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Therapist says if you're an atheist you should lie to your kids about God.

I glanced at the thread title and saw: The rapist says if you're an atheist you should lie to your kids about God.

Makes as much sense either way.
 
Steve said:
welshdean said:
Doc.
What do you tell the kids when someones 'Uncle Ernie' dies?
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If it is an Uncle Ernie like in “Tommy” you invite the kids to join in the celebration.
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Is there any other 'Uncle Ernie'?
My point being, if it behoves Doc to lie to a child about Auntie Doris, sitting on a cloud, being massaged by angels, then what if an absolute bastard like Townshends 'Ernie' dies? Would you, Doc, tell the same poor child that his uncle is having hot lava poured down his 'japs-eye' for all eternity*?


*or some other painful punishment.
 
Or if you want to follow what many of the Christian religions think:

Parent: Uncle Ernie has died.
KID: What does that mean?
Parent:You'll never see him again.
Kid: Really?
Parent: Well not in this life, but as he died he gave his heart to Jesus so he is now in heaven.
Kid: Heaven?
Parent: Yes. It's where everyone that gives their heart to Jesus lives for every more. It's where everything is beuatiful, everyone is very happy and you'll be with Uncle Ernie again.
Kid: When I'm in heaven will Uncle Ernie still come into my room every night and rape me?
Parent: ....

Yep lies are always so comforting.
 
welshdean said:
Is there any other 'Uncle Ernie'?
My point being, if it behoves Doc to lie to a child about Auntie Doris, sitting on a cloud, being massaged by angels, then what if an absolute bastard like Townshends 'Ernie' dies? Would you, Doc, tell the same poor child that his uncle is having hot lava poured down his 'japs-eye' for all eternity*?


*or some other painful punishment.
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Well, I'd probably tell the child that since Uncle Ernie did very bad things and chose not to ask for forgiveness from God, he will spend eternity away from God and heaven. It was Uncle Ernie's own choice not to be near God or be in heaven.

Upon reading the below article, my actions above might be something the current pope would agree with:

https://www.ncronline.org/news/opinion/signs-times/pope-francis-and-hell
 
DOC said:
Well, I'd probably tell the child that since Uncle Ernie did very bad things and chose not to ask for forgiveness from God, he will spend eternity away from God and heaven. It was Uncle Ernie's own choice not to be near God or be in heaven.
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You'd compound the lie of a god's existence with lies about the existence of make believe heaven and hell?
 
Wow all of this just seems so infinitely more complicated then just not making up a God you then have to make up stuff to explain.
 
Here's a counterpoint in Psychology Today to that religious psychoanalyst: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/...ould-you-lie-your-kids-about-believing-in-god

Komisar maintains that parents who aren’t religious should just, well... fake it. Pretend. Deceive. Lie.

No, no, no, and no.
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and

Recent research has found that children raised in non-religious homes do just fine. In fact, many do better than fine, exhibiting a plethora of positive moral traits that are sometimes more pronounced than children raised in religious homes.
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Bolding mine.

So, while I don't usually consider opinions to be correct or incorrect, Komisar's opinion is wrong.

I'll just leave the lying and moral bankruptcy to the religious.
 
Don't let the atheists get to you, DOC. Believers lie to themselves, so why shouldn't they lie to their kids, right?
 
RoboTimbo said:
Here's a counterpoint in Psychology Today to that religious psychoanalyst: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/...ould-you-lie-your-kids-about-believing-in-god
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The title of this thread contains the wording "if you're an atheist". If the author (Phil Zuckerman) of the above article is an atheist he would still be acting untruthful by saying such things to the child as "maybe we float in the clouds" or "maybe we return as another life-form" after death. That sounds more like an agnostic than a true atheist.
 
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DOC said:
The title of this thread contains the wording "if you're an atheist". If the author of the above article is an atheist he would still be acting untruthful by saying such things to the child as "maybe we float in the clouds" or "maybe we return as another life-form". That sounds more like an agnostic then a true atheist.
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Oh goodie that meaningless hairsplit. Yes let's have a 50 page meaningless hijack about that.

Reality doesn't change based on personal opinions. If you honestly believe the moon is made of green cheese you shouldn't "also teach your child that just to hedge your bets."

"Belief" is just meaningless a euphemism for disinformation.
 
