No. You are telling Americans what YOU think they should associste this particular noose with. For all you know they were goofing around with an old halloween decoration, or Maybe its a drama prop or maybe they were going to teach knot tying and they goofed off after tying this one. You are deciding that this must be racist based upon little information and your personal opinion.
Noose ladies suspended from California school
- Thread starter William Parcher
- Start date
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
He lost me when he assumed California school teachers are "professional people who should be aware of how their actions will be reasonably interpreted."
Checkmite
Skepticifimisticalationist
Oh yes, I forgot about the old noose-tying lessons in Home Ec.
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
Did you forget about all the racist public school teachers in California?
Skeptical Greg
Agave Wine Connoisseur
There are people who never watched this show and had no idea it had anything to do with photography.
I always thought it was a lighthearted take on suicide...
Foolmewunz
Grammar Resistance Leader, TLA Dictator
Nitpick: CA is not wall-to-wall Trump-haters and SJWs. There are large conservative swaths of the state and I'd be willing to be that you can find racist teachers in some of them. Hell, I have a candidate in mind - a Quora troll who is a bona fide teacher in L.A. County! Tenure and unions and all that!
Continue......
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
... Nitpick noted and dismissed as such.
You found one quora troll (who you don't even try to cite). So what?
Foolmewunz
Grammar Resistance Leader, TLA Dictator
Are you really trying to say that there's not a racist teacher in all of the public school system of the entire State of California?
Have you lost all perspective? Or do you just want to argue with me? Argue with me over an innocuous and pretty-safely-assumed statistically probable comment?
There are a quarter of a million public school teachers in CA. Do you actually think that Not One is Racist?
I'm not giving you the name of the Quora user. People use their real names on Quora, and it's not my place to sic a pack of angry dogs on them. I take them on, myself but you can go find your own. What a disturbing request!
bruto
Penultimate Amazing
Do you really believe that? That they publicized those two photographs because they were going to teach their first graders how to tie a noose, or because they just stumbled on a prop or a halloween decoration? I realize one should always be a little bit liberal and give a little room for doubt, but that's straining.
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
Photos show three or four "racist" teachers in the same school at the same time. In California. I'm not sure a US expat living in Thailand has any clue about any of this.
Thermal
August Member
New cel phone, apparently regards two errors as intentional and doesn't autocorrect. This bodes ill for those nights huddled drunk in an alley making poignant argumentative propositions, like calling posters stypyd mrrthre fookres and whatnot.
Thermal
August Member
Guys, seriously...its a back-to-school necklace, a nationwide joke. Teachers as far away as New York have been run through the mill for similar pics.
Foolmewunz
Grammar Resistance Leader, TLA Dictator
We don't actually know that they're racists, do we? I've stated this earlier; apparently you missed it.
Do you think I have less access to American media (Media media and Social media) than, say,.... you? Unless you're basing your goofy opinion on a personal survey that you've taken of all 265,000 teachers in CA, then that thought is absurd. Just how are YOU positioned to have that knowledge? Are you a union organizer for the CA school-teachers? Sit in the local human rights commission?
My wise old mom once countered one of my *****
You're supporting a stupid comment with stupider distractions. Again.... 265,000 teachers and what I thought was meant to be a humorous comment (play on noted liberal tendencies of teachers and teachers unions) you're actually doubling down on by throwing out any disparaging argument you can come up with.
This has become a tiring saw of the conservatives. You couldn't know this because you're Thai. Oops. You're not Thai. You couldn't possibly know this because you're not in America. Is there something special in the soil that makes a US Citizen not residing there less informed than those that do? I wouldn't pretend to have an opinion on whether there should be a crossing guard at Oak and Mulberry in Middletown. Larger issues with greater exposure I'm pretty up on.
(Just as an aside,... one of the things I've found about ex-pats around the world, from varying countries, is that we are all a little better informed because we keep up with things and aren't distracted by News of the Kardashians. This goes for conservatives and liberals.)
ETA: **** cat knocked over my laptop and upon rebooting it decided to post this.
I was about to say that I once got into an argument over politics with my mom. Typically arrogant know-it-all seventeen year old and she actually got me to think..... "What source of information do you have that I don't? You're talking opinions, not better information."
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Meadmaker
Unregistered
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2004
- Messages
- 29,033
I had never heard of this before, but it's true. Google the phrase "back to school necklace". You'll see a whole lot of pictures of nooses. Urbandictionary.com has an entry for the phrase.
Foolmewunz
Grammar Resistance Leader, TLA Dictator
Missed this while my cat was playing Hulk with my computer.
Thanks. I don't know if this speaks any more highly of the teachers and principal, though. "Well, they're not racists or even just clueless about the racial connotations, they're just totally insensitive to mental health issues in kids."
But... an elementary school? I think they are possibly a little closed off from the issue and think of it as a comment on "being sentenced to another school year". I'm still voting for "I need more information".
Thermal
August Member
My wife is a school psychologist in an overwhelmingly minority district, and had not heard the exact phrase but was well familiar with the sentiment (the actual phrase is buried down in the OP article). She further opined that it is recklessly irresponsible to have an actual noose around, even as an in-joke, where a depressed student might see it or be reminded of a suicide in their family. Seems reasonable to me.
eta: inappropriateness ninja'd by Foolmewunz
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Elagabalus
Philosopher
- Joined
- Dec 23, 2013
- Messages
- 7,051
Well, dagnabbit! Are we gonna' let a Yankee tell us what this thing's about!
Agree that it's reckless and irresponsible but I feel with the inclusion of the principal that no one will be sent packing.*
Except for the teacher already let go, that is.
*unless there was already an entrenched majority of teachers wanting to get rid of the Principal and now see an opportunity.
Meadmaker
Unregistered
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2004
- Messages
- 29,033
I have to agree that this seems like a really stupid thing for a principle to include in an email, and I also have to agree that there is no good reason for a real, physical, noose to ever be present in a school. No good can come of it.
Where I have real heartburn with this story is the racism angle, and not just the question of whether the noose is racist or not. It's the fact that you aren't even allowed to deny the racism. If it involves a symbol that is sometimes used in a racist manner, it's racist. If the people were aware of the racist connotations, but took the picture anyway, that's racist. If they were not aware of the racist connotations, they are obviously so clueless that they are totally out of touch with racial perceptions, which means they are racist. If someone sees the image and tries to raise the possibility that they are non racist, the person is clearly defending a racist, so they are racist.
And what should be done? Obviously, any racist of any sort should be fired. Anyone who makes any sort of racist reference is clearly a racist. They should be fired. Anyone who suggests that it's no big deal and that the teachers shouldn't be fired is insensitive to racism, which means they are racist, so they should be fired. It doesn't matter what their record is, how good they are at teaching, whether anyone can show that they intended racism, whether anyone could show that there has ever been any indication that racism has in any way influenced their job performance. None of that matters. They have been found doing something that could possibly be racist, which means that they should not be allowed to make a living in the only profession they have ever known.
Suppose we investigate the teachers and/or principal, and we find that they have records which show absolutely no hint of racism? It doesn't matter. They were doing a good job of covering it up in the past. Fire them.
It's a real lynch mob mentality. (Pun not intended, specifically, but unavoidable.)
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Sorry about the cell problem. I don't text so have not had to worry about that.
It is also one of the reasons I don't text.
Belz...
Fiend God
Now why in the blue hell would anyone do such a thing?