The Trials of Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito: Part 29

[Vixen]

I'm still waiting for Vixen to admit she was wrong

I am rarely wrong as my assertions are based on well-founded facts or sources.

 

[Vixen]

IIRC, Filomena was rushing to get out of the house, so much so that she asked Amanda to wrap a gift for her while she got dressed to go. While she may have normally been very fastidious, in such a situation it's unlikely she tidied up before rushing out of the house.

Agreed, little to no probative evidential value, but it was priceless to the "staged break-in" narrative the prosecution conjured up. Right up there with the 'nail that wasn't bent', the 'no scuff marks' and the 'ground under the window that wasn't trampled'. When told by a great story teller such as Mignini, these 'elements of evidence' are very compelling.

What nonsense. There was zero sign of a burglary attempt. Just a feeble scattering of Filomena's clothes here and there. Not to mention bits of paper, some of which were on top of the duvet in the murder room (bearing in mind Rudy had long departed and certainly had no motive to tidy up) one of which bore Knox' clear shoe print in Filomena's room.

 

[TomG]

Ah yes, sorry - I meant that the evidence of the window glass in respect of it's (alleged) position on or within Romanelli's clothes/belongings on the floor is of little or no probative value. But yes, as you say, there are certainly other things from that scene that can have value (notwithstanding the horrendous botching of crime scene management by Stefanoni and her "crack" team of clowns).

I had this argument with Harry Rag on YouTube only a few weeks ago. If there was glass on top of clothing it could easily be explained by an authentic break-in as follows:

a) Rudy pitches a rock through the window and climbs in. Glass is now on the floor.
b) Rudy then starts rummaging through clothing and throws them to the floor on top of the glass to walk on as he did at the Palazzoli/Brocchi office.
c) Rudy moves objects that the glass had originally landed on.
d) The glass falls from these objects onto the clothing Rudy had strewn over the floor.

You now have glass on top and below the clothing as confirmed in M/B, problem solved.

Hoots

 

[acbytesla]

Maybe that's where your faulty reasoning lies. You imagine, 'I wouldn't have committed such a terrible crime' and extrapolate from that that Knox is just like you as she is from Seattle and you are from nearby Iowa.

Look, read her early essays posted on MySpace. She writes in graphic detail about murdering 'chicks' and their getting it in the neck.

Koko saw her lying in wait by the bins.

She was after Mez - thought the better-looking, cleverer, taller, with handsome ski-ing boyfriend whom she herself had fancied - with a vengeance consumed with her angry belief Mez had 'stolen her job', never mind her 'boyfriend'(all in her mind), not to mention avoiding Knox like the plague over Halloween and not inviting Ms Billy-No-Mates to join her group for partying, Mez being highly popular and Knox not at all.

You just don't stop do you? You do get that graphic horror stories are written by ordinary people. That to the best of my knowledge Stephen King, Ann Rule, Edgar Allen Poe or Thomas Harris never killed anyone. Also, Seattle is nowhere near or anything like Iowa.

And, while Mez was pretty, you really have to stretch that Amanda was crazy jealous over her new roommate of only a month. Walk around any college campus, you're going to see a lot of pretty girls. And the UW is not an exception. And Amanda was pretty in her own right. And the so called boyfriend downstairs was more a ship passing in the night than anything to get jealous about.

But you're going to think what you want. I see you're not persuading anyone.

 

[acbytesla]

What nonsense. There was zero sign of a burglary attempt. Just a feeble scattering of Filomena's clothes here and there. Not to mention bits of paper, some of which were on top of the duvet in the murder room (bearing in mind Rudy had long departed and certainly had no motive to tidy up) one of which bore Knox' clear shoe print in Filomena's room.

Except the money missing. And who wants to be caught with articles that can be traced to a murder?

 

[Stacyhs]

Look, read her early essays posted on MySpace. She writes in graphic detail about murdering 'chicks' and their getting it in the neck.

LOL! I suggest you read them. None of her stories had any "chick" getting it "in the neck" much less being murdered. I'd ask you to provide quotes from either story which show it's about " murdering 'chicks' and their getting it in the neck", but we both know you can't because it doesn't exist.

Koko saw her lying in wait by the bins.

No judge, not even Massei, believed Kokomani's ridiculous story. But you do. Fascinating.

The inconsistencies in Kokomani’s statements are even more obvious. It is enough to think of the black bag which then revealed itself to be two people and of the throwing of olives and of a mobile phone which had allegedly been used to make a video which was subsequently shown to others and, furthermore, the time he had seemingly seen Amanda, a time predating her arrival in Italy and the mention of an uncle of Amanda’s of whose existence no one was able to supply confirmation.

(Massei MR)

She was after Mez - thought the better-looking, cleverer, taller, with handsome ski-ing boyfriend whom she herself had fancied - with a vengeance consumed with her angry belief Mez had 'stolen her job', never mind her 'boyfriend'(all in her mind), not to mention avoiding Knox like the plague over Halloween and not inviting Ms Billy-No-Mates to join her group for partying, Mez being highly popular and Knox not at all.

