The Jan. 6 Investigation

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The story is falling apart.
Rep. Jamie Raskin (D-MD) told reporters after the second day of the House Select Committee hearings about the Jan.6 attack on Congress..."It's very important for everyone to see that not only was the 'big lie' a big lie, but Donald Trump must have known it was a big lie unless as William Barr put it, 'he was detached from reality.' But we're going to assume that the president of the United States was connected to reality. And in that case, he had to listen to the attorney general of the United States, all of the White House lawyers, and the campaign lawyers and campaign advisers — they were all telling him the same thing. It was over. He'd lost the election." Raw Story dot com link

Everyone from trump's daughter to his attorney general told him: You lost. But trump doggedly pursued his one-in-a-million shot at remaining in power -- he's still at it -- and as a direct result did incalculable damage to the United States.
 
The story is falling apart.

Everyone from trump's daughter to his attorney general told him: You lost. But trump doggedly pursued his one-in-a-million shot at remaining in power -- he's still at it -- and as a direct result did incalculable damage to the United States.

He also went with the crazies, Pillow Guy, Giuliani & Powell, as well as the manipulative, Eastman & Clark because they were telling him what he wanted to hear: that there actually was evidence of massive voter fraud, and that he could stop the EC certification.

He's mentally ill so at some point wishful thinking could have begun to sound real to him.

I think underneath though, he knew there was no massive fraud.
 
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This is where you and I part company.
You rejoice at the downfall of the GOP.
I see what happened to the GOP..to it's going over to the dark side...as a natiional tragedy.
I do not like the idea of one party rule, period. no matter which party.
You need a legitimate opposition party to act as a check on the party in power.
I got a sick feeling that some progressived here have no more problem with one party rule then the MAGARATS do..provided it's the right party.
 
I see that Giuliani apparently was drunk on election night when be begun to spout the "election was stolen" nonsense. God, it just get worse and worse for Giuliani.
 
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This is where you and I part company.
You rejoice at the downfall of the GOP.
I see what happened to the GOP..to it's going over to the dark side...as a natiional tragedy.
I do not like the idea of one party rule, period. no matter which party.
You need a legitimate opposition party to act as a check on the party in power.
I got a sick feeling that some progressived here have no more problem with one party rule then the MAGARATS do..provided it's the right party.
I was fine with two parties until McConnell made it official all GOP legislators (Senate and House) had to vote as a bloc and had to torpedo any Democratic legislation regardless of its merit.
 
This is where you and I part company.
You rejoice at the downfall of the GOP.
I see what happened to the GOP..to it's going over to the dark side...as a natiional tragedy.
I do not like the idea of one party rule, period. no matter which party.
You need a legitimate opposition party to act as a check on the party in power.
I got a sick feeling that some progressived here have no more problem with one party rule then the MAGARATS do..provided it's the right party.

I think you are misunderstanding.

I do not celebrate the downfall of the GOP although I will say that if they do fall, it is entirely down to their own actions - they have no-one to blame but themselves. I have heard it said several times by various posters here, as well as media commentators such as Nicole Wallace, Michael Steele, Joe Scarborough and Mika Brzezinsk, that they haven't left the Republican Party, but instead, the party moved way to the right and left them. I think that probably applies to Liz Cheney as well, and she is only just realizing it. For example, a party that votes 100% against gun law reform when its own members are 60-80% for gun law reform is not properly representing is electorate.

Democracy needs to have challenges its views. I simply agree with what the poster said, that the facts undermine the Republican party. Not the investigation.
 
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I think you are misunderstanding.

I do not celebrate the downfall of the GOP although I will say that if they do fall, it is entirely down to their own actions - they have no-one to blame but themselves. I have heard it said several times by various posters here, as well as media commentators such as Nicole Wallace, Michael Steele, Joe Scarborough and Mika Brzezinsk, that they haven't left the Republican Party, but instead, the party moved way to the right and left them. I think that probably applies to Liz Cheney as well, and she is only just realizing it. For example, a party that votes 100% against gun law reform when its own members are 60-80% for gun law reform is not properly representing is electorate.

Democracy needs to have challenges its views. I simply agree with what the poster said, that the facts undermine the Republican party. Not the investigation.

Sorry I misunderstood you.
I think the gop made a fatal mistake, back in 2009, when, in the wake of the Obama victory, they panicked and embraced the far right, which they had keeps at arms length before then. They thought they could somehow control the extremists and somehow use them, then push them to the side when they were no longet useful, Instead, the extremists took over.
Not the first time that had happened. Making a deal with extremists have never really worked well for those making the deal.
 
