Ed Corona Virus Conspiracy Theories....

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Right from the get-go the vague Chinese Weapons lab and Pangolin stories smelled fishy, and I began gathering facts.

There are thousands of people on their last legs, dying of colon cancer, congestive heart failure, or whatever, who "die today" of diarrhea and dehydration from what doctors and nurses call C. diff (see-diff, Clostridium difficile bacteria), which doesn't often affect doctors and nurses, but just people whose immune systems are compromised, or whose "good" bacteria have been killed by antibiotics.

Does the death certificate say that the cause of death was dehydration, diarrhea, or C. difficile?

No, usually the death certificate states only the primary cause.

Except, apparently, in the Presidential-election year, where Covid-19 was listed as the cause of death for people in nursing homes on hospice care, and political science trumped biological science.

Also, FactCheck confirmed that hospitals get a large government bonus when they report covid as a contributing factor in deaths, whereas they don't for C. diff. FactCheck pulled that report, but the same info is available elsewhere.

If hospitals were paid to report C. diff as a death co-factor, fearmongers could report millions of C. diff deaths world-wide every year.

I went over all this ad nauseum at Skeptics.com with quotes from The True Believer: Thoughts on the Nature of Mass Movements and other sources, connecting a lot of dots that indicate that Covid-19 is less a catastrophic plague, and more a colossal fiction. It's still there to see, and I won't repeat it here.

Imvho, if we could explain why billions of people have come to believe that an angel hovered over the Virgin Mary causing her to give birth to the Son of God who died for our sins, that it might go a long way toward explaining what kind of economic and political factors interacted to cause billions of people to accept the notion that a common-cold coronavirus is a plague of Biblical proportions and the flu has mysteriously disappeared.

You do realise that people are dying all over the world and in countries where it isn't an election year and where countries aren't getting a 'large bonus'? ?

Why do you think it is just about America?
 
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List of Tom's whimsical data sources. New entries in blue.
  • George Carlin bit
  • Conan O'Brian bit where he mocks local news for saying something silly about the Easter Bunny
  • Bartender in South Dakota
  • Unabashed holocaust denier

    [*]A book about true believers written in 1951
    [*]A fact check report that doesn't exist
By all means, keep 'em coming! You're welcome.
:th:
 
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Did normal human immune systems manage to fight off NEW cold and flu viruses for hundreds of thousands of years without the benefit of flu shots and cold medicines, and now have suddenly become incapacitated?
A third of Europe's population died of the Black Death.

You don't even care that 500,000 Americans died of Covid-19, remember?
 
Right from the get-go the vague Chinese Weapons lab and Pangolin stories smelled fishy, and I began gathering facts.

1) All new viruses start somewhere.

2) You didn't even know lockdowns also reduced normal flu spreading, until we told you.

3) You never gathered any facts at all, but simply told us you read opinion pieces from journalists who are holocaust deniers.
:p
 
Well, that's what I've been led to believe over most of my 75 years- that viruses mutate all the time- coronaviruses, flu viruses, rhinoviruses, etc., and the human immune system usually fights them off unless it is inherently weak or has been compromised, even novel flu viruses and novel coronaviruses, which it seems occur every year.

Yeah right.
 
You do realise that people are dying all over the world and in countries where it isn't an election year and where countries aren't getting a 'large bonus'? ?

Why do you think it is just about America?


I don't read that "it is just about America" (you meaning the USA) in the post you were replying to. Fancy that it might be "just about capitalism" and the Great Reset of its financial system. Try to think very hard, Captain.

Edited by Agatha: 
Edited to correct (abbreviated) username.
 
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NOT SO.

Get your friggin Immune Systems strong and you don't need to worry aboout this and that mutation. Then what would you talk about, a good immune system, lord no.

Then why do people with Leukemia still get colds and flu?

With all of those white corpuscles you'd think a silly virus would stand a chance.

It sounds as if you have no idea how the immune system works.
 
Did normal human immune systems manage to fight off NEW cold and flu viruses for hundreds of thousands of years without the benefit of flu shots and cold medicines, and now have suddenly become incapacitated?

Short answer: They didn't.

Thousands of years? Until the 20th Century populations were decimated by diseases. As global trade progressed and increased so did the spread of disease. You would be hard-pressed to find a population with a healthier diet and lifestyle than the Native American tribes, but when the Spanish and English arrived they began to die of in vast numbers.

Today with air travel a virus can go global within a week.

We're not incapacitated, we're just not ignorant any more. Where I work I can be fired if I show up with the flu and infect the rest of the staff, and rightly so. Plus, what kind of idiot takes an unnecessary risk that can avoided with a vaccine? I plan to visit Panama some day, and this requires a bunch of vaccines prior to traveling. Why? Because there are virus in Panama that my body is not immune to in any way that can kill me.
 
You do realise that people are dying all over the world and in countries where it isn't an election year and where countries aren't getting a 'large bonus'? ?

Why do you think it is just about America?

Yes, people are dying all over the world every day, and they are born all over the world every day.

Are a lot of people dying a lot sooner than they normally would?

Despite alleged excess deaths, it hasn't been proven to my satisfaction that they are.

I've presented a scenario, a relatively simple theory as to what is actually going on, although with lots of dots that seem to connect.

The alternate theory is the emergence of an unprecedentedly lethal coronavirus and he coincidental disappearance of flu viruses, which takes a lot of contorted explaining, and seems to be less compatible with Occam's Razor.
 
Short answer: They didn't.

Thousands of years? Until the 20th Century populations were decimated by diseases. As global trade progressed and increased so did the spread of disease. You would be hard-pressed to find a population with a healthier diet and lifestyle than the Native American tribes, but when the Spanish and English arrived they began to die of in vast numbers.

Today with air travel a virus can go global within a week.

We're not incapacitated, we're just not ignorant any more. Where I work I can be fired if I show up with the flu and infect the rest of the staff, and rightly so. Plus, what kind of idiot takes an unnecessary risk that can avoided with a vaccine? I plan to visit Panama some day, and this requires a bunch of vaccines prior to traveling. Why? Because there are virus in Panama that my body is not immune to in any way that can kill me.


My goto fact about vaccinations:

In 1992 there was a polio outbreak in the Netherlands, which had 97% polio vaccination coverage. This outbreak affected 71 patients of whom 59 were paralysed and 2 died. None had been vaccinated.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/7915354/
 
Caroline might not be aware of this, but the "all you need is a good immune system" line is getting dangerously close to eugenics territory:
we know that ethnic minorities, in particular Latinos and Blacks, are disproportionately likely to catch Covd and suffer serious health issues and death from it.
I don't think Caroline is making a "maybe they just don't wash their hands" argument, but her posts could be read that way if one was not inclined to give the benefit of the doubt.
 
Yes, people are dying all over the world every day, and they are born all over the world every day.

Are a lot of people dying a lot sooner than they normally would?

Despite alleged excess deaths, it hasn't been proven to my satisfaction that they are.

I've presented a scenario, a relatively simple theory as to what is actually going on, although with lots of dots that seem to connect.

The alternate theory is the emergence of an unprecedentedly lethal coronavirus and he coincidental disappearance of flu viruses, which takes a lot of contorted explaining, and seems to be less compatible with Occam's Razor.

London, England was heavily affected. Look at the raw all-cause deaths for 2020 there. And the cumulative death totals to the middle of the year. I've chosen this as the simplest graph. It has also been bad in the winter

[IMGW=640]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EkKbKYGWAAAAXAV?format=png&name=small[/IMGW]

What caused the death rate to triple in April?
 
Right from the get-go the vague Chinese Weapons lab and Pangolin stories smelled fishy, and I began gathering facts.

See my earlier comment about confirmation bias. You experienced an emotional reaction, and then began a post hoc process of reinforcing that initial reaction. This is not the way to a valid conclusion. Look at what you said: 'I came to a conclusion, and then started looking for facts to support it'. This is the exact opposite of what you should have done.

Except, apparently, in the Presidential-election year, where Covid-19 was listed as the cause of death for people in nursing homes on hospice care, and political science trumped biological science.

