• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

The Trump Presidency 13: The (James) Baker's Dozen

Status
Not open for further replies.
acbytesla said:
I just read an interesting article about how Democrats can easily obtain Trump's tax records if the IRS et al refuses to produce them. Basically, bypass the Feds and get them from New York State. I'm sure they'll be more friendly. Read the article....interesting.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2019/04/congress-steve-mnuchin-trump-taxes-mick-mulvaney.amp
Click to expand...
That is interesting.

First, and most straightforwardly, the House Ways and Means Committee could subpoena Trump’s tax records from state officials. Second, New York state lawmakers could authorize the state tax commissioner to share Trump’s tax information with the House Ways and Means Committee. Third, state lawmakers could vote to release Trump’s tax filings to the public—potentially as part of a more comprehensive tax-transparency package—which, of course, would allow Ways and Means members to see them too.
Click to expand...

I wish they'd just do it and get around Trump's arrogance.
 
phiwum said:
Sorry, would you like to emulate the GOP in this respect? I sure as **** wouldn't want the Dems to adopt their "strategy" of giving up any sense of longheld values in order to ride the coattails of a cretin.
Click to expand...

I think they’d do well to emulate the GOP in winning elections. The GOP platform on almost all political issues in, in my opinion, objectively terrible. Healthcare, the environment, gun control, immigration, foreign policy, the budget, social safety net, even where they are strong in the economy is coming at the expense of blowing up the deficit and national debt. Most of it boils down to deny the problem exists and do nothing and distort and obstruct any real attempts at change.

Yet somehow they held all a majority of governorships and until recently all branches of the federal government.
 
acbytesla said:
I just read an interesting article about how Democrats can easily obtain Trump's tax records if the IRS et al refuses to produce them. Basically, bypass the Feds and get them from New York State. I'm sure they'll be more friendly. Read the article....interesting.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2019/04/congress-steve-mnuchin-trump-taxes-mick-mulvaney.amp
Click to expand...

Doesn't whether Democrats take this route depend on their ultimate goal? If they want to make the request through the feds in order to generate headlines about Trump's foot-dragging or outright refusal, then by all means turn it into a big public battle. But if they just want the information, and there's a pretty good chance NY would provide it, with or without a subpoena ... then just do it. They don't even have to publicize it. Because if they do, Trump will be happy to be in the headlines and that will become the story, when Dems (IMO) ought to be focusing on just getting the information.

Plus if they did it on the QT it would freak Trump out, and I don't think they can go wrong freaking Trump out. Unless he starts a war or something, but I don't think he's going to do that.

Play rope-a-dope, not tug-of war.
 
Leftus said:
Ok, maybe it's been used before. But none of those were made public, without consent of taxpayer in question. Hell, not even the names were made public without consent.

Let's not also forget how that all started, too. Legitimate complaints from taxpayers over the delay of the processing of their requests to their congressperson. It was not a Congressman, deciding he doesn't like the hubris of the President, to go on a fishing expedition.

The example is not on point.
Click to expand...
There are legitimate complaints from taxpayers over trump's returns too.

For example his failure to divest himself of his assets. If he is benefitting from violations of the emoluments clause (by foreign governments using trump hotels over others with the goal of gaining trump's favor, something that may come outvin tax returns, depending on what forms are requested) then the owners of competing hotels have a legitimate complaint.



Sent from my LG-K121 using Tapatalk
 
Minoosh said:
Doesn't whether Democrats take this route depend on their ultimate goal? If they want to make the request through the feds in order to generate headlines about Trump's foot-dragging or outright refusal, then by all means turn it into a big public battle. But if they just want the information, and there's a pretty good chance NY would provide it, with or without a subpoena ... then just do it. They don't even have to publicize it. Because if they do, Trump will be happy to be in the headlines and that will become the story, when Dems (IMO) ought to be focusing on just getting the information.

Plus if they did it on the QT it would freak Trump out, and I don't think they can go wrong freaking Trump out. Unless he starts a war or something, but I don't think he's going to do that.

Play rope-a-dope, not tug-of war.
Click to expand...

I don't think they could do it without the news getting out. Even if a committee chairman requested the info, I'm pretty sure the ranking minority leader would be privy to it.There are simply way too many people in that loop to believe it wouldn't get leaked.
 
From a non-USAian: Just how serious is breaking the Emolument clause of the US constitution? Is it a formal slap-of-the-wrist and a token repayment? Or double-digit years on Alcatraz (yes, specially re-opened just for this)? Or a short walk to a long drop at dawn? Somewhere in between?
 
Random said:
But taunts are one of the few things that has any chance to get through to them. We have tried logic and reason and well-crafted, evidence-based arguments. We have been trying that stuff since long before Trump T Trump came along. The GOP base just keeps punching themselves in the face and screaming “We’re owning the libs!” over and over…
Click to expand...

Some people still want Democrats to put on the boxing gloves when in the ring, even while Trumpublicans are using knives and baseball bats.
 
Norman Alexander said:
From a non-USAian: Just how serious is breaking the Emolument clause of the US constitution? Is it a formal slap-of-the-wrist and a token repayment? Or double-digit years on Alcatraz (yes, specially re-opened just for this)? Or a short walk to a long drop at dawn? Somewhere in between?
Click to expand...
It should be impeachment on Trump's scale. But like the rest of Trump's impeachable offenses, his enablers hold the Senatorial block.
 
Norman Alexander said:
From a non-USAian: Just how serious is breaking the Emolument clause of the US constitution? Is it a formal slap-of-the-wrist and a token repayment? Or double-digit years on Alcatraz (yes, specially re-opened just for this)? Or a short walk to a long drop at dawn? Somewhere in between?
Click to expand...

People are confusing the issue by using "Emoluments!" as a catchall for other possible crimes. The Emoluments clause specifically addresses accepting gifts or honors from foreign countries. It is not limited to the President but covers all office holders. It's an impeachable offense.
 
Skeptic Ginger said:
It should be impeachment on Trump's scale. But like the rest of Trump's impeachable offenses, his enablers hold the Senatorial block.
Click to expand...

Foolmewunz said:
People are confusing the issue by using "Emoluments!" as a catchall for other possible crimes. The Emoluments clause specifically addresses accepting gifts or honors from foreign countries. It is not limited to the President but covers all office holders. It's an impeachable offense.
Click to expand...
As I understand it, impeachment is simply the process of being hauled before a congressional hearing, the equivalent of a subpoena or summons to a court of law. What I'm asking is about the punishment for having been found "guilty" by such a hearing.

As for Emoluments, yes, that's just one part of the situation. There's also the clauses regarding personal enrichment using the office. Hatch Act??
 
Last edited:
CapelDodger said:
Does Nov 2020 count as soon? When he loses the election he and his blissed-out acolytes are going to go freakin' ape-doodle, just you watch.
Click to expand...

Only if the dems and voters don't shoot themselves in the foot again. I'm increasingly worried we're in for a repeat of 2016.
 
The_Animus said:
Only if the dems and voters don't shoot themselves in the foot again. I'm increasingly worried we're in for a repeat of 2016.
Click to expand...

good.
As long as we worry. there is a good chance to get rid of Trump.
Most people I know thought that Trump couldn't survive the Pussy-grabbing tape.
Let's work under the assumption that he will survive Russiagate, and prep for 2020 accordingly.
 
Norman Alexander said:
As I understand it, impeachment is simply the process of being hauled before a congressional hearing, the equivalent of a subpoena or summons to a court of law. What I'm asking is about the punishment for having been found "guilty" by such a hearing.

As for Emoluments, yes, that's just one part of the situation. There's also the clauses regarding personal enrichment using the office. Hatch Act??
Click to expand...

You seem to have side-stepped the issue. A fair hearing about impeachment cannot take place as long as the GOP legislators don't care about the law, or justice. All they appear to care about is what they can get out of the Trump POTUS experience before 2020, and maybe after if they can suppress the facts long enough.
 
Skeptic Ginger said:
You seem to have side-stepped the issue. A fair hearing about impeachment cannot take place as long as the GOP legislators don't care about the law, or justice. All they appear to care about is what they can get out of the Trump POTUS experience before 2020, and maybe after if they can suppress the facts long enough.
Click to expand...
I'm asking what the process and punishment is. Can you advise?
 
Norman Alexander said:
I'm asking what the process and punishment is. Can you advise?
Click to expand...

hardly any cases exist with regards to the Emoluments Clause and Presidents.

Basically, the Courts could rule that all profits Trump made violating the Emoluments Clause must be handed over to the Treasury.
The Trump Hotel supposedly does something like that already, although it provides zero transparency about it.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom