rest of some our lives.
Democrats will not actually have a full government majority ever, at least on a timeline worth talking about in this context.
So talk "Oh but one party controlling the whole government...." is something of a red herring.
Democrats will not actually have a full government majority ever, at least on a timeline worth talking about in this context.
So talk "Oh but one party controlling the whole government...." is something of a red herring.
johnny karate
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Again, not trying to tell you that you can't be pessimistic. I'm just trying to point out that there are legitimate reasons to feel optimistic.
kookbreaker
Evil Fokker
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New York Post on this: Florida Man makes announcement. Placed at the very bottom of the front page.
Thermal
August Member
Come on, man, we've been over this. I was working on a jobsite and getting poor coverage, and I underestimated the threat. When I got up to speed, I copped to being wrong and was quick to call it an insurrection and that he should be promtly arrested for inciting imminent lawless action.
I think that if you can still support Trump after his profoundly un-American behavior, that is waaaaaaaay worse than it was before. If they can accept J6 and Ratzenberger, they can accept swastikas. There's no more fig leaves. Its not a potential problem anymore. It passed critical mass.
johnny karate
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Hey, I said "no offense".
Again, I acknowledge that the danger still exists. But that is a separate issue from whether or not Trump can regain the presidency. And I'm pretty sure his supporters committing additional acts of terrorism in his name would put a damper on those prospects.
Thermal
August Member
Hey, I said "no offense".
Again, I acknowledge that the danger still exists. But that is a separate issue from whether or not Trump can regain the presidency. And I'm pretty sure his supporters committing additional acts of terrorism in his name would put a damper on those prospects.
Ok. How did you feel about Trump's chances in 2016? I fully expected a Clinton landslide. Did you underestimate The Rise of the Stupid back then? Do you think they evolved since then or devolved?
And, full disclosure, I am pretty much the poster child for sneering at the "This will finally be the Trump Downfall Moment(R)!" because I've heard so many times.
As someone once put it "Stop telling me the noose is tightening. He's always that color."
As someone once put it "Stop telling me the noose is tightening. He's always that color."
johnny karate
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Trump caught pretty much everyone by surprise in 2016. But this isn’t 2016. We see him coming this time.
And as for the Rise of Stupid, yes, that’s definitely gotten worse. But here’s the thing: The Stupid didn’t put Trump into office in 2016. The swing voters who thought an outspoken outsider should be a given a chance did. And those same swing voters saw what Trump brought to the table and then rejected him three election cycles in a row. I’m not seeing how he wins them back.