The Trials of Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito: Part 29

[Stacyhs]

Vixen I think you will never make any progress on understanding this case if you don't even understand the PIP position. We don't believe Amanda Knox is innocent because we want to, but because we can't make guilt work. If we start with the assumption that she is a psycho killer who definitely killed Meredith - this doesn't explain anything. It doesn't change the fact that the evidence doesn't fit and the crime scenario is logistically unworkable.

Once you accept that as our actual view (which it is) you are free to believe that we hold that view because we are delusional. But that's an important step to reach. You need to come to the realization that by definition one side (PIP or PGP) must be severely delusional. Then it becomes a question of determining which side. If you can't trust yourself (since it might be you) you can use basic outside clues. For example, which side is more likely to be the delusional one, the one with all court outcomes and esteemed professionals on their side, or the side that believes a mafia conspiracy occurred at the national court level to free two nobodies...You may discover some unsettling truths

Well said, bagels.

 

[Bill Williams]

Vixen I think you will never make any progress on understanding this case if you don't even understand the PIP position. We don't believe Amanda Knox is innocent because we want to, but because we can't make guilt work. If we start with the assumption that she is a psycho killer who definitely killed Meredith - this doesn't explain anything. It doesn't change the fact that the evidence doesn't fit and the crime scenario is logistically unworkable.

Stacyhs seconds bagels's post, and I third it.

Why? Because it is bagels's way of illustrating why the final, definitive acquitting Court in 2015 did what it did.

Remember, that court had used "even if" language at the conclusion of its report. Leading up to that, the court had summarized the evidence presented at the Nencini, convicting-trial. Without redo'ing any of that evidence, the final Supreme Court panel said, even if true none of it had made up for there being no forensics of either RS or AK in the murder room. Therefore Nencini had erred in convicting.

Similarly with bagels. Knox could have been a raging psychopath and all of us innocence supporters could be hopelessly deranged fans. Knox as psycho killer or us as hopelessly compromised fanboys/girls still does not explain why the guilter-nutters have **never** been able to put together a guilt-timeline which explains things.

Bagels has a way with words!

 

[whoanellie]

WRONG ANSWER. I don't feel Knox is innocent because she comes from Seattle. You know who else comes from Seattle? Gary Ridgeway and Ted Bundy. I could care less where Amanda is from.

It's the rain.

 

[TomG]

Has anyone watched this? Sorry if I missed the boat and I'm the last to watch it, but here's the link anyway if you want to discuss.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fjWlB75XQo&t=822s

In the past I've said that I've no interest in the personal lives of K&S but this shows Amanda as a very erudite person. Her ability to connect with people on an personal and emotional level is very accomplished, anyone who has a dark secret to hide wouldn't develop these social skills. This discussion is a more convincing indicator of her innocence than anything we've been arguing about as far as I'm concerned. I defy Vixen to suggest that this is the mindset of a killer.

BTW what's happened to the IA wiki and forum? It needs a password and username to gain access but it doesn't respond to any username or password I've ever used. Anyone having the same problem?

Hoots

 

[TruthCalls]

Has anyone watched this? Sorry if I missed the boat and I'm the last to watch it, but here's the link anyway if you want to discuss.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fjWlB75XQo&t=822s

In the past I've said that I've no interest in the personal lives of K&S but this shows Amanda as a very erudite person. Her ability to connect with people on an personal and emotional level is very accomplished, anyone who has a dark secret to hide wouldn't develop these social skills. This discussion is a more convincing indicator of her innocence than anything we've been arguing about as far as I'm concerned. I defy Vixen to suggest that this is the mindset of a killer.

BTW what's happened to the IA wiki and forum? It needs a password and username to gain access but it doesn't respond to any username or password I've ever used. Anyone having the same problem?

Hoots

Yeah, I've watched this... long, but very good. Have you looked in on TJMK? As expected, they villainize Theo and find various dark 'insights' into Amanda. To say their obsession and delusion is troubling doesn't quite capture it.

 

[Bill Williams]

.BTW what's happened to the IA wiki and forum? It needs a password and username to gain access but it doesn't respond to any username or password I've ever used. Anyone having the same problem?

Hoots

AFAIK it got hacked. Individual files got corrupted. I know a bit about these things, but not a lot..... but it may not be back. JREF/ISF and TJMK may be the last arenas for a viral internet war about a crime in Italy in 2009.

