Merged The Qur'an corrects the mistakes of the false Injil/Torah

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Cosmic Yak said:
Looking at this thread and the heydarian one, are there any Muslims out there who actually believe the Islam we have today is the real Islam? All we get on this forum is Muslims telling us how wrong all the other Muslims are.
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I interpret the Holy Book of the Lord. You pervert it.

Rinse and repeat. :covereyes
 
Emre_1974tr said:
Today Muslims do not follow the Qur'an. They are following your fake Bible, and other hadith books(Like Bukhari) . That's why they live like a Jew or a Christian. According to your Bible, there is compulsion in religion.

They are products of your hadith books. False Torah, False Injeels, Bukhari's books. Example stoning(rajm) is in the hadith books and in the your fake Bible. The headscarf, circumcision, stoning (rajm), attacks to others, communism, black stone are in your false Bible. Arab countries live according to your false biblical principles. And but Christian countries experiencing the teachings of the Koran(no rajm,no circumcision, no headscarf, and they live in wealth, luxury and science...).

In Quran no rajm(stoning), no circumcision, no headscarf, no communism, no attacks to others.

Today Muslims live like christians. And today christians live like Muslims.
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If this is actually the case, then I suppose that the "Qur'an" which you hold in such high esteem, has not actually been very useful in correcting mistakes.

As a result, my conclusion is that the Qur'an is just another fairy book which is no better, and now worse, than any of the other numerous fairy books that are in circulation.
 
Wow it's almost like getting information from an ancient book of collected unrelated vague morality tales passed down orally generations and then translated over and over, edited again and again for religious, political, and social reasons and trying to gain any actual useful information or morality out of it is a stupid idea or something.
 
JoeMorgue said:
Wow it's almost like getting information from an ancient book of collected unrelated vague morality tales passed down orally generations and then translated over and over, edited again and again for religious, political, and social reasons and trying to gain any actual useful information or morality out of it is a stupid idea or something.
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Those statements may apply to the Bible: I do not think they necessarily apply to the Qur'an.
 
Cosmic Yak said:
Those statements may apply to the Bible: I do not think they necessarily apply to the Qur'an.
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If you say so. I've had Mormans make the same argument, that the Book of Mormon is different because it only goes back a few generations.

It's all rubbish that didn't happen.
 
Crossbow said:
If this is actually the case, then I suppose that the "Qur'an" which you hold in such high esteem, has not actually been very useful in correcting mistakes.
.
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The goal is to get what you deserve. The point here is for you to face yourself. And the Qur'an perfectly accomplishes its purposes.
 
Emre_1974tr said:
The goal is to get what you deserve.
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Who is "you"? You probably deserve intervention.

The point here is for you to face yourself.
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A mirror can do that nicely. You don't need a Qur'an for that.

And the Qur'an perfectly accomplishes its purposes.
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Religious propaganda, by 6th century illiterates for 6th century illiterates. Perfect for them, I guess. :rolleyes:
 
Emre_1974tr said:
The goal is to get what you deserve1. The point here is for you to face yourself2. And the Qur'an perfectly accomplishes its purposes3.
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1By whose reckoning?

2I have mirrors, so that one's sorted.

3If it had 'perfectly accomplishe[d] its purposes' wouldn't everyone be a devout and happy Muslim (of which there would be only one denomination)?




Drat! Ninja'd on point 2 by Norman Alexander :mad:
 
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junkshop said:
1By whose reckoning?

2I have mirrors, so that one's sorted.

3If it had 'perfectly accomplishe[d] its purposes' wouldn't everyone be a devout and happy Muslim (of which there would be only one denomination)?




Drat! Ninja'd on point 2 by Norman Alexander :mad:
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I say that the purpose of the Qur'an is to ensure that you get what you deserve. that is, to face yourself. In this way, you get what you deserve in this world and the next. After all, this is the purpose of the testing world. This is the purpose of the Qur'an.

No, the goal is not to make everyone happy. The goal is for everyone to get what they deserve. Otherwise, there would be no hell and earth/test, only life in Paradise would exist.
 
If you are a good person you attain salvation, if you are a bad person you go astray. This is the purpose of the world of testing. Confront your self. Thus, you have no right to object in the hereafter.
 
Emre_1974tr said:
I say that the purpose of the Qur'an is to ensure that you get what you deserve. that is, to face yourself. In this way, you get what you deserve in this world and the next. After all, this is the purpose of the testing world. This is the purpose of the Qur'an.

No, the goal is not to make everyone happy. The goal is for everyone to get what they deserve. Otherwise, there would be no hell and earth/test, only life in Paradise would exist.
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Emre_1974tr said:
If you are a good person you attain salvation, if you are a bad person you go astray. This is the purpose of the world of testing. Confront your self. Thus, you have no right to object in the hereafter.
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Well, it sure don't smell like corn syrup.
 
