House Impeachment Inquiry

[a_unique_person]

I would be shocked and disappointed if the Democrats don’t write up multiple Articles of Impeachment.

Of the 10 or so instances in Part II of the Mueller Report, I’d expect to see at least several charged. Remember, each of those gave evidence for meeting all three criteria for Obstruction of Justice. Firing Comey and then going on TV and saying it was about ”The Russia Thing”, and then telling the Russian Ambassador that now “the pressure was off” is in my mind the one where intent is easiest to prove.

Trump lying to Mueller in his written responses is another, as is asking China to investigate the Bidens. And don’t forget ordering subordinates to ignore lawful subpoenas and/or to prepare false statements.

If I had to wager, they’re just getting started and I expect to see at least a dozen Articles of Impeachment. Even if the Senate fails to convict, it is the House’s responsibility to air these out, if only for history’s sake.

Why can't they just have a standing committee investigating his review dodgy business career. Not to impeach him but just to tell people the truth about him. He must have thousands of victims willing to testify.

 

[quadraginta]

Why bother with ambassadors at all? All a country needs to do is have its leader Tweet praise of Trump and he'll do whatever they want.

But that is much harder for low level con-men in a country the President couldn't find on a map.

I expect that would be a pretty long list of countries. All encompassing, even.

I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if Trump would be hard pressed to locate Florida or New York on a map, much less another country.

It isn't like he has to get himself there. He has people for that.

 

[acbytesla]

Actually, he has. Pelosi invited him to speak before the committee OR to do it in writing:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/house-...portunity-to-present-his-case-in-impeachment/

My mistake. He'll never do it.

 

[quadraginta]

Which is funny because we spend 50% of the time discussing Trump, who wouldn't last a day on this forum himself.

If Trump joined the forum, the whole politics section would crash. 90% of the posters here wouldn't be able to avoid violating the membership agreement.

I think TM has the right of it. Most of our members can manage to navigate the forum MA pretty well. Even with people they vehemently disagree with. They've had plenty of practice.

Trump, on the other hand, could never be made to understand that the same rules actually applied to him. Not to mention a total inability to concede fault of any sort, or respond to criticism in a reasoned manner.

Yeah, he'd be suspended in a matter of days, if not hours. And keep repeating until he was gone for good.

He just doesn't have the temperament to manage in an environment like this one, and I say that without any regard for my personal opinion of the man. These character attributes of his are well recorded.

 

[Minoosh]

If I had to wager, they’re just getting started and I expect to see at least a dozen Articles of Impeachment. Even if the Senate fails to convict, it is the House’s responsibility to air these out, if only for history’s sake.

I don't think anyone knows the best strategy here. Laser-focus on one thing, or hit him with a long list. I'm not sure how it looks to bring up all the other stuff when previously House Dems did not act on any of it. What they do have in hand are Ukraine and obstruction as spelled out in the Mueller report.

 

[smartcooky]

Breaking: WSJ have leaked White House emails showng Ukraine plot was premeditated

http://www.msnbc.com/the-beat-with-...-emails-show-alleged-bribery-plot-73662021640

Sorry folks, its a video. I haven't been able to find this in print media so far (perhaps others will have more luck)

Sounds hugely damning. These emails are by the people involved (Sondland, Mulvaney et al) so that shoots the Republicans' hearsay defence down in flames - and we haven't even heard from Vindman and the other first hand listeners on the July 25th call.

 

[BrooklynBaby]

Everyone who reads fake news thinks Trump will be leaving office. I don't pay any attention to fake news, you know, being a fan of real news and all. Real news tells me this is just another left-wing conspiracy/hoax -- a nothingburger with extra cheese. It has the same roots as the Russia Hoax. Hope this helps.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

http://www.msnbc.com/the-beat-with-...-emails-show-alleged-bribery-plot-73662021640

Sorry folks, its a video. I haven't been able to find this in print media so far (perhaps others will have more luck)

Sounds hugely damning. These emails are by the people involved (Sondland, Mulvaney et al) so that shoots the Republicans' hearsay defence down in flames - and we haven't even heard from Vindman and the other first hand listeners on the July 25th call.

prob this:
https://www.wsj.com/articles/lawmak...achment-hearings-11574007673?mod=hp_lead_pos3

Sondland Kept Trump Administration Officials Apprised of Ukraine Push
Ambassador is set to testify Wednesday in second week of public impeachment hearings

 

[smartcooky]

Everyone who reads fake news thinks Trump will be leaving office. I don't pay any attention to fake news, you know, being a fan of real news and all. Real news tells me this is just another left-wing conspiracy/hoax -- a nothingburger with extra cheese. It has the same roots as the Russia Hoax. Hope this helps.

