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Cont: Trump’s Coup - Part 2

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Crazy Chainsaw said:
Maybe after Trump's conversations in the White House are released by the National Archives they will be forced into reality.
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Not at all.

The vast majority wouldn't read the releases, any information they have will have come through the FOXnews/Newsmax/OANN filter - if they bother to report on them at all.

In the event that they do come into contact with the raw archival material, they'll just dismiss it as fake content placed there by the Deep State.
 
eerok said:
Reality is a bridge too far for these people. We know what happened, but they never will.
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The Don said:
Not at all.

The vast majority wouldn't read the releases, any information they have will have come through the FOXnews/Newsmax/OANN filter - if they bother to report on them at all.

In the event that they do come into contact with the raw archival material, they'll just dismiss it as fake content placed there by the Deep State.
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I know but now we have deep state Vs Dumb State, and the Crazies.
 
Was there a plot to assume power by overturning a legitimate, democratic election? Clearly. (Not limited to Jan 6, obviously.)

Was there violence? Clearly.


I don’t imagine that the alt.dictionary used by deniers is online, so we can check for internal consistency.
 
If it wasn't a coup or an attempted coup, can we call it an attempt at a coup?

That luckily enough was attempted by people so stupid that it failed.
 
Ok. Trump complied with law with every decision handed down. At what point did he make a move to stay in power, or refuse to cede his seat?

Or were the J6 Dildos taking power for themselves? Seems to me the guy seizing power needs to actually be in on it.
 
Thermal said:
Ok. Trump complied with law with every decision handed down. At what point did he make a move to stay in power, or refuse to cede his seat?

Or were the J6 Dildos taking power for themselves? Seems to me the guy seizing power needs to actually be in on it.
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You got that completely wrong.

There was nothing for Trump to comply to - nothing in the Election process requires the President's approval.
What he did was pressure election officials to change the results - on tape. It's 100% election fraud.
 
Thermal said:
Ok. Trump complied with law with every decision handed down. At what point did he make a move to stay in power, or refuse to cede his seat?
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(1) When he incited the insurgents to storm the capital
(2) When he threatened Raffensperger, for which Trump is under criminal investigation
 
varwoche said:
(1) When he incited the insurgents to storm the capital
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Inciting imminent lawless action. Absolutely a crime. Not a coup attempt, especially as he didn't go along with it and (eventually) ordered the Guard to stop it. Kind of awkward to argue that he was attempting a coup when he ordered the military to quell it?

(2) When he threatened Raffensperger, for which Trump is under criminal investigation
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Already addressed. A vague threat with absolute zero follow through hardly a coup attempt makes. As I said, if Trump had even got a clue Feds to begin any kind of investigation, it would be right in there as more of a coup attempt. But he did not one damn thing.

The only things Trump did were to throw tantrums and hang his head and comply, barring the invite to riot for which he was rightly impeached (and should be further prosecuted for).

Some of us take words like "coup d'etat" seriously. Any skeptic should. What he did was reprehensible and cowardly, as well as profoundly unAmerican. I meet suggest that we call it exactly what it is, rather than blathering rhetoric like Twitter twats.
 
Thermal said:
Inciting imminent lawless action. Absolutely a crime. Not a coup attempt, especially as he didn't go along with it and (eventually) ordered the Guard to stop it. Kind of awkward to argue that he was attempting a coup when he ordered the military to quell it?



Already addressed. A vague threat with absolute zero follow through hardly a coup attempt makes. As I said, if Trump had even got a clue Feds to begin any kind of investigation, it would be right in there as more of a coup attempt. But he did not one damn thing.

The only things Trump did were to throw tantrums and hang his head and comply, barring the invite to riot for which he was rightly impeached (and should be further prosecuted for).

Some of us take words like "coup d'etat" seriously. Any skeptic should. What he did was reprehensible and cowardly, as well as profoundly unAmerican. I meet suggest that we call it exactly what it is, rather than blathering rhetoric like Twitter twats.
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Trump didn't order the National Guard, your a little off in what occurred.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2021/11/17/january-6-william-walker-national-guard/
 
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Thermal said:
Inciting imminent lawless action. Absolutely a crime. Not a coup attempt, especially as he didn't go along with it and (eventually) ordered the Guard to stop it. Kind of awkward to argue that he was attempting a coup when he ordered the military to quell it?
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It was a crime in furtherance of the coup because it was done to intimidate Pence and Congress to illegally give the presidency back to Trump. Trump himself told Pence during the attack that the attackers 'cared more than you do' about giving Trump the presidency even though he lost.

There isn't a way out of this. What you are saying is the same as saying if Trump punched Pence it's a crime but not a coup ignoring it was to make Pence participate in the coup. Stopping punching him wouldn't change that either, the analogue to stopping the attackers, but Trump didn't even do that.



Already addressed. A vague threat with absolute zero follow through hardly a coup attempt makes. As I said, if Trump had even got a clue Feds to begin any kind of investigation, it would be right in there as more of a coup attempt. But he did not one damn thing.
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Why? Why is a vague, and illegal, threat in furtherance of a coup not part of a coup?

The only things Trump did were to throw tantrums and hang his head and comply, barring the invite to riot for which he was rightly impeached (and should be further prosecuted for).

Some of us take words like "coup d'etat" seriously. Any skeptic should. What he did was reprehensible and cowardly, as well as profoundly unAmerican. I meet suggest that we call it exactly what it is, rather than blathering rhetoric like Twitter twats.
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But it was a coup. You're taking each action is isolation and ignoring how they worked together and towards. It's a bizarre combination of cherry picking and the Fallacy of Composition. If you ignore how each action furthered the goal of illegally taking over government power, then none of them in and of themselves did (even the ones that did for some reason), then it wasn't in total a coup attempt. That's not how it works. This is identical to saying that someone should be arrested for punching a bank security officer, but that doesn't make it a bank robbery while ignoring that they punched a bank security officer while rushing into the bank to try to rob it. Why? Why should each element be removed from how it aligns with the literal plans laid out in memos?

It is only one step of from Warp's placing an arbitrary and nonsense goalpost of the Jan 6th insurrectionists having to have coordinated beforehand for it to be part of a coup attempt, and ignoring that 40 of them at least made his nonsense standard.
 
Warp12 said:
Translation:

"Just immerse yourself in liberal groupthink and all of your troubles shall disappear."

Too rich.
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Are you suggesting that there were not complimentary attempts to overturn the election by officers of the DOJ and the Trump campaign coincident to the January 6th attack?
 
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