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Cont: The Sinking of MS Estonia: Case Reopened Part V

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Vixen said:
Whoever took nine survivors direct to Huddinge, instead of dropping them off at Utö. These helicopters had a whole team of people but it seems this is what Svensson told Aftonbladet he did. According to witnesses he was heard telling an interviewer live on Radio Kuku he had rescued Piht.
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So where is the recording of the things he told this radio station?

Where are these witnesses?

All you ever produce are second hand accounts that claim unknown witnesses heard him say things.
 
Vixen said:
Why is it pointless?
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Because it would add time to the flight when it was important to get the helicopters back in to action as quickly as possible and it would reduce congestion and fuel usage at the other sites.

It's how the military plan an operation.
 
Vixen said:
No, it is your claim that in order 'not to waste time bothering to go to Utö to refuel and drop off the survivors as instructed by the OSC, it was decided to go straight to Huddinge instead'.

The JAIC dresses this up as 'because fuel was low'.

It was an instruction that helicopters with faulty winches had to return to base but not that survivors or the dead had to be taken there.
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They weren't taken to the base, they were dropped at a hospital on the route to the base rather than making an unnecessary diversion that would have added time to the flight and used the dwindling fuel supplies at the site.

That's how the military works, they are flexible as the situation changes.
 
Vixen said:
What? Did you not look at the map I gave you? Stockholm was >200km away, Utö less than 38km.
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But it was a longer diversion from the direct route back to the base for repairs and crew change.
 
Vixen said:
Is it? I didn't know that.


I am pretty left wing, actually.
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MV-media, also known as MV??!!, formerly Mitä Vittua? ("What the ****?") and MV-lehti is a Finnish alternative media site based in Spain and from 2018 Finland. It was founded by Ilja Janitskin in 2014.

MV-lehti has been accused of racism and spreading fake news and hate speech. Due to this, Janitskin was suspected of several crimes, including incitement to ethnic or racial hatred, libel and copyright infringement, and was taken into custody by the Andorran police in August 2017.He was later extradited to Finland, and in October 2018, Janitskin was convicted of 16 offences and given a 22-month prison sentence. According to the court, Janitskin was the chief editor and owner of MV-lehti, and as such he was responsible for its content.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MV-media

You should check your sources.
 
Reformed Offlian said:
Ladies and gentlemen, remember, the MV Lehti article isn't even a second source. The author cites Bollyn among his sources (they're listed at the bottom). Vixen is just identifying other people who also used his stuff.
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Can I ask who labelled Bollyn an 'Anti-Semite'? Being pro-Palestinian doesn't make a person a foot-stomping nazi fascist anti-Semite? I have a friend who spent time in Palestine doing charity work. The idea that she is anti-Semitic because she passionately supports the Palestinian cause, is utterly laughable. Likewise, there are plenty of books on Amazon by Jewish intellectuals who are critical of the Israeli state. Come on people, you are better than slapping two-word labels on other people without any other further explanation.

I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.

~ Evelyn Beatrice Hall in 1906

The Estonia disaster is a human disaster not a battle of ideology.
 
Marras said:
Nowadays the ferry+car combination from Utö to Turku takes ~6.5 hours, and the ferry goes once a day. I don't know about the timetables in 1994.

I have absolutely no idea if the organized separate ships to go fetch the Estonia survivors.
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The point I was making was the idea that 'the Swedish helicopters had to fly directly to Huddinge because there were no other hospitals nearby' is utter nonsense.
 
Vixen said:
Can I ask who labelled Bollyn an 'Anti-Semite'? Being pro-Palestinian doesn't make a person a foot-stomping nazi fascist anti-Semite? I have a friend who spent time in Palestine doing charity work. The idea that she is anti-Semitic because she passionately supports the Palestinian cause, is utterly laughable. Likewise, there are plenty of books on Amazon by Jewish intellectuals who are critical of the Israeli state. Come on people, you are better than slapping two-word labels on other people without any other further explanation.

I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.