Bwaaahaaahaaaa! That pile o' crap doesn't even deserve a rebuttal even though each point could be (and has been) shown false. That you actually wrote it, and believe it, says it all. Some people just cannot get past the 2009 tabloids.

 

[Bill Williams]

Wow. Vixen's insults toward the original victim of this crime is disgusting and disturbing.

Not only does Vixen continue using the victim's familiar nickname, Vixen regards the victim as a "Mean Girl" snob, who'd rubbed Knox's nose in the latter's mythic unpopularity with the other British girls.

There is NO evidence that Meredith had been anyone remotely confused with a Mean Girl snob.

Vixen should retire from commenting on the 'net about this 12 year old case, which had ended in acquittals 4 1/2 years ago.

 

[acbytesla]

Bwaaahaaahaaaa! That pile o' crap doesn't even deserve a rebuttal even though each point could be (and has been) shown false. That you actually wrote it, and believe it, says it all. Some people just cannot get past the 2009 tabloids.

That crap cracks me up. Nothing about Amanda points to a girl obsessed with these kind of things. Amanda comes off more of a tomboy than a party girl. Most of the pictures I've seen of Amanda, she's not wearing makeup and looks more the hippie than anything. But I've seen a few pictures where she could pass for a Hollywood starlet. Downright gorgeous eyes.

I wouldn't kick Meredith out of bed for eating crackers, but Amanda was easily pretty enough to land herself all the men she might want. No way, Amanda was jealous of Meredith.

 

[Stacyhs]

What nonsense. There was zero sign of a burglary attempt. Just a feeble scattering of Filomena's clothes here and there. Not to mention bits of paper, some of which were on top of the duvet in the murder room (bearing in mind Rudy had long departed and certainly had no motive to tidy up) one of which bore Knox' Knox's clear shoe print in Filomena's room.

No sign of a burglary? Meredith's wallet was taken from her purse. A purse that had Guede's DNA on it. Would you care to explain a scenario in which Guede would have had any reason to touch Meredith's purse? Her two cell phones were taken. Or did they just magically appear in the Lana's garden?

We've discussed the alleged Knox shoe print on the paper before. You eventually gave up because you were disproved and changed the subject. Yet here you are, right back at the same false claims. It's almost as if you never learn.

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=318560&page=38

If it was 'Knox's' shoe print' then why was it never identified in court as such? Can you quote from any testimony that it was identified as Knox's? Hint: the answer is no. At least you're not still claiming the papers had blood on them. Small progress.

 

[Stacyhs]

I'm still waiting for Vixen to back up her claim of the '$2 million PR campaign'.



[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/716695d65d200ead83.png[/qimg]

David Marriott.

Sigh. And you can provide evidence that D. Marriott ever said he was paid $2 million? You know, like a quote or something?

 

[Stacyhs]

I am rarely wrong as my assertions are based on well-founded facts or sources.

Damn, Vixen! I almost spit out my coffee when I read that! I don't think I've read anything more hilarious than when Trump proclaimed he was a 'stable genius'!

 

[Vixen]

I had this argument with Harry Rag on YouTube only a few weeks ago. If there was glass on top of clothing it could easily be explained by an authentic break-in as follows:

a) Rudy pitches a rock through the window and climbs in. Glass is now on the floor.
b) Rudy then starts rummaging through clothing and throws them to the floor on top of the glass to walk on as he did at the Palazzoli/Brocchi office.
c) Rudy moves objects that the glass had originally landed on.
d) The glass falls from these objects onto the clothing Rudy had strewn over the floor.

You now have glass on top and below the clothing as confirmed in M/B, problem solved.

Hoots

There is zero forensic evidence of Guede in that room. Some key forensic DNA evidence of Knox, though - her DNA directly mixed in on the exact spot of Mez' blood. Footprint on one of the cards scattered about to make it look like a burglary.

Had Guede dangerously eased himself through the 10cm diameter of jagged glass from the wet grass outside we could be sure to have had some muddy footprints or bits of grass, not to mention fingerprints. But there are none.

The trajectory of the boulder-sized rock would not have landed where it did had Rudy 'thrown it directly from the car park'.

Looking for alternative 'explanations' to those tested, cross-examined and proven in court, shows how desperate you are.

 

[Stacyhs]

Oh I see. Anybody can just walk out of a court in Italy after four years in custody and presumably their passport confiscated and straight onto a plane to the USA via Heathrow, which happened to have an entire retinue of press on board.

It was all fixed in advance.

Even after you were proved wrong so clearly, you still can't accept that you are wrong. What next? Are you going to be telling us that Knox and Sollecito cleaned up all their own DNA and fingerprints from Kercher's bedroom?

Knox's passport was returned to her when she left Capanne prison the day of her acquittal (WTBH pg.445). She also didn't didn't get "straight onto a plane"; she and her family spent the night in Rome and flew out the next day.

which happened to have an entire retinue of press on board.

Do you ever think before you actually type something? Do you honestly think the press couldn't buy plane tickets? Or that their newspapers, already betting on an acquittal, couldn't have hedged their bets by looking at the flight schedules and figuring out what flights were going to Seattle the next day? Honestly, Vix...stop embarrassing yourself.

