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House Impeachment Inquiry

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theprestige said:
And yet, by design, they are part of the prosecution. Nullifying a presidential election is a serious thing. The system is designed to fail if there isn't broad bipartisan support for it. Everybody knew going into this that the House was going to be divided on the issue. While the Democrats could use their majority to push it forward, there was never any question of the Republicans quietly playing along.
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The system was also designed based on the expectation that most members of Congress would have enough dignity and self-respect to put the welfare of the country and the honor of the office of the Presidency ahead of their party's political interests.

Boy did they get that wrong.
 
theprestige said:
And yet, by design, they are part of the prosecution.
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True, pity they seem to forget this.

Nullifying a presidential election is a serious thing.
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Also true, again it seems to be something the Republicans have forgotten, because they aren't taking it seriously.

The system is designed to fail if there isn't broad bipartisan support for it.
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Also true, but it was devised by people that expected those involved to enter into it with good faith and with the mind to uphold their Oaths of Office to uphold the Constitution and the Laws of the US. That's not what we are seeing. Rather than defending the Constitution against all enemies, both foreign and domestic, the Republicans are defending the President's apparent violations of the Constitution.

Everybody knew going into this that the House was going to be divided on the issue.
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Again true, but again we're seeing what happens when a Party has become so anti to bi-partisanship that they will never agree to work with the other one, and instead of deferring to the Constitution and doing their job of overview, are little more than another arm of the President.

While the Democrats could use their majority to push it forward, there was never any question of the Republicans quietly playing along.
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No one was expecting them to play quietly along, we were hoping that they might do their jobs and instead of putting up smoke screen and yelling squirrel that they might ask questions to get to the truth of what happened regardless of what that truth is. Instead they don't want the truth to come out and are doing everything they can to distract, undermine, and conceal what the President and those around him were doing. If there was nothing wrong with it, if it was all above board and business as usual, then it shouldn't matter that the truth and the facts come out and are examined in the light of day because it will show that everything was above board, but instead they and the Executive are working hard to hide the truth, and are even lying about it to the American people so as to hide it even more. That is a violation of their Oaths, and a betrayal of the American people, and yet their base love them for it because by lying and shouting they are "sticking it to the libtards!" and that seems to be all that matters.
 
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Ivanka Trump just tweeted: “A decline of public morals in the United States will probably be marked by the abuse of the power of impeachment as a means of crushing political adversaries or ejecting them from office.”

Alexis de Tocqueville, 1835

I'm sure she's a big Tocqueville fan. What's funny is Trump apologists claiming that Democrats are unable to beat Trump in an election, so they're trying to get rid of him through Constitutional measures. As if the super-majority required in the Senate is somehow easier than winning in the Electoral College. It's also a bit ridiculous to suggest impeachment has been abused when Democrats didn't even attempt it after the Mueller Report. Of course, the President is the one who has abused power. He's used taxpayer money to enlist a foreign government to harm a political adversary. A decline in public morals brought us Donald Trump.
 
Cain said:
Ivanka Trump just tweeted: “A decline of public morals in the United States will probably be marked by the abuse of the power of impeachment as a means of crushing political adversaries or ejecting them from office.”

Alexis de Tocqueville, 1835

I'm sure she's a big Tocqueville fan. What's funny is Trump apologists claiming that Democrats are unable to beat Trump in an election, so they're trying to get rid of him through Constitutional measures. As if the super-majority required in the Senate is somehow easier than winning in the Electoral College. It's also a bit ridiculous to suggest impeachment has been abused when Democrats didn't even attempt it after the Mueller Report. Of course, the President is the one who has abused power. He's used taxpayer money to enlist a foreign government to harm a political adversary. A decline in public morals brought us Donald Trump.
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You are assuming that the claims that the Republicans are making need to conform to reality. When Republicans can lie to their base all while knowing that those of their base know what they are being told is a lie, and yet will still happily eat it up because as long as they get to see the Libtards losing, they don't care about the destruction of Tradition, the Law, and Constitution that is occurring all about them. Remember that these are the very same people that would rather burn the Planet than take any environmental action because to do so would force them to accept that the Libtards were right about something, which is an unforgivable sin.
 
Stacyhs said:
Jordan is, yet again, repeating the same old "Zelensky got the money without a meeting or investigation" spiel but ignoring the fact that the money was released just after the WH learned of the whistleblower's report. He's repeating the Pelosi "imposter" claim which he's misrepresented. He's repeating that "the Dems have never accepted Trump winning so they're out to get him, no matter what" and the "failed Mueller report" song and dance. This is all desperation because they know the evidence of a quid pro quo is strong and God forbid they hold Trump responsible for his abuse of office.

Jordan is nothing more than a Trump sycophant.
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Lying to Congress is a crime. What about lying by Congress?
It would be tremendously satisfying if Jordan and Nunes were charged.
 
fishbob said:
Lying to Congress is a crime. What about lying by Congress?
It would be tremendously satisfying if Jordan and Nunes were charged.
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Sadly it isn't. Congress critters can say whatever they like with impunity. In fact if it's similar to our Parliament here, then there is probably a law that says they can't even be sued for liable spoken in the House/Senate.

ETA: there are a few things on which they have to avoid lies, one of which is if they send a formal "Dear Members" letter to the house, but when speaking they can lie through their teeth and have no repercussions.
 
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theprestige said:
What Democrats don't understand (and therefore don't know to admit) is that the impeachment process is a House process, not a Democrats process. House Republicans have just as much standing to participate in the proceedings as their colleagues across the aisle. The House is in the process of building their case, prior to presenting it to the Senate. Obviously this process will be dominated by the Democrats, with the goal of arguing for removal from office. The Senate will consider that argument and vote on it.

