2019-nCoV / Corona virus Pt 2

Status
Not open for further replies.
Skeptical Greg said:
I think that information would be the responsibility of the person making the claim.


For instance, if I said you killed person X, I would need to name that person, after which you could show evidence that you did not kill that person.
Click to expand...
Vacuous posturing on steroids.

As if this is debate 101 and you're trying too hard to impress the teacher. And as if the US isn't lagging behind other countries. And as if that lagging doesn't have implications.
 
casebro said:
For all the politicizing, name calling and Trump bashing, can any body show me some comparative numbers demonstrating how the USA is worse off than everywhere else on the planet?
Click to expand...

You'll have to wait until we catch up in testing. In the meantime with just undercounted cases:
Map: Confirmed US COVID-19 Cases Now 3rd Highest In World; 2 New Deaths In LA County

At some point we'll find out just how many health care workers have been infected for lack of adequate PPE
 
pipelineaudio said:
Sheesh....this is the worst karma ever...people living it up here while the world is dying...BTW against the articles claims, since the locals are out of work and school, its mostly them, not so much tourists, especially on the non tourist beaches

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...aFhXsshr9N8yBAIkq6hSvsXJ0sDSoADz9D3LD4Z6kwNp0
Click to expand...
Reminds me of accounts of Titanic where passengers played kick-around with chunks of ice on the deck, took in all the commotion from the promenade, and then retired to the smoking room for revelry because "there's a chill tonight."
 
pipelineaudio said:
Sheesh....this is the worst karma ever...people living it up here while the world is dying...BTW against the articles claims, since the locals are out of work and school, its mostly them, not so much tourists, especially on the non tourist beaches

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...aFhXsshr9N8yBAIkq6hSvsXJ0sDSoADz9D3LD4Z6kwNp0
Click to expand...

I suspect beaches aren't really as much a problem as many other areas. People tend to sit close to other people that they already know and spend a lot of time with. It's interactions with others that interact with large numbers. Hair salons, buffets, conferences in more enclosed spaces that is more problematic.

Also, this virus infects more 1%ers than hoi polloi, because they tend to be more social with larger numbers. I got a haircut a few weeks back and expect I may not get another for many months. Fine with me. Told the wife that her regular club meetings, nails, brows, and hair updates need to be put on hold.
 
deleted. Decided it was too close to that forbidden topic in this thread.
 
Last edited:
Unconfired reports the Harvey Weinstein has contractec the Virus.
I see that Karma might be using the Corona Outbreak for it's own pruposes.
 
Skeptic Ginger said:
You'll have to wait until we catch up in testing. In the meantime with just undercounted cases:
Map: Confirmed US COVID-19 Cases Now 3rd Highest In World; 2 New Deaths In LA County

At some point we'll find out just how many health care workers have been infected for lack of adequate PPE
Click to expand...

PPE availability is a big part of the problem. I'm hoping the serologic tests that supposedly only require a finger prick of blood ( < .1ml) will work, ramp up and reduce the protection workers need to have to stick a swab up someone's nose to the back of their throat. That process is going to generate all sorts of fomites. I sputter just thinking about it.

It'll also give us decent surveillance capability, ultimately yielding better CFR numbers.
 
Meadmaker said:
Is there a good source of information that describes just what a coronavirus test actually is and how it's done?

What I mean is that I have read, and I'm pretty sure it's accurate, that this is a PCR test that looks for DNA markers (RNA?) that are unique to the SARS 2 virus.

Ok, so what does that mean? I know on "Law and Order" that means they send in a sample and it comes back identifying who the victim/killer is, in ways that make the plot interesting. I know that in real life, it involves taking some sort of bodily fluids, putting them in some sort of medium, adding some sort of chemicals, and somehow getting a computer printout that says you're 62% Irish, and have the coronavirus.

I want to know a little bit more than that.

Not that I can do anything about it, but I'm curious what the holdup is in making more test kits. I'm guessing that this "reagent" that they mention is some rather specific set of chemicals that can't be produced using things you buy at the grocery store.

If that's not it, then what the heck is the issue with producing about 500 million test kits?

So, I would like to have an "advanced layman's" guide to PCR and/or the coronavirus testing process. What I mean by that is I have a graduate degree in electrical engineering, so I'm no scientific slouch, but my eyes glaze over once specific chemical names start being used. I've always wondered how real biotech stuff, like pills, actually gets created, purified, and stuck in a powder. I don't expect to learn that in any real way, but if I could read, "This tests requires 3-9-Whattheheckisthat that can only be produced by a process that requires 85 hours of fermentation time" that would greatly increase my knowledge.

Not that it matters much, but I do find it interesting, but as long as I'm fretting about coronaviruses, I always like education.
Click to expand...


It’s easier if you read this


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_transcription_polymerase_chain_reaction

And then ask what you don’t understand.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
Skeptic Ginger said:
At some point we'll find out just how many health care workers have been infected for lack of adequate PPE
Click to expand...

What is your experience with in regards to healthcare workers getting tested? I wouldn't say they are going out of their way not to test them, but from people I know first move is for them to self quarantine, then check in days later to look for improvement if they are up to come back to work.

If we are prioritizing tests, they should be used on health care providers, particularly hospital workers first and continuously if need be. Not sure if this is specific to my area or the hospitals they happen to work at as opposed to general though.
 
pipelineaudio said:
Sheesh....this is the worst karma ever...people living it up here while the world is dying...BTW against the articles claims, since the locals are out of work and school, its mostly them, not so much tourists, especially on the non tourist beaches
Click to expand...

Same everywhere.

People are treating it as a holiday. Funny how that never happened in China...

dudalb said:
Unconfired reports the Harvey Weinstein has contractec the Virus.
I see that Karma might be using the Corona Outbreak for it's own pruposes.
Click to expand...

It's certainly in NY jails.

But hey, in among the riots & resulting deaths, we'll get some really reliable stats in a large, finite population, plus how Covid impacts on a pool of mainly deprived people.
 
marting said:
PPE availability is a big part of the problem. I'm hoping the serologic tests that supposedly only require a finger prick of blood ( < .1ml) will work, ramp up and reduce the protection workers need to have to stick a swab up someone's nose to the back of their throat. That process is going to generate all sorts of fomites. I sputter just thinking about it.

It'll also give us decent surveillance capability, ultimately yielding better CFR numbers.
Click to expand...

Thank god we are getting back to the science. I promise to take my raw politics to the other thread.

The problem with the serological tests is that they only detect the disease after you mount an immune response to it. Typically 10 to 14 days after infection. Too slow for initial screening but helpful for tracking the virus later.
 
A thought on the testing- It is based on a nasal swab. It means the patient has been exposed, he has virus in his nose. I don't think that necessarily means he has the disease, dose it? (typographical error, but I'll leave it)

Also, how long can the virus survive in nasal mucous? in a person who is immune to the disease? Same as on a surface? So, how likely is it that all those people who "test positive" not only do not have the disease, but also only have dead viruses in their samples? So they can't spread it either?
 
casebro said:
A thought on the testing- It is based on a nasal swab. It means the patient has been exposed, he has virus in his nose. I don't think that necessarily means he has the disease, dose it? (typographical error, but I'll leave it)

Also, how long can the virus survive in nasal mucous? in a person who is immune to the disease? Same as on a surface? So, how likely is it that all those people who "test positive" not only do not have the disease, but also only have dead viruses in their samples? So they can't spread it either?
Click to expand...


The virus is in the nasal mucus because it is replicating and being shed and thereby the patient is infected. Whether they show signs of the disease is related mainly to age and co-morbidities.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
casebro said:
For all the politicizing, name calling and Trump bashing, can any body show me some comparative numbers demonstrating how the USA is worse off than everywhere else on the planet?
Click to expand...

Certainly. Look to your northern neighbour, Canada.

Canada has approximately 1/10 the population of the US (37 million people vs 330 million.). Typically things happen in a 10:1 ratio for the US vs Canada; for example, all other things being equal, for every pound of spaghetti sold in Canada there would be 10 pounds sold in the US.

Now look at the COVID-19 numbers. The latest (from Wikipedia) shows 32,412 confirmed cases and 414 deaths in the US, and only 1,435 cases and 21 deaths in Canada. That means for every one Canadian case there are 23 US cases (not 10 as would normally be expected) and for every Canadian death there are 20 American deaths (again, not 10 US deaths as would be expected.)

The bottom line is the US is getting hit twice as hard as Canada. And the gap is increasing as the days go on.

I trust this is sufficient evidence to answer your question.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom