Is “ Sticks and stones may break my bones but names will never hurt me” correct?

[p0lka]

I'm interested to know what that means in practice and how you achieve it as it seems functionally equivalent to saying 'no virus gets to control how i feel' or 'no punch to the head is going to control how i feel'

You can of course make conscious efforts to overcome how people are making you feel (and these can be effective or not) but if you mean something else then you seem to be in possession of supernatural control over chemicals.

In practice, any form of emotional manipulation, whether it be name calling or 'you're the best,' will not get the expected reaction from me. The default is nothing.

I thought you said you weren't bothered by words!?

I don't get how what you quoted has anything to do with what you just typed?
enlighten me please, I'm completely lost, heh.

Edit: sticks n stones... names never harm me etc is ingrained in me, might be a good lesson for the kids.

 

[bluesjnr]

This is worth looking at when considering the question.

 

[cullennz]

So when is violence understandable? I think it's when the health or status one's social group is threatened by another, especially if the offender belongs to a socially privileged or powerful group. Lines get blurry these days because we no longer live in mostly extended families like our ancestors did for millennia. But the urge to fight back is clearly still with us. Nobody cares if me and my buddies are ****-posting each other on social media. But what if we try that rowdiness on a marginalized group or even direct our insults towards members of the majority ethnic group of the country?

Sorry, I missed this, but find it a bit laughable.

a) that insults with people you don't know on social media in any way is an excuse for a violent act.

b) What do you mean exactly by privileged and who are you saying are privileged?

In my case my dads ancestors were probably nicking a bit of land off Maori and my great grans were trying to keep them from nicking her turf.

 

[Archie Gemmill Goal]

In practice, any form of emotional manipulation, whether it be name calling or 'you're the best,' will not get the expected reaction from me. The default is nothing.

That's good for you I guess. But you seemed to be claiming that you had control over that rather than it being an accident of biology?

might be a good lesson for the kids.

It really isn't. All it does is try to blame them for being rightly upset.

 

[p0lka]

That's good for you I guess. But you seemed to be claiming that you had control over that rather than it being an accident of biology?

ah, maybe default wasn't the correct word.
I have emotions,

I get weepy watching certain movie endings,
I cry sometimes listening to certain songs,
I weep whilst playing my guitar for some tabs,
anyone close to me could hurt me easily with their words if they chose to,

but if someone is trying to create an emotion in me by name calling for instance, it doesn't work. I kind of get a kick out of smiling just to make them more annoyed.

edit: I have control over that, everyone has.

 

[Venom]

Sorry, I missed this, but find it a bit laughable.

a) that insults with people you don't know on social media in any way is an excuse for a violent act.

b) What do you mean exactly by privileged and who are you saying are privileged?

In my case my dads ancestors were probably nicking a bit of land off Maori and my great grans were trying to keep them from nicking her turf.

a) Social media is a relatively recent means of communication. I admit I get some satisfaction from doxxers targeting people who are a bit too loose with their language in video games. Then I remember "Wait, that's illegal" and I know it crosses the line and I tell myself that the perpetrator should be charged, but that small feeling of satisfaction is difficult to suppress sometimes.

b) Privileged as in inhabiting a privileged position in society, by whatever measure or category gives them that position; skin color, ethnic background, social status based on historical circumstances, etc. It's not necessary to break down every situation in which this could develop. But words tend to hit especially hard when someone is punching down with the weight of their privilege behind them. And to think it's not at least understandable for the underprivileged target of the names to lash out violently is, to me, almost a sign of social dysfunction.

 

[Archie Gemmill Goal]

edit: I have control over that, everyone has.

You may (though I doubt it) but you cannot possibly claim everyone has.

What is it you think you do to control it? I'm interested in your mental power over biochemistry and how it can be harnessed to help other mental health issues.

 

[p0lka]

You may (though I doubt it) but you cannot possibly claim everyone has.

What is it you think you do to control it? I'm interested in your mental power over biochemistry and how it can be harnessed to help other mental health issues.

It's interesting you posit mental power over biochemistry, I don't think that is the case here.
in my case it's a simple thing,

If someone tries to emotionally manipulate me, then I'll define them as idiots or emotional manipulators for trying to do so,

as a consequence of me defining them that way in my head, why would I care what they say?

The biochemistry thing would involve someone trying to hold feelings down, or trying to hold back emotions? It's not the case with me.

I don't get angry in the first place, as I've already labelled them as not worthy due to them trying to get me angry.

It might be circular, but if it works, it works.

 

[arthwollipot]

Did you have an example?

In 1517 a German priest nailed some words to the door of a church.