~ Evelyn Beatrice Hall in 1906

The Estonia disaster is a human disaster not a battle of ideology.
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So now we're in the bit where you try to rehabilitate Bollyn as a source, now that you find yourself unable to deny that he is in fact your source. Just like you did with Bjorkman.

I had been thinking of posting that as a prediction, but wimped out, so I don't get to do my "called it" dance. But the behavior was expected.
 
Bollyn isn't "pro-Palestinian" he's a rabid anti-Semite who thinks Israel did 9/11 because Jews.
 
whoanellie said:
From Wikipedia
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Looking up this character, it seems MV-Lehti, like some of the once 'edgy' alternative media, such as Julie Burchill, an erstwhile prize-winning 'young journalist of the year' who wrote about alternative rock for NME, is now today's far right / anarchists.

This magazine still seems to be in circulation so presumably it is no longer raiding police central computers to illegally publish personal details of immigrants, interestingly, Ilya Janitskin himself having a Russian-sounding name.

OK, I wasn't aware of any of this. I only ever read HS, TS, I-L and I-S.
 
Vixen said:
Can I ask who labelled Bollyn an 'Anti-Semite'? Being pro-Palestinian doesn't make a person a foot-stomping nazi fascist anti-Semite? I have a friend who spent time in Palestine doing charity work. The idea that she is anti-Semitic because she passionately supports the Palestinian cause, is utterly laughable. Likewise, there are plenty of books on Amazon by Jewish intellectuals who are critical of the Israeli state. Come on people, you are better than slapping two-word labels on other people without any other further explanation.

I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.

~ Evelyn Beatrice Hall in 1906

The Estonia disaster is a human disaster not a battle of ideology.
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Excerpt from his book on the September 11 attacks:


This chapter examines an extensive Zionist criminal network, which the evidence indicates is behind the false-flag terrorism of 9/11. The information in this chapter strongly supports the thesis that senior officers from Israeli military intelligence agencies were the chief architects of 9/11. . . .

Aware of the increasing prevalence and dominance of Zionist Jews in the political, financial, and academic sectors, I came to the conclusion that I was living in Jewish times. As an American raised with traditional Christian values, I realized that the culture I had grown up in was under attack and being reduced to a sub-culture. Through the Jewish-controlled media, a distinctly foreign and anti-Christian culture of pornography, perversion, and violence was being pushed. The producers of this "new culture" were primarily Jews of Eastern European origin. Through their control of the mass media, film, radio, and television networks, a diet of perverse entertainment and un-American values was being force-fed to the unsuspecting American population.

Concurrent with the rise of the Jewish-Zionist faction in the U.S. media there was a significant increase in Zionist power in the executive, legislative, and judicial branches of government. This influence could be seen in the way the U.S. government and federal courts unfairly prosecuted innocent people, including the president of Austria, on unfounded allegations of crimes having been committed decades ago against Jews in distant countries. Meanwhile, there was a noticeable increase in the number and magnitude of crimes committed by Jews in the United States and the international arena that went completely unpunished.

As in the Soviet Union, Jewish criminals in America used the "holocaust" and the slanderous charge of anti-Semitism as a shield to protect their criminal network and extortion rackets by intimidating and silencing those who would dare to expose the monstrous crimes they were involved in. A secret "combination" or Zionist network was clearly at work pulling the strings at the highest level behind the scenes.​
 
Captain_Swoop said:
That didn't answer the question.
Who got a medal for disobeying a command?

A rescue man does not control the helicopter, the pilot does.
A Swedish navy pilot will be taking orders from his own squadron commander.

Where is your evidence anyone got a medal for disobeying a command?
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The JAIC itself tells you the parameters of the OSC commands and one of them was to drop off the dead or the survivors either on the deck of the ships or at Utö, to be transferred to a relevant hospital. Once Turku was full, they were taken to Mariehamn.
 
Vixen said:
The point I was making was the idea that 'the Swedish helicopters had to fly directly to Huddinge because there were no other hospitals nearby' is utter nonsense.
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Two helicopters on their way back to their base for repairs dropped survivors they had onboard at a hospital close to their direct route.
 
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