Citation needed, for the US and also for the rest of the world.
Could you also explain what you think the purpose of this Evil Plan was? To make Trump look bad, or rather, worse, by making him look (more) like an incompetent, self-serving buffoon who only made the epidemic worse? How did this happen? Can you give examples of Democrats influencing doctors and coroners anywhere in the world?
Why would every other country in the world be involved with this?

Also, FactCheck confirmed that hospitals get a large government bonus when they report covid as a contributing factor in deaths, whereas they don't for C. diff. FactCheck pulled that report, but the same info is available elsewhere.

Citation needed.
FactCheck themselves say this claim is untrue:
https://www.factcheck.org/2020/04/hospital-payments-and-the-covid-19-death-count/

What you need to do, then, is show when they published what you claim they published, and when it was 'pulled'. Your claim, your burden of proof.

Then some data from hospitals outside the US (we do have some, you know), showing the same thing- payments from the American government, or their own (you're not clear on which government is making these payments). If not, then perhaps you could explain why hospitals globally are reporting large numbers of Covid cases, without being paid by their respective governments to do so.

If hospitals were paid to report C. diff as a death co-factor, fearmongers could report millions of C. diff deaths world-wide every year.

Unevidenced claim, based on your previous unevidenced claim. Not worth considering further.

I went over all this ad nauseum at Skeptics.com with quotes from The True Believer: Thoughts on the Nature of Mass Movements and other sources, connecting a lot of dots that indicate that Covid-19 is less a catastrophic plague, and more a colossal fiction. It's still there to see, and I won't repeat it here.

So you have evidence, but you won't share it here, because reasons.
As has been pointed out to you before, 'join the dots' is an exercise in conspiratorial pareidolia.
Some indication of how this 'colossal fiction' has been staged would be useful. Otherwise, this is yet another of your unevidenced claims, and not worth the effort of consideration.
So, evidence, please.

Imvho, if we could explain why billions of people have come to believe that an angel hovered over the Virgin Mary causing her to give birth to the Son of God who died for our sins, that it might go a long way toward explaining what kind of economic and political factors interacted to cause billions of people to accept the notion that a common-cold coronavirus is a plague of Biblical proportions and the flu has mysteriously disappeared.

One of the major issues with conspiracy theorists like yourself is this blind dogmatism. The claim that flu has 'disappeared' has been dealt with here. You have simply ignored all the evidence, and carried on your paranoid monologue regardless.
You did promise earlier to examine the data for excess deaths with which you were provided, among a lot of other evidence. Have you done that? If you want us to believe your claims are based on evidence, you should, at some point, actually consider the evidence. It might lend some credibility to your stance.
I should point out, looking at yet another of your religious analogies, that many of the prominent anti-vaxxers claim vaccines are Satanic. I have yet to hear a counter-claim tha vaccines come from God. Even from the Pope, who has been vaccinated. Nor have I seen any evidence for the 'Satanic' nature of vaccines, nor even what that's supposed to mean.
Given your professed antipathy to religious-style delusions, what do you think about this assertion?
 
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Yes, people are dying all over the world every day, and they are born all over the world every day.
A third of Europe died in the Black Death. 500,000 died in the USA this year and 2.5 million around the world because of Covid-19. You didn't know that until we told you.

, it hasn't been proven to my satisfaction that they are.
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<SNIP>
Edited for rule 0, rule 8, and rule 12.
 
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The alternate theory is the emergence of an unprecedentedly lethal coronavirus and he coincidental disappearance of flu viruses, which takes a lot of contorted explaining,

Social distancing and masks reduce virus infection. Influenza and Covid-19 are both viruses.

Are you really unable to follow basic logic?

:wink8:
 
normal human immune systems manage to fight off NEW cold and flu viruses for hundreds of thousands of years without the benefit of flu shots and cold medicines.

One third of Europe died in the Black death.

Here is a drawing of London in the 17th century lockdown.

You really want to go back to this, without vaccines?

Tell us about your Ron Paul theories of white people eugenics?
 

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