I admit:I want more details on Giuliani being bombed on election night and giving Trump advice which Trump apparetnly took.
I have never seen a fall from the heights like that of Giuliani. From America's Mayor to Trump's Chump. I guess the urge to power got the best of him.
 
I was fine with two parties until McConnell made it official all GOP legislators (Senate and House) had to vote as a bloc and had to torpedo any Democratic legislation regardless of its merit.

Yeah, but that does not change the fact that One Party Rule..no matter what the ideology of the party...and Democracy just do not go together. Power inevitably will corrupt the party in power.
 
Yeah, but that does not change the fact that One Party Rule..no matter what the ideology of the party...and Democracy just do not go together. Power inevitably will corrupt the party in power.

I think the right number of political parties is zero. So did Thomas Jefferson.
 
I think the right number of political parties is zero. So did Thomas Jefferson.

I'm glad you modified with 'political' cause when I was attending Jefferson's old school in Williamsburg we most definitely were in agreement that the more parties the better! :D
 
Sorry I misunderstood you.
I think the gop made a fatal mistake, back in 2009, when, in the wake of the Obama victory, they panicked and embraced the far right, which they had keeps at arms length before then. They thought they could somehow control the extremists and somehow use them, then push them to the side when they were no longet useful, Instead, the extremists took over.
Not the first time that had happened. Making a deal with extremists have never really worked well for those making the deal.

Either that or McConnell was a racist. Could be though he saw Obama ushering in a much too liberal for rich guys/pro business folks to tolerate.

Who knows how many closeted racists in the GOP overreacted to Obama's win.

As for extremists, that started when Rove courted the single issue anti-abortion voters. Somewhere in the the TEA party folks flourished.

Then there are the John Birchers (Kochs, Mercers) who do a lot of candidate funding.
 
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Good luck with getting rid of them. though.

Well TJ couldn't do it. The two major parties were at each other's throats. That being Jefferson's Democratic Republicans and Adam's Federalists.


I'm glad you modified with 'political' cause when I was attending Jefferson's old school in Williamsburg we most definitely were in agreement that the more parties the better! :D

Beautiful School. I'm on the West Coast and a good friend of mine graduated from UVA. He loved his time there.
 
Willful ignorance and intentionally blind self-interest have made themselves globally famous through Trump Republican attachment to utter BS. Among evangelicals, these have a third companion, the self-appointed prophet, who counterargues with "God speaks to me and said...". Trump's Republican Party and its deluded supporters consciously embrace duplicity, falsehood, and betrayal.

Which is why, should the US magically come out of all this without a coup (doubtful), the SCOTUS judges that seditionists placed in high office must all be impeached. Duplicitous fanboys and fangirls of falsehood cannot sit on the high court.
 
From the transcript

REP ZOE LOFGREN (D-CA):
Well, thank — thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Stirewalt. I'd like you to explain a term that was thrown around a lot during the election and that's the so-called red mirage. What does that mean?

CHRIS STIREWALT: (Former Political editor at Fox News)
So in the 40 or 50 years, let's say, that Americans have increasingly chosen to vote by mail or early or absentee Democrats prefer that method of voting more than Republicans do.

So basically in every election, Republicans win Election Day and Democrats win the early vote, and then you wait and start counting. And it depends on which ones you count first, but usually it's Election Day votes that get counted first. And you see the Republicans shoot ahead. And then the process of — of bailing and binding and unbinding all those mail in votes in some states like Pennsylvania refused to count the votes first.

So you have to wait for all of that to come in. So in every election and certainly a national election, you expect to see the Republican with a lead, but it's not really a lead. When you put together a jigsaw puzzle, it doesn't matter which piece you put in first, it ends up with the same image. So for us, who cares?

I really don't get why you do things this way.

Here, the counting of early votes, mail-in ballots (which must be postmarked no later than the day prior to the election) and special votes*, begins the moment the polls open at 7am on Election Day. By the time the polls close at 7pm, the vast majority of those votes and ballots have already been counted and tallied, so the the numbers hit the TV screens of the nation within a few minutes of each channel's "Decision 'YY" broadcasts beginning.

As soon as the Polling Booths close, a few members of the counting teams continue to count the remainder of the early/mail-in votes, while the rest begin counting the in-person votes for their electorate. Between 11pm and midnight on Election Day, 99% of ALL votes have been counted, and the result is known.

The only votes not counted on Election Day are valid mail-in votes that have not arrived, and overseas votes from NZ citizens outside of the country on Election Day.

Now, I can hear some of you already saying... "bbbbbut you only have about 3 million votes to count, we have 140 million - 45 times as many". While that is true, it is also true that you have 68 times our population, more than enough to get the job done. Even more importantly, we don't have voting machines. Every single one of those 3 million ballots are counted by hand.

