• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Cont: Cancel culture IRL Part 2

I still feel like insular communities like the internet and college campus "count" in a different way.

Again, touch grass. And the 'quad' doesn't count.
 
JoeMorgue said:
I still feel like insular communities like the internet and college campus "count" in a different way.

Again, touch grass. And the 'quad' doesn't count.
Click to expand...

I'm very curious what other people who have had classes with this lady might think. She sounds exhausting personally. Nothing she describes in this op-ed comes close to anything resembling censorship, it just sounds like people get annoyed by an obnoxious "debate me" kid or, even worse, decide not to associate with people socially who hold views they find morally incompatible.

Jamelle Bouie's take on this sums it up pretty well for me:

every time i see one of those “there’s a culture of self censorship because no one wants to debate me” pieces i have to wonder what world a person lives in where everyone is interested in debating everything

there is a reason that i, as an 18-year-old little weirdo, joined a debating society in college. it was so those of us freaks who like to argue all the time could do it among each other, away from normal people

also, and i sort of already said this, but c’mon. UVA is a school where kids where blazers & pearls to football games, & where one of the marquee events of the year is where people put on sundresses and seersucker, drink and “watch” horse races. hostile to conservatives it is not

and i say all of this as a proud wahoo who has nothing but affection for the time i spent there
Click to expand...

https://twitter.com/jbouie/status/1500816423135981574?cxt=HHwWjMC94bml_NMpAAAA

My own experience with going to state school is that classroom debate only occasionally played a large role as an educational tool.

Slow news day I guess that this is something worth publishing in the NYTimes.
 
Last edited:
I wonder what kind of critique the anonymous roommate might offer if he heard these students talking about this lecture, a free talk at UV given by “Young America's Foundation” whose landing slogan is “The Conservative Movement Starts Here.” The speakers are Chip Roy, Texas house rep who’s been in the news saying the Ukraine invasion is Biden’s fault and anyway isn’t the real issue of the day all the Americans being killed by the Covid vaccines and then being counted by the CDC as Covid deaths? And Rich “The Case For Nationalism” Lowry.

Being afraid of an uncomfortable conversation with your schoolmates is the bedrock of self-censorship I guess. It’s practically the same as having to worry about genuine systemic reprisals. I’m pretty sure no minority groups ever had to go through that kind of thing and find the backbone to just deal with it like adults. Although to be fair if they need a break from having their ideas challenged, a chance to recoup their mental resilience, they could look into this idea I’ve heard of recently: “safe spaces!”
 
Lithrael said:
I wonder what kind of critique the anonymous roommate might offer if he heard these students talking about this lecture,
Click to expand...

Most likely a a crybully ragefest where the roommate goes full Mongol on the living space necessitating a police intervention involving a taser and a spit hood then transport to a mental health facility for a psychiatric intervention followed by a stay of indeterminate length in a rubber room while clad in a straitjacket.

That's my guess anyways seeing as how the author is progressive ( as evidenced by her course selection and writings ) technically now she's a progressive in exile but anyway...

Progressives can only have other progressives as friends and progressives can only have other progressives as roommates especially this far into the school year so she could really only fear a disagreement the progressive roommate having a Chernobyl like meltdown at the mention of this event that all involved would surly be looking down their noses at.
 
My snarky tone aside I can see where finding your opinion isn’t automatically a welcome addition to the class when you’re used to sharing it, is jarring. Discovering that some fellow students might side-eye and judge you over your political or moral positions can make you feel the sting of not being one of the in-group, especially if they actually make up the majority. And I’m not even kidding when I say safe spaces where you can talk with like-minded students and examine these incidents and opinions without that tension, or just relax with your own in-group for a while, can be useful, restful and refreshing, and give you back your gumption for speaking up for yourself to the broader public.

Although I do hope the issues you choose to pursue with the broader student body are debatable ones like how much you can justify moral judgements of other cultures, or whether the achievements of historical figures should necessarily be contrasted with their misdeeds; and not like, antivax conspiracies, or whether keeping the mother of a bunch of your children as a chattel slave was really such a big deal back then…. but to each their own I guess.
 
Last edited:
Maybe I need to reread the piece, but I'm not seeing anything that comes from this one-sided, generous interpretation of events that even approaches censorship or chilling of speech. What this student describes is people occasionally disagreeing with her opinions, which seems to make her uncomfortable.

It's a huge wet fart of an article. I'm not even entirely sure what it's trying to claim. Is she upset because people disagree with her, or is she upset that people aren't willing to constantly get into knock-down drag-out intellectual battles with her? She complains both people being vocal in their disagreement and people being more restrained about voicing an opinion.

Pile on some throwaway lines about the sizes of posters allowed and cancelled speakers and you have a perfect grab-bag of half-defined cancel culture nonsense.
 
Last edited:
The problem with applying the safe space concept to situations like these is that safe spaces don't serve to shield progressives from the ire of other progressives, they're only really meant to keep out the white cishet cudebros with everyone else being allowed to enter based on whatever axis of oppression they're currently working on.

In this case we have a white feminist who's angered the antiracist crowd so the antiracists would be able to follow the feminist into the safe space even trailing a bias response team if they choose and quite possibly have the white feminist evicted from the safe space but sanctioned further.

It might be argued that those opposed to the term "cancel culture" are acting in a racist manner considering the term rose to popularity on Black Twitter.

Meanwhile, cancel culture arose within Black culture and appears to channel Black empowerment movements dating as far back as the civil rights boycotts of the 1950s and ’60s.