DOC said:
The title of this thread contains the wording "if you're an atheist". If the author of the above article is an atheist he would still be acting untruthful by saying such things to the child as "maybe we float in the clouds" or "maybe we return as another life-form". That sounds more like an agnostic then a true atheist.
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I suspect the author of the above article was only talking to atheists as he knows that theists will continue to lie to their children.
 
Thermal said:
I'm on the edge of my seat to see that robust evidence that *checks notes* telling your kids about Santa has the potential to harm trust, et al. Groundbreaking research, I'm sure. Otherwise, that which is asserted with out evidence...



Yeah, got it the first time. Since the theme is what creates trust issues, to wit: I assert, with the same authority as you do, that taking Santa away from your kids has the potential to harm trust.
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Respectfully, I don't think you're understanding my point at all.

1. If a child goes many years being told by their parents that Santa is real, and then one day the child learns that Santa is not real, they might feel as though they've been lied to. That harms trust.

2. Likewise, if that same child is told from day 1 that Santa is not real (but it's still fun to pretend), there is no lie, and no harm to trust can result.

Do you disagree with either of the above statements?
 
DOC said:
The title of this thread contains the wording "if you're an atheist". If the author (Phil Zuckerman) of the above article is an atheist he would still be acting untruthful by saying such things to the child as "maybe we float in the clouds" or "maybe we return as another life-form" after death. That sounds more like an agnostic than a true atheist.
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So what? You have provided one (1) professional opinion that people should lie to their children about God, and you've been provided with one (1) equally credible professional opinion that they shouldn't. At the moment, neither side has the preponderance of evidence, so you should stop acting as though your side of the argument is proven when it isn't.

Dave
 
Once a child can formulate the question they can, at least in a hazy abstract way, conceive of multiple answers.

You tell them the truth in a nice way that is comprehensible to them.

You don’t need to be the straw man atheist ******* delighting in ruining children’s imagination. Just don’t lie.

The truth, as near as we know it, is the correct answer to the question.
 
autumn1971 said:
You don’t need to be the straw man atheist ******* delighting in ruining children’s imagination. Just don’t lie.
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And, of course, saying "I don't know what happens to people after they die" is not a lie. I'm pretty certain the answer is that the person doesn't exist any more, but I couldn't put my hand on my heart and swear that I'm absolutely 100% certain of that. Even though I'm as strong-case an atheist as anyone I've ever encountered, I'd be stupid if I wasn't prepared to revise my understanding in the light of new evidence.

Oh, and "agnostic" and "atheist" are not mutually exclusive; they refer to different axes, of what we believe and of our confidence in those beliefs.

Dave
 
Thermal said:
I'm on the edge of my seat to see that robust evidence that *checks notes* telling your kids about Santa has the potential to harm trust, et al. Groundbreaking research, I'm sure. Otherwise, that which is asserted with out evidence...



Yeah, got it the first time. Since the theme is what creates trust issues, to wit: I assert, with the same authority as you do, that taking Santa away from your kids has the potential to harm trust.
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Where did the Santa we're taking away come from? I agree that if your kid has decided on their (sic) own to believe in Santa it seems reasonable to let it slide, or at least not to drop the hammer. But if nobody gives them (sic) Santa, then there's nothing to take away. And if a Santa story from elsewhere is contrary to one's principles, then why should it be reinforced? Must we go along with anything if the kid picks it up on the street? When our devout Catholic neighbors told me at five that I'd go to Hell for not believing, my parents did not consider it a breach of trust to tell me that it was a matter of faith, not fact. Santa is a little more benign than that, but I think if one treats him as make believe, or just kind of sidesteps him, kids get the idea quickly enough.

If you commit to telling your kids about Santa, then I would guess you're committed to the story, but there's no law that says one has to, any more than we must tell them about the Easter Bunny or the Flying Spaghetti Monster or the four horsemen of the apocalypse.
 
In the end, there's just no need to lie to children. I never lied to my child, and he grew up fine. If you lie to a child, one day you're going to have to explain to them why you lied.
 
To each his own I suppose. I'm nearly 40 and still have very fun, fond memories of awaiting Santa, the Easter Bunny, the Tooth Fairy, etc. I've raised children in a similar fashion and I know they enjoyed it, too. I never once harbored any ill-will towards my parents. I was aware enough to realize it was for fun.
 
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