Cont: The Trump Presidency: Part 26

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dudalb said:
I am reminded of the old Mafia Bosses developing health problems after indictment and going into court in wheelchairs in "Casino".
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IIRC, there's a real life example. When Epstein made his first (?) court appearance he used a walker to enter the courtroom. All those nubile young girls took a real toll out of him. :(
 
MRC_Hans said:
Sure, I think real crimes should be persecuted. But that is not Biden's call.

Hans
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Why no? The DoJ is going to be his bailiwick for the next four years.

There might be reasons why he shouldn't or wouldn't want to let them go after Trump, but he certainly can have some input if he wants to.

It's not like there isn't plenty of precedent for a POTUS to steer the DoJ.
 
SezMe said:
I disagree. Letting that action (the self-pardon) become precedent just because you want to get Trump out of the limel9ight is a *very* poor statement of one's priorities. Impeachment is the only crime that cannot be pardoned so if self-pardon becomes accepted law, then a president could commit treason and then pardon himself.

No, if Trump self-pardons, I want it to go to the Supremes where, I hope, saner heads would prevail.
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I'm not sure it would set any sort of legal precedent just because it isn't challenged. It might set a cultural one, but we've all seen from the last four years just how ephemeral that is.

Many of us (myself included) have said the same thing about blanket pardons, as in Nixon's, but thinking about it, there has never been a legal challenge to that, and thus no legal precedent.

I see no reason why that means there couldn't be, or that a court would accept a fait accompli as a binding legal consideration.
 
I got a kick out of this article.

Who’s Afraid of the 800-pound Gorilla? [politico.com]
Trump is a loser—he lost the 2020 race even more dramatically than he won the 2016 contest. Even losers can stage comebacks, such as Richard Nixon did in 1968 after losing the 1960 squeaker to John Kennedy. But such rallies from defeat are exceedingly uncommon in American politics. Trump can bellow all he wants about how the election was “stolen” from him. He can stage his own counter-inauguration on the pretext that he’s still president. He can even change his first name to “President,” but it won’t scratch out the big “L” next to his name in the standings. It might take a few weeks after he leaves office and takes his political circus on the road and hooks up with (or buys) a cable network, but the loser stink has descended on Trump, and it won’t be easy to wash off.
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eerok said:
I got a kick out of this article.

Who’s Afraid of the 800-pound Gorilla? [politico.com]"...but the loser stink has descended on Trump, and it won’t be easy to wash off."
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But Trump's not losing, he's winning. He has so far raised $200 million that he wouldn't have if he had remained president. He has 80% of conservatives believing every lie he spouts, and he's still living rent-free in liberals' heads. 17 traitorous states have joined him in an unprecedented attempt to destroy US democracy, Republicans are so scared of crossing him that they dare not make a move, and all this is helping him rake in even more money. He's running the biggest con in US history, and there's nothing we can do about it.

Trump is more of a winner now than ever!
 
SezMe said:
I disagree. Letting that action (the self-pardon) become precedent just because you want to get Trump out of the limel9ight is a *very* poor statement of one's priorities. Impeachment is the only crime that cannot be pardoned so if self-pardon becomes accepted law, then a president could commit treason and then pardon himself.

No, if Trump self-pardons, I want it to go to the Supremes where, I hope, saner heads would prevail.
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Maybe. The whole pardon thing is insane. Why should the president be able to pardon anybody at all?

So right, a court case could be the thin end of the wedge to at least limit the scope of pardoning.

Hans
 
Roger Ramjets said:
But Trump's not losing, he's winning. He has so far raised $200 million that he wouldn't have if he had remained president. He has 80% of conservatives believing every lie he spouts, and he's still living rent-free in liberals' heads. 17 traitorous states have joined him in an unprecedented attempt to destroy US democracy, Republicans are so scared of crossing him that they dare not make a move, and all this is helping him rake in even more money. He's running the biggest con in US history, and there's nothing we can do about it.

Trump is more of a winner now than ever!
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A lot of good all that will do him while he serves out 5 to 15 on Rikers Island for tax evasion and fraud, etc.
 
