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The Trials of Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito: Part 29

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Vixen said:
Knox and Sollecito were fairly and unequivocally rightly convicted after a lengthy, thorough and fair trial, heavily slanted in their favour and Massei bending over backwards to accommodate them.
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Stacy, make that 12....
 
LondonJohn said:
Ermmmm.....

1) You do realise, don't you, that in criminal trials there can never be any level of equivocation in any case (it's a purely binary outcome: guilty or not guilty)?

2) Once again, I strongly suggest that you read the Marasca MR slowly and carefully. You'll maybe then understand what the Supreme Court correctly concluded, and what pro-acquittal/pro-innocence commentators here had also long since correctly concluded: that the Massei and Nencini trials were in fact not fair or thorough, but rather they were incompetently run, they were based on terminally tainted/unreliable "evidence", and they in no way applied the law properly in the way they assessed evidence (choosing instead to start from the premise of unquestioningly believing the prosecution case).


Seriously, it's high time your "arguments" were based on a proper education - both in the law in general, and in the dynamics and verdicts in this particular case. But that will never happen of course: there are none so blind as those who will not see...... :rolleyes:
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Vixen was kind enough to make back to back posts that underscore how she thinks...

Knox and Sollecito were fairly and unequivocally rightly convicted after a lengthy, thorough and fair trial, heavily slanted in their favour and Massei bending over backwards to accommodate them.
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Of course, Marasca retired immediately afterwards so he doesn't have to worry about consequences but I wonder how he sleeps at night after his disgraceful performance in this matter.
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This is how Vixen manages to justify her beliefs - she denigrates anyone who supported innocence, praises those who supported guilt. It's not just judges... C&V are corrupt and incompetent, Stefanoni is an honest, hard working, competent expert. The power of confirmation bias clearly on display for all to see.
 
Vixen said:
Knox and Sollecito were fairly and unequivocally rightly convicted after a lengthy, thorough and fair trial, heavily slanted in their favour and Massei bending over backwards to accommodate them.
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It's a mystery why someone would need this sort of rhetoric. The "heavily slanted in their favour" included Judge Massei refusing to allow an independent forensic-DNA analysis of Stefanoni's work.

When this independent analysis was granted at the next trial, the deficiencies of that work were exposed. The pair were acquitted.

If I were wanting to engage in undue rhetoric, I'd have said that Massei had been participating in a coverup of the original investigative work in Perugia, one that the eventual acquitting court, the 2015 Supreme Court, noted had been "amnesiac". But there's no need to engage in that sort of rhetoric now - the pair - RS and AK - are free and clear.
 
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Perugia Prosecutor's office in legal trouble

I don't know if I am reading this report correctly. Auto-translate can be a bear sometimes.

But from my read, the current Perugia Prosecutor's office is being investigated for:

- potential fraud for pocketing funds meant for the transcribing of interrogations, when the transcribing never happened

- fraudulent conflict of interest in relation to a local entrepreneur.​
You'd think they would learn. It reads like they continue to abuse the powers granted to them in their anti-Mafia investigations.

http://www.perugiatoday.it/cronaca/indagine-inchiesta-indagata-duchini-chiesta-proroga-indagini.html?fbclid=IwAR1ni7AKL9NsdWFv-kw6oUTG8tdrMHQXRcYmT7J4NztCR-VYWjhsj3_wIok
 
Bill Williams said:
I don't know if I am reading this report correctly. Auto-translate can be a bear sometimes.

But from my read, the current Perugia Prosecutor's office is being investigated for:

- potential fraud for pocketing funds meant for the transcribing of interrogations, when the transcribing never happened

- fraudulent conflict of interest in relation to a local entrepreneur.​
You'd think they would learn. It reads like they continue to abuse the powers granted to them in their anti-Mafia investigations.

http://www.perugiatoday.it/cronaca/indagine-inchiesta-indagata-duchini-chiesta-proroga-indagini.html?fbclid=IwAR1ni7AKL9NsdWFv-kw6oUTG8tdrMHQXRcYmT7J4NztCR-VYWjhsj3_wIok
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The headline and first paragraphs, Google translation:

"Prosecutor Antonella Duchini is under investigation, heavy charges: the prosecutor's office asks for an extension of the investigation

The Florence prosecutor's investigation against the former deputy Antonella Duchini was requested for another six months, for years under the Perugia Anti-Mafia District Directorate


Prosecutor Antonella Duchini is under investigation, heavy charges: the prosecutor's office asks for an extension of the investigation

"The investigation by the prosecutor's office of Florence against the former deputy Antonella Duchini was requested for another six months, for years under the Perugia Anti-Mafia District Directorate to which the hypotheses of embezzlement, ideological falsehood, are disputed. corruption for an act contrary to official duties, corruption in judicial proceedings." "

Yep. Sounds like there are problems in the Perugia prosecutor's office.

I wonder when it started and which prosecutors could be accused of ideological falsehood - which is a literal translation of an Italian legal charge which could be better translated as "falsification of official documents". It's one of the charges that Mignini claimed Amanda Knox was implicitly leveling against him and the police when she testified about the interrogation of Nov. 5/6, 2007 in Massei's court.
 
Vixen said:
It's clear what happened. In the final appeal hearing, Bongiorno was allowed two and a half days and 360 pages of appeal compared to the other parties' 20 minutes strict (one A4 page of skeleton argument [as is conventional and normal]). Both Sicilian Bongiorno and Bruno (once prosecuted but cleared) have mafia links, the former even representing Andreotti against mafia charges, so it's all very fishy Marasaca and Bruno preferring Bongiorno's appeal over the others and it's no surprise the MR is consequently full of contradictions and flab, resurrecting the expunged Hellmann and reinstating the excoriated Conti & Vecchiotti who had been assigned to the dustbin of ignominy by Supreme Court Chieffi.

Of course, Marasca retired immediately afterwards so he doesn't have to worry about consequences but I wonder how he sleeps at night after his disgraceful performance in this matter.
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I think you've posted in the wrong ISF thread. Here's the link to the Conspiracies and Conspiracy Theories threads:
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=91

You're welcome.
 
Numbers said:
The headline and first paragraphs, Google translation:

"Prosecutor Antonella Duchini is under investigation, heavy charges: the prosecutor's office asks for an extension of the investigation

The Florence prosecutor's investigation against the former deputy Antonella Duchini was requested for another six months, for years under the Perugia Anti-Mafia District Directorate


Prosecutor Antonella Duchini is under investigation, heavy charges: the prosecutor's office asks for an extension of the investigation

"The investigation by the prosecutor's office of Florence against the former deputy Antonella Duchini was requested for another six months, for years under the Perugia Anti-Mafia District Directorate to which the hypotheses of embezzlement, ideological falsehood, are disputed. corruption for an act contrary to official duties, corruption in judicial proceedings." "

Yep. Sounds like there are problems in the Perugia prosecutor's office.

I wonder when it started and which prosecutors could be accused of ideological falsehood - which is a literal translation of an Italian legal charge which could be better translated as "falsification of official documents". It's one of the charges that Mignini claimed Amanda Knox was implicitly leveling against him and the police when she testified about the interrogation of Nov. 5/6, 2007 in Massei's court.
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I expect to see a full reporting of this disgraceful conduct over at TJMK. Any year now.
 
Vixen said:
Stop changing the context. Bill Williams claimed Massei was some kind of a moron. I merely pointed it he was quite the reverse and probably more intelligent than people posting here.
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Stop making false claims, the above included. Bill W. did NOT claim Massei was 'some kind of a moron'. He correctly pointed out the illogical conclusions Massei came to which led to his conviction of AK and RS being overturned. Both Hellmann and Marasca clearly pointed this out. As already stated, there are none so blind as those who will not see. Take the guilt blinders off.

My point, which did NOT change the context, still stands:

Once again, you totally disregard the point in favor of some irrelevant piece of nonsense. To wit: judges you agree with are educated, bright, and from high class families. Those whom who disagree with are bent/corrupt/mafia influenced, bought off, blah blah blah...
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(post #12751775)
 
TruthCalls said:
Neither did Amanda or Raffaele yet this became an issue for them.

You may never commit a criminal offense, but that doesn't mean you won't become a suspect in a criminal offense, and that's the point.
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If I did, I wouldn't pin it on someone else nor tell lie after lie after lie. I would stand in the witness box and tell the truth.
 
Vixen said:
If I did, I wouldn't pin it on someone else nor tell lie after lie after lie. I would stand in the witness box and tell the truth.
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Like you do here?


1. Tertiary transfer does not occur.
2. Kercher's DNA literally survived a bleach bath.
3. Raff was photographed lying next to a mafia gangster.
4. Raff was seen hanging out with Italian mobsters.
5. Knox and Sollecito had all night to clean up and that is obviously what they tried to do.
6. Ex-slaves owners had laws passed counting ex-slaves only as 3/5th of a person.
7. That there was no trace of Knox at the scene of the murder is a myth.
8. Even if translates as even though.
9. AK and RS weren't 'acquitted' only 'annulled'.
10. C&V were referring only to the 'collection phase' when they said contamination could not be ruled out, and not during the analysis in the lab.
11. When the quote from C&V clearly states, 'and/or during the analyses", either I or
some other PIP 'added the last clause'.

Previous whoppers:

There were no bars under Romanelli's window on Nov 2, 2007,Knox flew home on a private chartered plane, Raff owned a Napapijri jacket and a white cap with a red stripe, Vinci quit after discovering Knox's DNA on the bra, the mop was found by the cottage front door, Knox never shed a tear for Meredith, Amanda was going through 300 euros cash daily, paper under Filomena's window had Knox's footprint on them, police claimed to hear the washing machine cycle end, police didn't think Knox had showered, Forensic police believed the blood in the bidet, sink and cotton bud were signs of the murderer rinsing the knife off, Knox rang her mother for the first time since arriving in Europe ahead of the discovery of the body etc etc etc.

(Thanks to Welshman for listing some of the above with citations)
 
Vixen said:
Sorry to disappoint you but reparation was paid to Mignini.
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No it wasn't. (Stacyhs - add this one to the list.)

The criminal proceedings against Sollecito and Gumbel were laughed out of court, and the parallel civil lawsuit brought by Mignini was, as a consequence, quietly dropped.

Besides, the promise made by the nutters at TJMK was that those two things were a result of a deal where-which Sollecito and Gumbel would make a public apology - within a week, if I remember correctly. The nutters at TJMK made no mention or "reparations", and indeed none have been made.

Yet you change the outcome, and provide no citation to back up your, "sorry to disappoint you...."
 
Vixen said:
Sorry to disappoint you but reparation was paid to Mignini.
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OH, riiiiiiiight....I read all about it over on TJMK! Slick Pete posted it as his follow up to the apology that was coming any day now (almost 2 years ago).

You do realize that I'm going to ask for evidence of this, don't you? Not that I, or anyone else, is actually expecting you to provide any. Maybe that's because you're so busy finding the evidence that RS was 'seen hanging around with Italian mobsters' and 'Lying on a beach next to a mafia gangster'?

ROTFLMAO!

ETA: Added to list of whoppers told by Vixen.
 
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