*Special votes: These are votes by registered voters who were away from their electorate on polling day. They can go to any Polling Booth with their Voting Card and ID, and cast an absentee vote. (every Polling booth is equipped with every electoral roll and voting forms for every electorate in the country.
 
I have just finished watching the whole of Day 2 of the hearings

This hearing is showing that it is 100% abundantly clear, repeated over and over by multiple Republican witnesses, including his own AG, that Trump absolutely knew there was no fraud, and he absolutely knew that he lost!
 
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For example, the committee, predictably, is putting great stock in former AG William Barr's testimony that he found no evidence of election fraud and told Trump that claims of widespread election fraud were baseless.

But Barr conducted no "investigation." He did not interview any of the hundreds of election workers and observers who reported witnessing election fraud..
After watching witness testimony from the hearing, I just wanted to add this to my earlier post to comprehensively debunk your deliberate lies and the rest of the unmitigated crap you have been posting...
WILLIAM BARR: (Attorney General)
"Right out of the box on election night, the President claimed that there was major fraud underway. I mean, this happened as far as I could tell before there was actually any potential of looking at evidence."

So The Fat Orange Turd was claiming fraud before there was even any possibility of seeing any evidence of fraud!


WILLIAM BARR:
"The department, in fact, when we received specific and credible allegations of fraud, made an effort to look into these to satisfy ourselves that they were without merit. And — and I was in the posture of trying to figure out — there was an avalanche of all these allegations of fraud that built up over a number of days."

"And it was like playing Whack-A-Mole, because something would come out one day and then the next day it would be another issue. Also, I was influenced by the fact that all the early claims that I understood on — were — were completely bogus and silly and usually based on complete misinformation. And so, I — I didn't consider the quality of claims right out of the box to give me any, you know, feeling that there was really substance here."

So Bill Barr did actually investigate reports of election fraud, and you are lying about that.

RICHARD DONOGHUE: (Deputy Acting Attorney General)
"I tried to again put this in perspective and to try to put it in very clear terms to the President. And I said something to the effect of sir, we've done dozens of investigations, hundreds of interviews. The major allegations are not supported by the evidence developed. We've looked at Georgia, Pennsylvania, Michigan, Nevada.
We're doing our job. Much of the info you're getting is false. And then I went into for instance this thing from Michigan this report about 68 percent error rate. Reality is it was only 0.0063 percent error rate, less than one in 15,000. So the President accepted that. He said, Ok, fine, but what about the others?"

When he said "we've done dozens of investigations, , hundreds of interviews" he is not talking just about himself, he is talking the DoJ, and that means that those investigations were also done under Barr. This again confirms that you are lying about Barr not investigating fraud claims."

He did not explain the damning video evidence from the State Farm Arena in Atlanta, Georgia, in which Democratic election workers are seen pulling out crates of ballots from underneath tables late at night after the GOP observers were sent home.
RICHARD DONOGHUE:
"...Ok, well, with regard to Georgia, we looked at the tape, we interviewed the witnesses, there is no suitcase. The President kept fixating on this suitcase that supposedly had fraudulent ballots and that the suitcase was rolled out from under the table. And I said, no, sir, there is no suitcase.

You can watch the video over and over. There is no suitcase. There is a wheeled bin where they carry the ballots and that's just how they move ballots around that facility. There's nothing suspicious about that at all. I told him that there was no multiple scanning of the ballots — one the one part of that allegation was that they were taking one ballot and scanning it through three or four or five times to rack up votes presumably for Vice President Biden.

I told him that the video did not support that. Then he went off on double voting the top of the next page. He said dead people are voting. Indians are getting paid to vote. He meant people on Native American reservations. He said there's lots of fraud going on here. Told him flat out that much of the information he's getting is false and or just not supported by the evidence. We looked at the allegations, but they don't pan out. "

These are ALL Republican witnesses, all people in Trump's own administration. There isn't much more to say, is there. except that you posts are full of outright lies!
 
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Former trump Attorney General William Barr laughed at the movie, "2000 Mules." He told the House panel-
Former Attorney General Bill Barr scoffed at the pro-Trump election lies movie “2000 Mules” as “singularly unimpressive” in newly released testimony to the congressional committee investigating the Jan. 6 attack on the Capitol...“The premise if you go by five boxes (of ballots) you’re a mule, that’s just indefensible,” Barr added. Link to NY Daily News article

Moviemaker Dinesh D’Souza reacted to Barr's testimony by saying, "The level of ignorance displayed by Bill Barr here is truly stunning."
 
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