The Great Zaganza said:
Trump's stupid lawsuits aimed at the Supreme Court might, in fact, not be about overturning the Election, but about something much more important to Trump:

testing the loyalty of 'his' judges to gauge whether they would uphold a Self-Pardon.

This will be the real test of the Supreme Court, the make-or-break of the Roberts Court.


It would be devastating to the the Separation of Power if the SC rules that the President is, in fact, above the law.
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(Sorry The Great, not singling you out, yours is the post that pushed me over the line.)

PLEASE, PLEASE STOP THINKING TRUMP IS CAPABLE OF PLANNING ANYTHING!!

Over the last 4 years there is literally zero evidence that Trump is capable of any strategic or tactical thinking. He lives entirely “in the moment” he simply reacts to outside stimulus.
 
Jim_MDP said:
I already figured Bob for a Biden man.
Any news on how his (dead) vote was cast? [emoji1]
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Oh someone could have some fun with that. There must have been a “Bob Hope” who voted in this election, someone needs to tweet that to Trump!
 
Darat said:
(Sorry The Great, not singling you out, yours is the post that pushed me over the line.)

PLEASE, PLEASE STOP THINKING TRUMP IS CAPABLE OF PLANNING ANYTHING!!

Over the last 4 years there is literally zero evidence that Trump is capable of any strategic or tactical thinking. He lives entirely “in the moment” he simply reacts to outside stimulus.
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It's not that - Trump doesn't have a plan, he has the same strategy he always had: get others to bend the rules for him until they feel too complicit to refuse him.
Trump would do the same to test how and how much to bribe tax assessors.
 
Darat said:
(Sorry The Great, not singling you out, yours is the post that pushed me over the line.)

PLEASE, PLEASE STOP THINKING TRUMP IS CAPABLE OF PLANNING ANYTHING!!

Over the last 4 years there is literally zero evidence that Trump is capable of any strategic or tactical thinking. He lives entirely “in the moment” he simply reacts to outside stimulus.
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This is a meta-debate that's been hanging over the entire Trump fiasco nearly as long as it has been happening and I think both sides are correct in their own way.

No Trump not capable of "planning" anything. He is simply a toddler writ large, throwing himself on the ground kicking and screaming. I've long routinely and loudly professed my displeasure at the Left's response to Trump's goal of flipping the board over with "So I need to play Chess better? Play it 5 steps ahead instead of 4?"

But "Doesn't have a plan" isn't the same thing as acting randomly or without purpose. Trump does have a sort of low animal cunning and a keenly honed survivors instinct. He has, subconsciously, trained himself into being a very effective in the moment bully and monkey wrench.

And let's be fair planning or not, he confounded us at damn near every turn for a long, long time.
 
Darat said:
Oh someone could have some fun with that. There must have been a “Bob Hope” who voted in this election, someone needs to tweet that to Trump!
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The original Bob Hope of celebrity fame was an unrepentant Republican who liked to hobnob with GOP presidents from Eisenhower to Reagan.

He also wasn't very fond of minorities, feminists, gays, anti-war activists, etc..

Dead or alive, he may well have been a Trump supporter.
 
The Great Zaganza said:
It's not that - Trump doesn't have a plan, he has the same strategy he always had: get others to bend the rules for him until they feel too complicit to refuse him.
Trump would do the same to test how and how much to bribe tax assessors.
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I don’t think he does. He doesn’t recognise rules and limits like a normal person, he merely has wants and acts on those without any consideration of future consequences.
 
Darat said:
I don’t think he does. He doesn’t recognise rules and limits like a normal person, he merely has wants and acts on those without any consideration of future consequences.
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and certainly without any consideration of (or even awareness of) inconvenience, disorder, pain, or despair caused to others.

His entire world is simply NPCs who are loyal and NPCs who are not. And one of his biggest frustrations is keeping track of who moves from one category to another.
 
Ladewig said:
His entire world is simply NPCs who are loyal and NPCs who are not. And one of his biggest frustrations is keeping track of who moves from one category to another.
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Well, let's hope he accidentally kills a chicken, so the entire town will turn on him.
 
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