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Man shot, killed by off-duty Dallas police officer who walked into wrong apartment p3

ponderingturtle said:
Really makes it easy for automotive companies to get off from unsafe cars. "Sure if the belt was designed properly they would never have been ejected from the car, but really it was the fault of getting in the accident that bears all the culpability so why are we complaining about this mere safety hazard?"

But I guess there is no legal responsibility on the part of an apartment that the safety equipment they have actually works. Any deaths that result will always be easily blamed on something else.
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I'm guessing that's the reasoning that the lawyers may take. The door was a safety device, Jean was relying on it to prevent unauthorized entry and it failed, allowing Guyger to murder him.

Perhaps I am too quick to dismiss this.

I wonder what the response here will be. I am not sure how the law works there. If the apartment building is found to have some small percent culpability, how much can they really be ordered to pay.

Obviously Guyger is the overwhelmingly responsible party, so any liability beyond that would only be a fraction.
 
ponderingturtle said:
Yes it is supposed to close and lock automatically but because it was installed improperly failed to do so. If it was installed properly she wouldn't have been able to get in with out kicking down the door.

It is simple, if the apartment had made sure the door was properly installed he would still be alive today.
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It may not be the fault of the installer who may have installed it perfectly to specifications. It might be the fault of the door design itself.

Investigators said that sometimes these doors work correctly and sometimes they don't depending on environmental conditions. They are probably talking about temperature and humidity. The doors are wooden and wood will change shape and size depending on temperature and humidity.

The installers may have already known that the doors periodically warp and then also un-warp and there is nothing that the installer can do about that.
 
William Parcher said:
It may not be the fault of the installer who may have installed it perfectly to specifications. It might be the fault of the door design itself.

Investigators said that sometimes these doors work correctly and sometimes they don't depending on environmental conditions. They are probably talking about temperature and humidity. The doors are wooden and wood will change shape and size depending on temperature and humidity.

The installers may have already known that the doors periodically warp and then also un-warp and there is nothing that the installer can do about that.
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Are the doors wooden? I thought they were metal in the videos that I watched.

ETA: I can't seem to find anything definitive but I guess it was confirmed that Jean's door was defective according to the prosecutors:

Ultimately, she was only able to get into Jean's apartment because the door was defective and hadn’t closed properly, prosecutors said.
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William Parcher said:
....
Investigators said that sometimes these doors work correctly and sometimes they don't depending on environmental conditions. They are probably talking about temperature and humidity. The doors are wooden and wood will change shape and size depending on temperature and humidity.
.....
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I dunno about this place particularly, but apartment doors in most modern buildings would be steel, for fire rating and security.
 
Bob001 said:
Our girl Amber doesn't give up.

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/cou...am-files-appeal-after-2019-murder-conviction/

Note that criminally negligent homicide carries a maximum penalty of two years.
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There are multiple issues/requests. One is to change the conviction as you say. The other claims that she should have been found straight not guilty based on reasonable self defense. I'd like to think that neither appeal will work, but it's Texas, she's white, she was a cop, and the victim was black. The Appeals court will almost certainly look for a way to get her out of prison.
 
history of the TCCA

Babbylonian said:
The Appeals court will almost certainly look for a way to get her out of prison.
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What an utterly ignorant thing to say. The Texas Court of Criminal Appeals has a longstanding reputation of denying appeals even when the grounds to do so are...extremely persuasive. I am not taking a position on the merits of this appeal, however.
 
In defence of Babylonian I see precisely from where they are coming.
Clearly this was an atrocious accident.
 
JoeMorgue said:
On what possible grounds?

And no the stupid argument that there's a difference between "Well I intentionally did the thing that I knew would kill the person, but that's not the same thing as me intentionally killing them" argument does not count.
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From the linked article:

In an appeal filed with the court last August, Guyger's attorneys argued she acted in self-defense, believing that deadly force was necessary because she thought, although mistakenly, that she was in her apartment and that Jean, 26, was an "intruder."

"The evidence was legally insufficient to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Guyger committed murder," her attorneys argued in a court document.
 
Jungle Jim said:
From the linked article:

In an appeal filed with the court last August, Guyger's attorneys argued she acted in self-defense, believing that deadly force was necessary because she thought, although mistakenly, that she was in her apartment and that Jean, 26, was an "intruder."

"The evidence was legally insufficient to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Guyger committed murder," her attorneys argued in a court document.
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I don't know how compelling the argument that the jury just straight up got it wrong is going to be. Appeals, in general, are extremely hard to win, so I would bet this just gets tossed pretty quick.
 
Jungle Jim said:
From the linked article:

In an appeal filed with the court last August, Guyger's attorneys argued she acted in self-defense, believing that deadly force was necessary because she thought, although mistakenly, that she was in her apartment and that Jean, 26, was an "intruder."

"The evidence was legally insufficient to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Guyger committed murder," her attorneys argued in a court document.
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I'm sorry I also forget to put "We didn't get the answer we liked" was also not a valid answer.
 
Guyger's lawyers: Ok guys, let's try 'it was really, really a mistake of fact' defense. How much cash this murdering bitch have again?
 
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Thermal said:
Buyer's lawyers: Ok guys, let's try 'it was really, really a mistake of fact' defense. How much cash this murdering bitch police union have again?
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I'm not certain, but I doubt she is paying her attorneys herself.
 
JoeMorgue said:
I'm sorry I also forget to put "We didn't get the answer we liked" was also not a valid answer.
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You might have noticed that at the end of the Chauvin trial, the lawyer asked for a mistrial because, among other reasons, the prosecution put on too many witnesses against his client.
 
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