Except TJMK is not an arena. It's a propaganda machine.

 

[TomG]

Yeah, I've watched this... long, but very good. Have you looked in on TJMK? As expected, they villainize Theo and find various dark 'insights' into Amanda. To say their obsession and delusion is troubling doesn't quite capture it.

Long but compelling throughout. I use safe settings provided by my ISP that automatically block sites that contain racial or religious hatred, extreme politics and porn, it also blocks access to TJMK funnily enough. I'm not going to change my settings so I'll have to take your word for it. I thought the host was a bit mischievous when he asked Amanda who she blamed for her wrongful imprisonment. She countered this by not blaming anyone. I got the impression that her incarceration had crystallized into a positive experience in shaping who she is today. I remember seeing the same profound experience being told my Ruben (Hurricane) Carter on a brief YouTube interview when he was able to transform his bitterness and hatred into understanding and forgiveness for those who had knowingly framed him.

Hoots

 

[TomG]

AFAIK it got hacked. Individual files got corrupted. I know a bit about these things, but not a lot..... but it may not be back. JREF/ISF and TJMK may be the last arenas for a viral internet war about a crime in Italy in 2009.

Except TJMK is not an arena. It's a propaganda machine.

It would be a pity to lose the wiki. It contained a lot of fantastic information and represented a lot of hard work. I hope it gets salvaged.

Hoots

 

[Stacyhs]

Yeah, I've watched this... long, but very good. Have you looked in on TJMK? As expected, they villainize Theo and find various dark 'insights' into Amanda. To say their obsession and delusion is troubling doesn't quite capture it.

I watched it about a week ago.
Did you notice the TJMK line under the picture of Theo Von?

Theo Von enabled dangerous Italy-trasher Amanda Knox

I had to laugh at that one. "Dangerous Italy-trasher"? Then they instruct future interviewers to "educate", "demand the truth", and to "do your homework". I hope everyone's irony meters were upgraded.

In the next load of crapola, they again linked to their "Sollecito crime family" nonsense. NO connection has ever been found between Dr. Francesco Sollecito or Raffaele with that crime family. I remember Vixen posting a picture of Dr. Sollecito at Rocco's memorial service...only it didn't. The picture of Dr. Sollecito was taken in another city years before Rocco died and had no connection whatsoever to the gangster. The also discussed Raffaele's trip to the Dominican Republic. Remember when Vixen tried to pass off a picture of Raff lying on the beach as hanging around with mobsters? Oh, man....what a laugh. At least we know where Vixen gets "educated".
Honestly, these sad sacks have serious problems.

 

[Vixen]

Has anyone watched this? Sorry if I missed the boat and I'm the last to watch it, but here's the link anyway if you want to discuss.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fjWlB75XQo&t=822s

In the past I've said that I've no interest in the personal lives of K&S but this shows Amanda as a very erudite person. Her ability to connect with people on an personal and emotional level is very accomplished, anyone who has a dark secret to hide wouldn't develop these social skills. This discussion is a more convincing indicator of her innocence than anything we've been arguing about as far as I'm concerned. I defy Vixen to suggest that this is the mindset of a killer.

BTW what's happened to the IA wiki and forum? It needs a password and username to gain access but it doesn't respond to any username or password I've ever used. Anyone having the same problem?

Hoots

I haven't got the patience to sit through lies.

 

[Stacyhs]

I haven't got the patience to sit through lies.

Now you know how we feel.

 

[TomG]

I haven't got the patience to sit through lies.

Then how can you write your own posts?

Hoots

 

[Bill Williams]

I haven't got the patience to sit through lies.

You show remarkable patience with TJMK's lies. You've also hung in there with both the fake wiki, as well as the early tabloid excess.

IMNSHO, you misplace your patience.

 

[Vixen]

Then how can you write your own posts?

Hoots

My posts are based on what is reflected in court documents. Facts that have been found by proper means via a level-playing field merits court. Tried, examined and tested in a court of law.

PR bores me stiff. You can keep lying about Mignini, Stefanoni and the police and lap up Knox' lies as per her films, books and interviews but I am afraid what she has to say bores me to tears.

She should emulate Raff and just do one. And as advised by Hellmann.