 

[Mr Fied]

There is zero forensic evidence of Guede in that room. Some key forensic DNA evidence of Knox, though - her DNA directly mixed in on the exact spot of Mez' blood. Footprint on one of the cards scattered about to make it look like a burglary.

Had Guede dangerously eased himself through the 10cm diameter of jagged glass from the wet grass outside we could be sure to have had some muddy footprints or bits of grass, not to mention fingerprints. But there are none.

What? He eased himself through a 10cm diameter hole? Or do you think he may have opened the window and climbed in, wearing gloves (like burglars tend to use) and using the metal grill on the window below as a ladder?

The trajectory of the boulder-sized rock would not have landed where it did had Rudy 'thrown it directly from the car park'.

Looking for alternative 'explanations' to those tested, cross-examined and proven in court, shows how desperate you are.

 

[Stacyhs]

There is zero forensic evidence of Guede in that room. Some key forensic DNA evidence of Knox, though - her DNA directly mixed in on the exact spot of Mez' blood.

And there is zero forensic evidence of Knox in Kercher's room. You know, the room where the murder actually took place. There is exactly ONE trace of Knox in FR's room: her DNA in the same spot where Kercher's blood is found which cannot be determined how or when it was left (AK's DNA). Kercher's blood is also found without Knox's DNA mixed in. That DNA could have been left at any time the past 6 weeks or even brought in on the bottom of someone's shoe...even by FR herself.

Footprint on one of the cards scattered about to make it look like a burglary.

No footprint; shoe print. A shoe print never identified as Knox's. The rest of your sentence is nothing but speculation.

Had Guede dangerously eased himself through the 10cm diameter of jagged glass

Which he didn't do. He unlatched the window and opened it.

from the wet grass outside we could be sure to have had some muddy footprints or bits of grass,

Nope. You are assuming there was mud. It had not rained on Nov. 1 nor on Oct 31. Dry grass does not stick to things like wet grass does. Or do you think everyone who walks on dry grass leaves a trail of grass bits as they walk?

not to mention fingerprints. But there are none.

If Guede had gloves on, there wouldn't be. Or do you think it implausible that a burglar planning on breaking in through a window on a cold night wouldn't be wearing gloves? I don't recall the police finding Guede's fingerprints in the law office he broke into, either. If they had, he'd have been convicted of burglary instead of just receiving stolen goods.

The trajectory of the boulder-sized rock would not have landed where it did had Rudy 'thrown it directly from the car park'.

And your scientific evidence for this is? Oh...that's right: none. Why? Because the prosecution never had it tested. On the other hand, Pasquali determined the location of the rock and the glass were consistent with having the boulder-sized rock thrown from the car park.

Looking for alternative 'explanations' to those tested, cross-examined and proven in court, shows how desperate you are.

Repeating disproved and unproved nonsense shows how desperate you are. None of the above was tested, cross-examined and proven in court. Which is why Knox and Sollecito were definitively acquitted. Get used to it.

 

[acbytesla]

Even after you were proved wrong so clearly, you still can't accept that you are wrong. What next? Are you going to be telling us that Knox and Sollecito cleaned up all their own DNA and fingerprints from Kercher's bedroom?

Knox's passport was returned to her when she left Capanne prison the day of her acquittal (WTBH pg.445). She also didn't didn't get "straight onto a plane"; she and her family spent the night in Rome and flew out the next day.



Do you ever think before you actually type something? Do you honestly think the press couldn't buy plane tickets? Or that their newspapers, already betting on an acquittal, couldn't have hedged their bets by looking at the flight schedules and figuring out what flights were going to Seattle the next day? Honestly, Vix...stop embarrassing yourself.

The car carrying Amanda left the prison at 11:10 PM and Amanda Knox and her family boarded British Airways flight 553 from Rome to London at 11:15 AM the next day. The Knox family had made arrangements with British Airways before the verdict had been handed down. As you said, Amanda was given her passport back at the prison.

 

[Stacyhs]

The car carrying Amanda left the prison at 11:10 PM and Amanda Knox and her family boarded British Airways flight 553 from Rome to London at 11:15 AM the next day. The Knox family had made arrangements with British Airways before the verdict had been handed down. As you said, Amanda was given her passport back at the prison.

In other words, Vixen doesn't know what she's talking about.

 

[acbytesla]

In other words, Vixen doesn't know what she's talking about.

Of course not. The great thing about the flight is while the press were able to get seats on the large plane, they didn't get near Amanda. They really wasted their time and money.

 

[LondonJohn]

David Marriott.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!

I'm sure others will have got there long before me....

.... but pray, enlighten us all with this evidence of Marriott stating that he received $2 million in remuneration for PR work (or even, for that matter, evidence of him stating that he did work that would normally be valued at $2 million).

Your understanding of what constitutes objective factual evidence is laughably non-existent. It's an insult to intelligence, frankly.

 

[LondonJohn]

I am rarely wrong as my assertions are based on well-founded facts or sources.

Great. Now I need to order Irony-o-meter number 4. Can I start invoicing you for the ongoing destruction of my machines?