Yeah, helps a lot, but not in the way you might be thinking!

 

[smartcooky]

prob this:
https://www.wsj.com/articles/lawmak...achment-hearings-11574007673?mod=hp_lead_pos3

Sondland Kept Trump Administration Officials Apprised of Ukraine Push
Ambassador is set to testify Wednesday in second week of public impeachment hearings

I reckon Sondland will either take the 5th, or sing like a canary!

 

[Fast Eddie B]

I don't think anyone knows the best strategy here. Laser-focus on one thing, or hit him with a long list.

True, but I think the former sets up the defense: “That’s all you’ve got? At best the president made a single mistake, but not an impeachable one.”

While the latter, a laundry list of illegal or Abuse of Power scenarios, will establish a pattern of behavior, each example reinforcing the image of a rogue executive and making each accompanying count more believable.

Take the case of Nixon: only 3 Articles of Impeachment, but multiple examples of impeachable behavior in each.

https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Articles_of_Impeachment_of_Richard_Nixon

Something like that would be my recommendation.

 

[portlandatheist]

I reckon Sondland will either take the 5th, or sing like a canary!

I think he's going to sing

 

[quadraginta]

If Trump joined the forum he would be banned on the first day for multiple infractions. It's amazing he hasn't been banned from Twitter yet.

He would have been if not for the office he holds.

 

[Ziggurat]

I think TM has the right of it. Most of our members can manage to navigate the forum MA pretty well. Even with people they vehemently disagree with. They've had plenty of practice.

Trump, on the other hand, could never be made to understand that the same rules actually applied to him. Not to mention a total inability to concede fault of any sort, or respond to criticism in a reasoned manner.

Yeah, he'd be suspended in a matter of days, if not hours. And keep repeating until he was gone for good.

He just doesn't have the temperament to manage in an environment like this one, and I say that without any regard for my personal opinion of the man. These character attributes of his are well recorded.

It amuses me to consider a scenario where Trump joins but never posts. That would still preclude any members from insulting him without violating the MA. I think lots of people would have a very difficult time with that.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Might it just be that the offenses outlined in Mueller, or the blatant violations committed in plain view, don’t require any further “investigation”?

They don't but I suspect Pelosi is writing that off, accepting defeat by Barr and the court of public opinion.

But I admit to not knowing what happened to the subpoena to see the Grand Jury testimony. I do hope something is happening with that, and with the unredacted parts of the Mueller Report. I have no doubt Trump's crimes are hidden in there.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Trump claims to be strongly considering providing more articles of impeachment against himself (in the form of written testimony in which he will almost certainly lie).

Of course he won't sit down like an honorable person and take questions. Then there would be no 'almost' to the lying.

That's nothing but Trump's fantasy that he could make this all go away with his charm and talent.

He will never do it because it's only his fantasy.

 

[PhantomWolf]

Everyone who reads fake news thinks Trump will be leaving office. I don't pay any attention to fake news, you know, being a fan of real news and all. Real news tells me this is just another left-wing conspiracy/hoax -- a nothingburger with extra cheese. It has the same roots as the Russia Hoax. Hope this helps.

Do you believe that it is acceptable for any President, past or future, Democrat or Republican, to ask a foreign nation to create political dirt on his/her political opponent in return for financial aid ordered by Congress, being released to them?

 

[Frank Newgent]

It amuses me to consider a scenario where Trump joins but never posts.

Let me guess why. Because internet access in prison is restricted?

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

I reckon Sondland will either take the 5th, or sing like a canary!

A bit late to shut up I would think.

 

[alfaniner]

If Trump joined the forum he would be banned on the first day for multiple infractions. It's amazing he hasn't been banned from Twitter yet.

I for one am glad he is not. I am exponentially more informed about what's really going on because of his Tweets (and many of the responses to them.) (Captain Swoop's work here acknowledged, but I check the actual Twitter from time to time.)