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Mueller Investigation pt 7

acbytesla said:
I can't imagine it either.

The interesting question though is who would President Pence want as his VP and who would want the job? I would imagine if Trump was impeached and removed that there might be a free for all for the GOP nomination.
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It would be very hard to get a consensus on a replacement Veep. The Senate would want Cruz, while the House would insist on being rid of Nunez.
 
phiwum said:
It would be very hard to get a consensus on a replacement Veep. The Senate would want Cruz, while the House would insist on being rid of Nunez.
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They could compromise and give it to Moscow Mitch...
 
PhantomWolf said:
They could compromise and give it to Moscow Mitch...
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Ah, but the Senate is run by Republicans and they like Mitch. He's quite effective for his party.

Everyone, regardless of party, hates Cruz, so he's the natural choice for the Senate.
 
CORed said:
A minor detail: A new VP has to be confirmed by both House and Senate (unlike executive appointments and judges, which are confirmed by Senate only). Getting the appointment through both Democratic controlled house and Republican controlled Senate might be difficult, which would leave Pelosi as Speaker of the House as next in line. However, you are correct that, with impeachment and removal, Pence would be President, and very likely Republican nominee for 2020, in the unlikely event that the impeachment inquiry reveals that Trump is drinking the blood of babies, or whatever it is that would convince Republican senators to vote for his removal.
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If it was brown babies our GOP Senators wouldn't blink a single eyelash.
 
PhantomWolf said:
CORed said:
Getting the appointment through both Democratic controlled house and Republican controlled Senate might be difficult, which would leave Pelosi as Speaker of the House as next in line.
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I actually disagree here. I don't see the Democrats playing political games if the nominated person is a reasonable choice.
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Probably not, but the simple act of acceptance by House Democrats would probably be enough to make whoever it was anathema to the Senate GOP.

And before you say it, yes, even if it was their selection to begin with. Consistency has not been a particularly noteworthy aspect of Republican behavior for the past few decades.
 
acbytesla said:
I still don't understand your point. Do you know why they requested a FISA warrant and why the judge granted it? You're desperately trying to construct some nefarious dark world conspiracy despite the absence of any evidence. The hypocrisy of the Republican party has reached massive proportions
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They requested the FISA warrant so they could spy on members of the Trump campaign. The FBI signed off on the application affirming that the information in the warrant had been verified. It wasn't. The FISA warrant was based off the allegations from the Steele dossier. The FBI signatory asserted:

"I declare under penalty of perjury that the foregoing information regarding Carter W. Page is true and correct.”

The FBI committed fraud in obtaining this warrant and should be held accountable. But police-state liberals don't care about any of this.

Belz... said:
Have you? Most of the dossier, except for a glaring exception, has been either demonstrated to be true or is now highly probable.
No, that doesn't follow at all.
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This statement is completely false. What in the dossier has been demonstrated to be true or is highly probable?

The Hill reports on 07/16/19:

"But lest anyone be tempted to think Steele’s 2016 dossier is about to be mysteriously revived as credible, consider this: Over months of work, FBI agents painstakingly researched every claim Steele made about Trump’s possible collusion with Russia, and assembled their findings into a spreadsheet-like document.

Multiple sources familiar with the FBI spreadsheet tell me the vast majority of Steele’s claims were deemed to be wrong, or could not be corroborated even with the most awesome tools available to the U.S. intelligence community. One source estimated the spreadsheet found upward of 90 percent of the dossier’s claims to be either wrong, nonverifiable or open-source intelligence found with a Google search. In other words, it was mostly useless."

But fill me in on your findings?

smartcooky said:
When an asset is "cultivated" and supported, that doesn't necessary mean that the asset is "conspiring". What is being implied in the Steele Dossier is the relationship between a puppet and its puppetmaster. Trump is the puppet, and Putin is the one pulling the strings...Same mistake. You are assuming that because "A" is helping "B", that "B" is therefore conspiring with "A". Your assumptions don't necessarily follow..
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You obviously haven't read the dossier. The Steele dossier states specifically that there was a two-way flow of intelligence between Trump and Putin,

"Speaking in confidence to a compatriot in late July 2016, Source E, an ethnic Russian close associate of Republican US presidential candidate Donald TRUMP, admitted that there was a well-developed conspiracy of co-operation between them and the Russian leadership. This was managed on the TRUMP side by the Republican candidate's campaign manager, Paul MANAFORT, who was using foreign policy advisor, Carter PAGE, and others as intermediaries..."

Also the dossier never gives the impression that Trump is Putin's puppet, but that they share mutual interests. "Putin's puppet" is just Leftoid propaganda.

smartcooky said:
Perhaps you can explain why Trump....

1. Keeps going out of his way to help Russia & Putin.

2. Won't allow any any American government officials to be present (other than a translator) when talking with Putin.

3. Confiscates the translator's notes after talking with Putin.

4. Is so desperate to exonerate Russia for interference in the 2016 election; interference that the REPUBLICAN led Senate Intelligence Committee has 100% confirmed.

5. Blocked efforts of the US Government to condemn Russia for seizing Ukrainian shipping in the Kerch Strait.

6. Undermined US relationships with European allies (to the benefit of Putin).

7. Dismisses the evidence and the findings of his own intelligence officials, preferring to believe the Kremlin instead.

8. Calls the US’s commitment to NATO into question (to the benefit of Putin).

9. Fails to respond to Russian human rights violations thereby creating an easier political environment for Putin to crack down his opponents.

10. Attacks the European Union and publicly supports anti-EU, Kremlin-backed parties.

11. Repeatedly praises and defends Putin, thus affording him the credibility of his standing to the US presidency.

12. repeatedly parrots Putin/Russian/Kremlin talking points across a whole range of international issues.

13, Tries to block, lift, roll back, impede, and lessen the impact of Russia sanctions every chance he gets.

14. Attacks specific NATO members that are particularly vulnerable to Russian aggression.

15. Refused to recommit to NATO’s Article 5 at the opening of their new headquarters. (Article 5 is the bit that states that an attack on one NATO member is an attack on all).

16. Openly supported the Brexit campaign - something Putin desperately wants as well.

When you've done trying to explain/handwave these away, I've got plenty more examples to post.
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Note: The majority of Brits voted for Brexit. The EU is a totalitarian monstrosity. NATO should be abolished as the Cold War has been over for decades.

All of these are policy differences. Ever since Trump began his campaign, the Deep State and the Leftist establishment have attempted to criminalize policy differences. Trump might have a different perspective on world affairs than the CFR and the Atlantic Council. This is good. But the Deep State manufactured a false narrative that Trump was somehow Putin's puppet.

It is interesting to note that Obama's and Hillary Clinton's overtures to Russia were never called into question in the same way. Secretary Clinton wrote a column for the WSJ in 2012 entitled: Trade With Russia Is a Win-Win .

"..Russia will join the World Trade Organization (WTO) in the culmination of a process that began nearly two decades ago. This is good news for American companies and workers...But there is one obstacle standing in the way. American businesses won't be able to take advantage of this new market opening unless Congress terminates the application of the Jackson-Vanik Amendment and extends "permanent normal trading relations" (PNTR) to Russia....Now it's time to set it aside...But it is in our long-term strategic interest to collaborate with Russia in areas where our interests overlap..."

Uh oh, collaborate, that almost sounds like collude. It is a good thing Trump didn't write this. It may have been used to impeach him. But there was also Uranium One, and Bill Clinton receiving $500,000 from a Russian bank for giving a "speech". Remember Obama chastising Romney for saying that Russia is a threat in the 2012 debate?

Obama: "Governor Romney, I'm glad that you recognize that Al Qaida is a threat, because a few months ago when you were asked what's the biggest geopolitical threat facing America, you said Russia, not Al Qaida; you said Russia, in the 1980s, they're now calling to ask for their foreign policy back because, you know, the Cold War's been over for 20 years. But Governor, when it comes to our foreign policy, you seem to want to import the foreign policies of the 1980s, just like the social policies of the 1950s and the economic policies of the 1920s."

This is why in Obama's 2nd term the FBI and Justice Department investigated the Obama administration for being under the thumb of Putin and conspiring with a hostile foreign power.

Oh wait, that didn't happen. Hostility to Russia was just manufactured during Trump's 2016 campaign as a pre-text spy on and then launch a coup to overthrow his Presidency under the guise of a "Russian counter-intelligence probe."
 
tanabear said:
They requested the FISA warrant so they could spy on members of the Trump campaign. The FBI signed off on the application affirming that the information in the warrant had been verified." ...........
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****** nonsense.

Yeah sure. Obama was under Putin's thumb? :rolleyes: Where is Trump? Up his ass?

There are so many factually wrong things in your post it is absurd.
Mostly it's right wing conspiracy theory crap that has nothing to do with reality.

To start with, we live in the same world with Russia and until there is reason to treat Russia as an adversary, there really is no reason to do it. I supported for a while attempting to work with Russia. That is before they invaded Crimea and Putin jailed his main political opponent and jailing homosexuals. And frankly, there was NOTHING wrong with selling them uranium to be used in a Nuclear reactor.
 
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acbytesla said:
And frankly, there was NOTHING wrong with selling them uranium to be used in a Nuclear reactor.
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Uranium One didn't even rise to that level. Russian uranium company bought a Canadian uranium company. End of Story. At last check, no "American" uranium was diverted to Russia and the allegations flung about were extremely far-fetched, to be excessively kind. Actual witch hunt territory, one could say.

As for the rest of Tanabear's post, when Tanabear keeps claiming such utterly moronic nonsense wholesale and refuses to change his tune in the face of actual fact, I've lost interest in engaging.
 
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Aridas said:
Uranium One didn't even rise to that level. Russian uranium company bought a Canadian uranium company. End of Story. At last check, no "American" uranium was diverted to Russia and the allegations flung about were extremely far-fetched, to be excessively kind. Actual witch hunt territory, one could say.

<snip>
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Another salient tidbit, which Trumpista conspiracy advocates find inconvenient and don't go out of their way to mention is that the U.S. is a net importer of Russian uranium. Not the other way around.

We need theirs more than they need ours.

Makes the whole goofy, ginned-up fantasy even goofier, but what can you expect from Trump supporters.
 
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smartcooky said:
Perhaps you can explain why Trump....

1. Keeps going out of his way to help Russia & Putin.

2. Won't allow any any American government officials to be present (other than a translator) when talking with Putin.

3. Confiscates the translator's notes after talking with Putin.

4. Is so desperate to exonerate Russia for interference in the 2016 election; interference that the REPUBLICAN led Senate Intelligence Committee has 100% confirmed.

5. Blocked efforts of the US Government to condemn Russia for seizing Ukrainian shipping in the Kerch Strait.

6. Undermined US relationships with European allies (to the benefit of Putin).

7. Dismisses the evidence and the findings of his own intelligence officials, preferring to believe the Kremlin instead.

8. Calls the US’s commitment to NATO into question (to the benefit of Putin).

9. Fails to respond to Russian human rights violations thereby creating an easier political environment for Putin to crack down his opponents.

10. Attacks the European Union and publicly supports anti-EU, Kremlin-backed parties.

11. Repeatedly praises and defends Putin, thus affording him the credibility of his standing to the US presidency.

12. repeatedly parrots Putin/Russian/Kremlin talking points across a whole range of international issues.

13, Tries to block, lift, roll back, impede, and lessen the impact of Russia sanctions every chance he gets.

14. Attacks specific NATO members that are particularly vulnerable to Russian aggression.

15. Refused to recommit to NATO’s Article 5 at the opening of their new headquarters. (Article 5 is the bit that states that an attack on one NATO member is an attack on all).

16. Openly supported the Brexit campaign - something Putin desperately wants as well.

When you've done trying to explain/handwave these away, I've got plenty more examples to post.
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17. Disclosed classified information to Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov and Russian Ambassador Sergey Kislyak in the Oval Office.

17a. While simultaneously boasting about just firing FBI Director James Comey: “I faced great pressure because of Russia. That’s taken off.”

18. Ardently advocated for Russia to be readmitted to the G7.
 
Regnad Kcin said:
17. Disclosed classified information to Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov and Russian Ambassador Sergey Kislyak in the Oval Office.

17a. While simultaneously boasting about just firing FBI Director James Comey: “I faced great pressure because of Russia. That’s taken off.”

18. Ardently advocated for Russia to be readmitted to the G7.
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19. Breaking the Iran deal effectively shoved Iran further into Russia's influence, while simultaneously driving the price of oil up. Oil is one of Russia's main sources of income, so Russia ended up profiting very significantly from that.

20. Trump got involved with North Korea not too long after Putin requested that the exercises with South Korea stop. Trump stopped the exercises with South Korea in return for... nothing.

21. Trump's Trade War with China has ended up with a heck of a lot of Chinese turning to Russian suppliers. That's benefiting Russia at direct cost to the US.

22. Syria. Kurds. Does anything more need said on that?
 
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The most ludicrous aspect of the conspiracy theory being foisted here is that the Dems and/or Deep State, take your pick, went to truly extraordinary, illegal efforts to damage Trump, yet they didn't bother to release an October surprise. Instead, they held it close to the vest in order to launch a witch hunt against Trump after he became POTUS.

This is a scheme that makes the underpants gnomes look like geniuses.
 
So what is Mueller up to these days? Anyone know/think/guess if he's going to wind up back in the "process" in some way as the impeachment rolls on?
 
JoeMorgue said:
So what is Mueller up to these days? Anyone know/think/guess if he's going to wind up back in the "process" in some way as the impeachment rolls on?
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He might be one of the few people in Washington DC who leaves to spend more time with his family who is actually spending more time with his family.
 
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