Cosmic Yak said:
If you cut the hands and feet off someone who disagrees with you, does that make you a good person or a bad person?
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No such thing. The verse you have absolved speaks of retaliation and self-defense. The cross sign appears in spiritualist paganism. I've already told you this:

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9609989.msg412402;topicseen#msg412402

The assailants killed the Muslims, pulled them out of their vatas, or cut them in cross/X shape.

In the past, other spiritualist pagans, such as Pharaoh, did the same.

And this verse about self defense and retaliation.

5:33 The recompense of those who fight God and His messenger and seek to corrupt the land, is that they will be killed or crucified or that their hands and feet be cut off on alternate sides or that they be banished from the land. That is a disgrace for them in this world. In the Hereafter, they will have a great retribution.

In short, crossing is about self defense and retaliation to attacker pagans (Who cuts the Muslims in X shape).

Only self-defense warfare is allowed in the Qur'an. No one can attack anyone because of their belief.
 
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Emre_1974tr said:
No such thing. The verse you have absolved speaks of retaliation and self-defense. The cross sign appears in spiritualist paganism. I've already told you this:

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9609989.msg412402;topicseen#msg412402

The assailants killed the Muslims, pulled them out of their vatas, or cut them in cross/X shape.

In the past, other spiritualist pagans, such as Pharaoh, did the same.

And this verse about self defense and retaliation.

5:33 The recompense of those who fight God and His messenger and seek to corrupt the land, is that they will be killed or crucified or that their hands and feet be cut off on alternate sides or that they be banished from the land. That is a disgrace for them in this world. In the Hereafter, they will have a great retribution.

In short, crossing is about self defense and retaliation to attacker pagans (Who cuts the Muslims in X shape).

Only self-defense warfare is allowed in the Qur'an. No one can attack anyone because of their belief.
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This is why no book-based religion should ever be taken seriously.
So much twisting and turning trying to explain why what was written is not actually what was written.
OK, Emre, if this was only criticising the Egyptians, how is it that cutting off the hand and foot, followed by crucifixion is a punishment in Sharia law?
If you follow this practice, does this make you a good person or a bad person?
 
In my now 43 years alive I still have never even gotten an attempt at what an actual human could honestly call an answer as to why God simply just has to communicate with us his poorly.
 
Emre_1974tr said:
The goal is to get what you deserve. The point here is for you to face yourself. And the Qur'an perfectly accomplishes its purposes.
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Then it is just about the reply that I expected.

I have to say that the Qur'an is just another fairy book where its supporters say just about the same thing as do the supporters of the many other fairy books that are in circulation.
 
Cosmic Yak said:
Emre, if this was only criticising the Egyptians, how is it that cutting off the hand and foot, followed by crucifixion is a punishment in Sharia law?
If you follow this practice, does this make you a good person or a bad person?
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No, He says "defend yourself if they attack you, respond in the same way". It's that simple and true.

Those who cut the hands and feet diagonally are pagans. They are killing Muslims. In this verse, He(God) says, you can respond to them in the same way. it says self-defense. Eye for an eye.
 
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Emre_1974tr said:
No, He says "defend yourself if they attack you, respond in the same way". It's that simple and true.

Those who cut the hands and feet diagonally are pagans. They are killing Muslims. In this verse, He(God) says, you can respond to them in the same way. it says self-defense. Eye for an eye.
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Nope.
1. Hadith of Al Bukhari.
and after they had recovered from their ailment (became healthy) they turned renegades (reverted from Islam) and killed the shepherd of the camels and took the camels away. The Prophet sent (some people) in their pursuit and so they were (caught and) brought, and the Prophets ordered that their hands and legs should be cut off and that their eyes should be branded with heated pieces of iron, and that their cut hands and legs should not be cauterized, till they die.
The Prophet cut off the hands and feet of the men belonging to the tribe of 'Uraina and did not cauterise (their bleeding limbs) till they died.
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https://www.iium.edu.my/deed/hadith/bukhari/082_sbt.html
Nothing about self-defence, nothing about the Pharaohs.

2. Sharia law.
Hudud, which means punishments fixed by god and Islam.
If you renounce Islam, or 'struggle against Islam', then this is what happens
The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and his messenger and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution, or crucification or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides
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http://www2.esyariah.gov.my/esyaria...54f962dc14b34e674825765f001162f8?OpenDocument
Again, nothing about self-defence, and nothing about the Pharaohs.

Furthermore, neither the Prophet Mohammed, nor the practitioners of Sharia law are pagans- and the response by Mohammed was not the same, nor even close, to the crime committed by the unfortunate tribe of 'Uraina.

Cue 'No True Muslim' gambit in 5...4...3...
 
Emre_1974tr said:
And according to the Qur'an, you can't even slap anyone:
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Not true ! the Quran says you can beat your wives.

4.34 Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because God has given the one more (strength) than the other, and because they support them from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient, and guard in (the husband's) absence what God would have them guard. As to those women on whose part ye fear disloyalty and ill-conduct, admonish them (first), (Next), refuse to share their beds, (And last) beat them (lightly); but if they return to obedience, seek not against them Means (of annoyance): For God is Most High, great (above you all).
 
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