But right now, this is a House process, and House Republicans are part of this process. In fact, this is appropriate time - the only time - for House Republicans to weigh in on the process. House Republicans aren't part of "the defense". They're part of the prosecution.
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Or they should be.
No shows during impeachment inquiry depositions

14 Republican committee members never showed up.
 
Doubt said:
A lot of the opening and closing remarks by both Schiff and Nunes are quite repetitive. Schiff seems to repeat about half of the same stuff. Nunes now has a litany that is about 80% the same.

To save some time just have them number their statements and call out the numbers before moving on with the hearings.
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Schiff has been adding a summary of the previous day's testimony. Nunes simply gets more and more into his CT territory.
 
I have to laugh every time Jordan, Nunes, et al. start with their trumped up indignation over Schiff not providing the whistleblower to testify when Dear Leader has ordered Pompeo, Giuliani, Mulvaney, etc NOT to testify. Pompous asses.
 
Stacyhs said:
I have to laugh every time Jordan, Nunes, et al. start with their trumped up indignation over Schiff not providing the whistleblower to testify when Dear Leader has ordered Pompeo, Giuliani, Mulvaney, etc NOT to testify.
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Maybe the two parties can cut a deal.

GOP gets to call three witnesses of their choice if they are willing to allow three administration employees to testify under similar conditions.
 
d4m10n said:
Maybe the two parties can cut a deal.

GOP gets to call three witnesses of their choice if they are willing to allow three administration employees to testify under similar conditions.
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Who would the GOP call except for the whistleblower? After all, according to them, Pompeo, Giuliani, Mulvaney etc would testify there was no qpq, right? Which leads one one to wonder exactly why they were ordered not to testify.

They know the whistleblower can't provide any more info than s/he already has. What they REALLY want is to find out who it was.
 
theprestige said:
And yet, by design, they are part of the prosecution. Nullifying a presidential election is a serious thing.
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Impeachment does not nullify an election. It removes a corrupt and/or criminal president.

The system is designed to fail if there isn't broad bipartisan support for it.
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The system was not designed with political parties in mind, and certainly not a faction so dedicated to preserving a criminal president as the current Republican party is, simply because he is (nominally) Republican.

Everybody knew going into this that the House was going to be divided on the issue.
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Everybody expected the Republicans to behave exactly as they are doing - all loyalty to the Party, none to the nation. Frankly deplorable.

While the Democrats could use their majority to push it forward, there was never any question of the Republicans quietly playing along.
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"Playing along" ... do you ever listen to yourself?

Trump ignored the national interest when using foreign aid granted by both parties to pressure a natural ally into creating fake investigations that he (and all the other Republicans) could use to smear the man likely to be running against him - not nullifying an election but corrupting it beforehand. And you seem absolutely unconcerned by that. Because he's a Republican. Even you know he's a disastrous president, but apparently party comes first with you. Or hatred of the Democratic Party comes first, perhaps.
 
quadraginta said:
The system was also designed based on the expectation that most members of Congress would have enough dignity and self-respect to put the welfare of the country and the honor of the office of the Presidency ahead of their party's political interests.

Boy did they get that wrong.
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It worked for a long time, but today's Republican Party has attained depths never before attempted. Words fail.
 
Stacyhs said:
I have to laugh every time Jordan, Nunes, et al. start with their trumped up indignation over Schiff not providing the whistleblower to testify when Dear Leader has ordered Pompeo, Giuliani, Mulvaney, etc NOT to testify. Pompous asses.
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I turn the volume off or change the channel when the Trumptrash talk. It makes my blood boil when I see how they address their betters. The only thing you can learn from Trumptrash is how to not be an American so I'm not missing anything.
 
Craig4 said:
I turn the volume off or change the channel when the Trumptrash talk. It makes my blood boil when I see how they address their betters. The only thing you can learn from Trumptrash is how to not be an American so I'm not missing anything.
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My wife has it on all effing day. I go to the other room and visit ISF or just stretch out in the recliner and go to sleep. I can't stand it, and can't avoid being pretty well up to date anyhow.
 
Stacyhs said:
Who would the GOP call except for the whistleblower? After all, according to them, Pompeo, Giuliani, Mulvaney etc would testify there was no qpq, right? Which leads one one to wonder exactly why they were ordered not to testify.

They know the whistleblower can't provide any more info than s/he already has. What they REALLY want is to find out who it was.
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They've been offered the chance to ask questions of the whistleblower in writing and refused it. A shame, because I'd love to see what questions they'd ask. Something along the lines of "When did you and Schiff first meet to fabricate your so-called "whistleblower complaint", you currupt NeverTrumper?", I'd guess. Perhaps theprestige or Ziggurat have some better suggestions?
 
Craig4 said:
I turn the volume off or change the channel when the Trumptrash talk. It makes my blood boil when I see how they address their betters. The only thing you can learn from Trumptrash is how to not be an American so I'm not missing anything.
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Their diatribes cover the same points so basically, once you've heard one, you've heard them all.

It tend to boil down to 'the Big Bad Dems have been out to get poor President Trump since his landslide electoral victory and they've never accepted it. They've used every dirty trick in the book to go after him and they haven't proved President Trump wanted a qpq because none of the witnesses heard him specifically use the words "bribery" or "extortion". It's all hearsay! And the money was released so that proves he wasn't holding it up until Zelensky announced an investigation because there was no such announcement!'
 
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