 

[cullennz]

a) Social media is a relatively recent means of communication. I admit I get some satisfaction from doxxers targeting people who are a bit too loose with their language in video games. Then I remember "Wait, that's illegal" and I know it crosses the line and I tell myself that the perpetrator should be charged, but that small feeling of satisfaction is difficult to suppress sometimes.

b) Privileged as in inhabiting a privileged position in society, by whatever measure or category gives them that position; skin color, ethnic background, social status based on historical circumstances, etc. It's not necessary to break down every situation in which this could develop. But words tend to hit especially hard when someone is punching down with the weight of their privilege behind them. And to think it's not at least understandable for the underprivileged target of the names to lash out violently is, to me, almost a sign of social dysfunction.

Just out of interest, how do you measure privilege of what lot over the other?

Or does that not matter, and we just go with dudes and white people?

 

[xjx388]

You may (though I doubt it) but you cannot possibly claim everyone has.

What is it you think you do to control it? I'm interested in your mental power over biochemistry and how it can be harnessed to help other mental health issues.

What exactly are you arguing here? That humans, in general and putting aside pathology, don't have control over their emotions/behavior?

 

[arthwollipot]

What exactly are you arguing here? That humans, in general and putting aside pathology, don't have control over their emotions/behavior?

I'd say that in general they're pretty bad at it, yeah.

 

[xjx388]

I'd say that in general they're pretty bad at it, yeah.

I’d say we are pretty good at it, actually. In fact, the stability of our society depends on the ability of humans to control their emotions and behaviors. The OP aphorism is a bit simplistic, perhaps, but the underlying idea is central to our laws.

 

[arthwollipot]

I’d say we are pretty good at it, actually. In fact, the stability of our society depends on the ability of humans to control their emotions and behaviors. The OP aphorism is a bit simplistic, perhaps, but the underlying idea is central to our laws.

I challenge you to head on down to the pub at midnight on a Friday and see how good people are at controlling their emotions.

 

[xjx388]

I challenge you to head on down to the pub at midnight on a Friday and see how good people are at controlling their emotions.

That people do lose control doesn’t mean that people are incapable of control. Plus you are adding alcohol and drugs to the mix there which changes things.

What I’m trying to say is that in every situation, we have choices. We can choose how to react to a given situation. We can reason with ourselves what is worth reacting to and what is not.

Harsh insulting words don’t trigger some automatic biological response that we have no control over. They are just sound waves in the air. As a way of helping people understand that words have no actual power over us unless we let them have power, “sticks and stones” is pretty handy.

The fact that people let words have power over them does not imply that they must have such power.

 

[Archie Gemmill Goal]

What exactly are you arguing here? That humans, in general and putting aside pathology, don't have control over their emotions/behavior?

Humans don't consciously control their emotions, no.

If they did then telling a depressed person to pull themselves together and cheer up might actually have some value.

People may have coping mechanisms and some degree of conscious control over their behaviour but that's quite different than not having the emotion to begin with.

Saying 'I don't let X bother me' is claiming some kind of supernatural mind control over biochemistry. It may well be that X doesn't bother you, but then you just happen to be one of the lucky ones that isn't bothered by X. You didn't decide to not let it bother you, you didn't control whether it bothered you or not.

It may not be intended but again these kinds of claims are just another way of blaming the victim for being weak or not in control or somehow choosing to be adversely affected.

 

[Archie Gemmill Goal]

Harsh insulting words don’t trigger some automatic biological response that we have no control over.

Of course they do. How do you think the brain works exactly?

 

[xjx388]

Humans don't consciously control their emotions, no.

If they did then telling a depressed person to pull themselves together and cheer up might actually have some value.

People may have coping mechanisms and some degree of conscious control over their behaviour but that's quite different than not having the emotion to begin with.

Saying 'I don't let X bother me' is claiming some kind of supernatural mind control over biochemistry. It may well be that X doesn't bother you, but then you just happen to be one of the lucky ones that isn't bothered by X. You didn't decide to not let it bother you, you didn't control whether it bothered you or not.

It may not be intended but again these kinds of claims are just another way of blaming the victim for being weak or not in control or somehow choosing to be adversely affected.

There’s nothing at all supernatural about controlling how you feel about something. I’m not claiming that every human has this skill to equal capacity. I’m not claiming that pathology or intoxication doesn’t affect the ability to control. I’m not denying biochemical reactions and how all that plays into things.


But humans are not biochemical automatons.

 

[theprestige]

In 1517 a German priest nailed some words to the door of a church.

Walk me through it, please. Someone put some words on a door, and this hurt someone else
so much that they started a war over it? And this war is understandable, on account of how words do hurt?

That's the example of a war, that I'm looking for in the context of your arguments about hurtful words as I understand them.

Is the war you have in mind such an example?

Also, which war exactly do you have in mind?

 

[theprestige]

I challenge you to head on down to the pub at midnight on a Friday and see how good people are at controlling their emotions.

As often as I've been down to my local watering hole at midnight, I can probably count on the fingers of one hand the number of times someone has struck me as out of control.

More times than that, someone has been obnoxious, but there usually seems to be an element of choice, of making a decision to be an ass, involved.