Vox said:
“While the terminology of cancel culture may be new and most applicable to social media through Black Twitter, in particular, the concept of being canceled is not new to Black culture,” Anne Charity Hudley, chair of linguistics of African America for the University of California Santa Barbara, told Vox. Hudley, who studies Black vernacular and the use of language in cultural conversations like this one, described canceling as “a survival skill as old as the Southern black use of the boycott.”
Click to expand...

The author is correct, survival in the progressive world does require a massive amount of self censorship and an ability to read the room on a minute by minute basis. A lone Internet based progressive might not realize this and should probably be brought to heel by his/her/enby fellow progressives as that lone poster may not be aware that that objection to the term "cancel culture" is a tell that the truly progressive recognize as a red flag.

Some here might remember the story of Atheism+ and how they went after Skepchicks enmasse and celebrated smashing their Surlys after one to the Skepchicks members made a comment that offended one on the plussers. Not only is that an example of cancel culture (attempted) in action it's also a perfect example of how intra-progressive bickering and one upmanship (uppersonship) does and has led to the downfall of many a progressive organization.

Including Atheism+ itself.
 
That's where "Cancel Culture" and "Cause Purity" become two VERY different things.

But a lot of this is "branding" which is always pointless and stupid when applied to social movements.
 
The author is relating her experiences about being effectively cancelled by her peers.

It's 2022, time to get with the modern terminology or forever languish in ye olde pits of yesteryear.
 
Stout said:
The author is relating her experiences about being effectively cancelled by her peers.

It's 2022, time to get with the modern terminology or forever languish in ye olde pits of yesteryear.
Click to expand...

Again Progressivism and Liberalism does have many, many, many annoying habits, but demanding we live in a world where you can't just casually use slurs is not one of them. "Oh lord I have to keep track of it all, I can't call the black people the N-word, I can't call the gays faggots, I mean where does it end I simply can't keep track of it all!" is not a hill you want to die defending.

And please explain to me what the **** "being cancelled by your peers" is supposed to mean, because from where I'm standing that sounds a lot like "People don't like me anymore."
 
Last edited:
'Progressive disagreement is making some people self-censor so the progressives have to self-censor' is just 'the wrong people are using free speech' with more steps.
 
"But the wrong people are doing it" has always been the only point. There's never been a single argument in this now 36 page, 2nd continuation cluster that suggested anyone has argument that advances one step beyond that.
 
Stout said:
The author is relating her experiences about being effectively cancelled by her peers.

It's 2022, time to get with the modern terminology or forever languish in ye olde pits of yesteryear.
Click to expand...

Does she though?

She doesn't describe being "cancelled". At best she's complaining that her peers had bad vibes whenever she voiced unpopular opinions.

Even for cancel culture nonsense this is a petty complaint.
 
"Nobody wants to be my friend because I do things that I know bother them and then I intentionally don't stop doing them because can't nobody tell me what to do" isn't being canceled, it's failing to be held to minimal standards and intentionally choosing being a prick over being a decent person.

This is some "Well I called my friend 'Sport' even though know I hated the nickname, and now he doesn't want to be my friend anymore... WAS I CANCELLED!?" level of a word meaning nothing.
 
Last edited:
This whole manufactured crisis is on fumes but the pundit class is trying hard to keep it alive.

Seriously, imagine you're an editor and this came across your desk. How does this lazy dreck get published at the NYTimes?


It makes it all the funnier that Bari Weiss flounced out of these institutions. They are totally in the bag for this kind of hack writing, but she still tries to paint herself as some outspoken martyr.
 
Last edited:
JoeMorgue said:
Again Progressivism and Liberalism does have many, many, many annoying habits, but demanding we live in a world where you can't just casually use slurs is not one of them. "Oh lord I have to keep track of it all, I can't call the black people the N-word, I can't call the gays faggots, I mean where does it end I simply can't keep track of it all!" is not a hill you want to die defending.

And please explain to me what the **** "being cancelled by your peers" is supposed to mean, because from where I'm standing that sounds a lot like "People don't like me anymore."
Click to expand...

You might want to give the article a reread as there's nothing in it about people wanting to use slurs so your observations are wildly off topic in that regard.

Yes...she's complaining about people not liking her anymore because, as an example, she offered up a feminist critique in a class on feminist theory on a cultural practice unwittingly thinking that her status as a fellow oppressed woman would give her a voice to speak for women in general. The silly white woman strayed out of her lane and her first experience with cancel culture was had.
 
Stout said:
You might want to give the article a reread as there's nothing in it about people wanting to use slurs so your observations are wildly off topic in that regard.

Yes...she's complaining about people not liking her anymore because, as an example, she offered up a feminist critique in a class on feminist theory on a cultural practice unwittingly thinking that her status as a fellow oppressed woman would give her a voice to speak for women in general. The silly white woman strayed out of her lane and her first experience with cancel culture was had.
Click to expand...

College isn't kindergarten. Not everyone has to get along. People avoiding the lady that keeps saying weird **** during class is not a crisis.
 
Stout said:
The problem with applying the safe space concept to situations like these is that safe spaces don't serve to shield progressives from the ire of other progressives, they're only really meant to keep out the white cishet cudebros with everyone else being allowed to enter based on whatever axis of oppression they're currently working on.
Click to expand...

Oh? News to me that you can only create a safe space type of environment to relax with like minded peers in, if you’re a queer liberal poc or something. I don’t see why I can’t apply the safe space concept to literally any group that feels like it could use such an environment.

Not that you get to take over someone else’s safe space but that you are always welcome to create and curate your own if you have somewhere to host it.
 
Stout said:
The silly white woman strayed out of her lane and her first experience with cancel culture was had.
Click to expand...

Good thing you put that as your last sentence because I stopped reading or thinking you had a point after I read it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom