Should we fear Bernie?

[The Great Zaganza]

Trump ran his campaign promising things that everyone not blinded by his charm could see he would never be able to accomplish.

It seems to me that many Sanders supporters are falling into the same trap.

 

[Darat]

Again I get that there is absolutely no way to say this without it coming across as some treacle nationlistic "'Murica! Love it or leave it! Yee-haw!" type screed but again we are sort of reaching the point where if "Well so and so country makes it work" is the answer to everything, questions as to what about America we are trying to save or preserve do start to be put onto the table and... why on a personal level, not as a moralistic judgement but as a simple question of personal effeciency "Well why not just move to Sweden if everything they do there is better then the way we do it here" start to become less avoidable.

I'm being 100% serious here. Wouldn't just moving to Europe just be easier if everything they do is better and nobody is going to fight you when you want to do it that way?

The American Dream?

At the moment it doesn't happen, wouldn't USA folk want it to be a reality?

 

[Sideroxylon]

See what I mean about crabby bunnies? Gentlements! (And also ladykinds, if any there be), can we not get along politely? Our civilization crumbles beneath the twin scourges of a rampant disgusting virus infecting us with horror, and also a coronavirus. At least we should endure destruction cheerfully and be nice to each other in our limited time remaining.

Yes, things are looking a bit dire. Sage advice that I believe I can heed. Thanks.

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

The question of who will or will not get "destroyed" doesn't really have an easy answer.

I feel like for some Americans just the word "socialist" will be enough to destroy Sanders. Cuba is just a little bit of garnish on top of that. But Sanders is better at defending himself than Biden is.

OTOH, "Sleepy Joe" is a much better bit of branding than anything Biden himself has. It's also going to be effective because he does have problems expressing himself in public (whether that's due to a genuine cognitive decline or is just a symptom of his stutter is irrelevant, as the question isn't about what is or is not true).

I've said before, I think it will likely come down to the youth vote and whether they actually bother turning up - which they thus far haven't.

Biden seems like the candidate who will appeal to people who liked Hillary Clinton, and Sanders seems like the candidate who will appeal to people who like Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.

 

[The Great Zaganza]

"Sleepy Joe" is a powerful branding - but not necessarily a negative one.
What Conservatives are most worried about is "Activist Progressives", i.e. those who will go to great lengths to push the envelope on liberal policies.
being called sleepy makes Biden seem much less scary as the Democrat In Chief - unlike, say, Warren, who not only really wants big change but also knows how to achieve it.

 

[Belz...]

This response is astounding.

Only if you think that other people vote according to YOUR principles and ideals.

 

[Distracted1]

"Sleepy Joe" is a powerful branding - but not necessarily a negative one.
What Conservatives are most worried about is "Activist Progressives", i.e. those who will go to great lengths to push the envelope on liberal policies.
being called sleepy makes Biden seem much less scary as the Democrat In Chief - unlike, say, Warren, who not only really wants big change but also knows how to achieve it.

We need to sneak her in as Biden V.P.

 

[The Great Zaganza]

We need to sneak her in as Biden V.P.

I'd rather she becomes Secretary of the Treasury.

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

"Sleepy Joe" is a powerful branding - but not necessarily a negative one.
What Conservatives are most worried about is "Activist Progressives", i.e. those who will go to great lengths to push the envelope on liberal policies.
being called sleepy makes Biden seem much less scary as the Democrat In Chief - unlike, say, Warren, who not only really wants big change but also knows how to achieve it.

Yeah, what I was intending to get across was that each of the two candidates could have difficulty getting elected, but for somewhat different reasons. Sanders gets both sides fired up, Biden neither.

 

[Segnosaur]

Re: Elizabeth Warren...

We need to sneak her in as Biden V.P.

I'd rather she becomes Secretary of the Treasury.

I would rather she stay where she is, in the Senate.

Not that she wouldn't be OK as VP or in a Biden cabinet, but the battle for the senate is very tight, and I think the Democrats need every competent senator they can get.

 

[Distracted1]

I would rather she stay where she is, in the Senate.

Not that she wouldn't be OK as VP or in a Biden cabinet, but the battle for the senate is very tight, and I think the Democrats need every competent senator they can get.

There are a shortage of competent Democratic Senate candidates in Massachusetts?

 

[Segnosaur]

Re: Elizabeth Warren as VP...

I would rather she stay where she is, in the Senate.

Not that she wouldn't be OK as VP or in a Biden cabinet, but the battle for the senate is very tight, and I think the Democrats need every competent senator they can get.

There are a shortage of competent Democratic Senate candidates in Massachusetts?

I'm sure there are a lot of good potential Democrats in Massachusetts. But, none would have the experience that Warren does in the senate. Plus, even though the state leans Democrat, there is always a risk that the republicans could sneak a victory.

 

[varwoche]

Would you care to address my post, which covers a some of Sanders’ message?

In your post that I quoted I assume?

To the extent that justice and fairness is being thwarted by not supporting Bernie, for at least some of Bernie doubters, that's due to non electability. It's not because I have a soft spot for billionaires or for status quo in general.

That rude presumption is on par with: You support an unelectable candidate. Hence you're a Trump supporter.

 

[Craig4]

“Castro loving”

You got me in stitches.

That quote wrote off Florida for him. You might be in stitches but Cubans in Florida aren't. Let me explain how this works. The West Coast, Nevada, Colorado, New England and probably New Mexico are all Blue States. Texas, the Midwest, the Southeast except Maryland, Florida, North Carolina and Virginia are Red states. That leaves Ohio 18, Michigan 16, Pennsylvania 20, North Carolina 15, Florida 29, Wisconsin 10 and Arizona 11 to fight over.

Do you now see why Sander's losing Florida means he won't get the nomination? If a Dem wins Florida that takes him or her to 261. All the Dem needs to do is win any of the other states to make it to 270.

 

[Craig4]

Would you care to address my post, which covers a some of Sanders’ message?

Sander's message doesn't matter without a map to the nomination. You really have no idea how our elections work do you?

 

[dudalb]

Sander's message doesn't matter without a map to the nomination. You really have no idea how our elections work do you?

Yeah,I noted that about this poster. For all of his blind worship of Sanders, he seems incredibly ignorant of how US elections and US politics in general work.

 

[Upchurch]

In all seriousness, can someone explain who the Democratic Party establishment is? I mean, what are their names, what powers/controls to they have, and what actions have they actually taken to keep Sanders from winning the nomination?

Every time I see it brought up, it seems to be taken for granted that this person or body of people is a known thing and their actions are obvious.

 

[Travis]

In all seriousness, can someone explain who the Democratic Party establishment is? I mean, what are their names, what powers/controls to they have, and what actions have they actually taken to keep Sanders from winning the nomination?

Every time I see it brought up, it seems to be taken for granted that this person or body of people is a known thing and their actions are obvious.

Subsidiary of "Them."

 

[Upchurch]

Subsidiary of "Them."

That’s what it feels like, but this is a discussion forum. I’m hoping someone will defend the idea enough to at least try to explain what this means.

 

[d4m10n]

In all seriousness, can someone explain who the Democratic Party establishment is? I mean, what are their names, what powers/controls to they have, and what actions have they actually taken to keep Sanders from winning the nomination?

Democratic establishment consists of the public political figures whom we've seen endorsing Biden in public.

As to how the process works, here's a relevant summary from the book The Party Decides:

The reformers of the 1970s tried to wrest the presidential nomination away from insiders and to bestow it on rank-and-file partisans, but the people who are regularly active in party politics have regained much of the control that was lost. Control rests on their ability to reach early agreement on whom to support and to exploit two kinds of advantage-control of campaign resources (money, knowledge, labor) and the persuasive power of a united front of inside players. Insider control is not unshakable, but it has usually been sufficient to the task at hand for some two decades.

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/5312951-the-party-decides