 

[LondonJohn]

My posts are based on what is reflected in court documents. Facts that have been found by proper means via a level-playing field merits court. Tried, examined and tested in a court of law.

PR bores me stiff. You can keep lying about Mignini, Stefanoni and the police and lap up Knox' lies as per her films, books and interviews but I am afraid what she has to say bores me to tears.

She should emulate Raff and just do one. And as advised by Hellmann.

Ah Vixen! There you are!

Evidence please of "David Marriott" being a source of the idea that Knox's family engaged in a "$2 million PR campaign". As you stated.

Chop chop now!

(I mean obviously you can readily provide this evidence can't you. Since you stated that it exists. And since you stated how accurate your assertions are, and how you only ever rely on impeccable facts and sources. Remember that, Vixen?)

I'm waiting........

 

[LondonJohn]

PS: Vixen: when you talk about "level playing fields court", is it STILL going over your head that the Italian Supreme Court found - correctly - that the Massei and Nencini courts were not level playing fields?

I really do recommend that you read the Marasca SC motivations report, very slowly, repeatedly, and for comprehension. There's still a chance (albeit tiny, judging by precedent) that the truth may dawn.

And I further recommend a for-comprehension reading of the ECHR judgement. It will show you exactly how Knox's fundamental rights were railroaded by the Italian law enforcement community and the lower courts.

"Level playing field". AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

 

[Stacyhs]

My posts are based on what is reflected in court documents. Facts that have been found by proper means via a level-playing field merits court. Tried, examined and tested in a court of law.

PR bores me stiff. You can keep lying about Mignini, Stefanoni and the police and lap up Knox' lies as per her films, books and interviews but I am afraid what she has to say bores me to tears.

She should emulate Raff and just do one. And as advised by Hellmann.

LOL! You rely almost exclusively on the Massei trial documents and Massei's interpretation and verdict...which were overturned. A verdict which the Supreme Court said never should have been rendered in the first place based on the evidence presented.

Most of your posts, however, are based on making ridiculous claims that you do not, and cannot, substantiate with evidence. The latest? David Marriott is the source for the $2 million PR campaign. When asked to provide evidence of that, all we hear are crickets.
More false claims:

RS owned a Napapijri jacket
RS owned white cap with red band
RS is left-handed
Amanda flew home on a private chartered jet
Negative TMB test don't eliminate the presence of blood
no grate below FR's window
the theft charges against AK were dropped
RS was hanging around with mobsters
RS's family is part of the Rocco Sollecito mafia family
the defense experts were all 'bent'
Hellmann was forced to retire
Amanda has sex on a train
Amanda was a coke head

There are many, many more.

 

[TomG]

My posts are based on what is reflected in court documents. Facts that have been found by proper means via a level-playing field merits court. Tried, examined and tested in a court of law.

None of which results in a sustainable crime scene narrative involving K&S in the murder of Meredith Kercher.

PR bores me stiff. You can keep lying about Mignini, Stefanoni and the police and lap up Knox' lies as per her films, books and interviews but I am afraid what she has to say bores me to tears.

You could take up knitting?

Hoots

 

[abaddon]

I haven't got the patience to sit through lies.

You should stop posting them then.

Remember this that you posted?

I am rarely wrong as my assertions are based on well-founded facts or sources.

Yes/No?

Remember how you insisted that cell phone masts acted like tail gunners?

Were you wrong then?

And I could give many more examples.

Did you admit you were wrong then?

Well, let us ask the question.

Do you, Vixen, still think that cell phone antennae swivel around the place to intercept your cell phone signal? Yes or no?

Are you really "rarely wrong" or is that a mischaracterisation of "mostly wrong"?

 

[TruthCalls]

You should stop posting them then.

Remember this that you posted?



Yes/No?

Remember how you insisted that cell phone masts acted like tail gunners?

Were you wrong then?

And I could give many more examples.

Did you admit you were wrong then?

Well, let us ask the question.

Do you, Vixen, still think that cell phone antennae swivel around the place to intercept your cell phone signal? Yes or no?

Are you really "rarely wrong" or is that a mischaracterisation of "mostly wrong"?

Vixen recently wrote that Meredith took kick-boxing lessons, though I'm sure that was a typo, seeing as karate and kick-boxing both start with a "k" and all...