Anti-Muslim Terrorist Attack in... NZ?

[uke2se]

You consider Muslims alternative to the right? From a certain point of view, I suppose, but could you clarify your meaning?

I'm happy to lump Islamist extremists in with the right. It's the same poisonous ideas covered in religion.

Stout was trying to be cheeky and insinuate that people wearing head scarfs in solidarity with the victims in Christchurch would lead to the entire country becoming a patriarchal hellscape. I was making the point that that is what the righties want.

 

[The Atheist]

Unless it is Hitler

Give me a break

I don't even think it is kiwi owned any more

How about this humorous ditty sitting proudly on the shelf

"Jihad: Blood and Slavery"

Peterson is about as controversial as a fart in public swimming pool

1 Whitcoulls do not stock Mein Kampf or any other material written by Hitler.
2 It is very much still 100% Kiwi owned
3 Don't judge a book by its title - Jihad: Blood & Slavery is a scholarly exposition on the history of Jihadis.
4 Peterson is an islamphobe and I don't blame Whitcoulls at all for taking him off the shelves. I applaud it. He was over here recently and no doubt infected many minds with his puerile nonsense. Peterson is a classic example of Jury Foreman Syndrome - people always expect white blokes with greying hair to be highly believable and trustworthy. If he was a hunchback, he'd have no fans at all.

Aside from anything else, it's smart business for Whitcoulls. Christ, even the Mongrel Mob has seen the opportunity to gain a few points of public opinion, and it's the sort of thing that will make Whitcoulls customers feel even better about them.

I'm not cynical enough to say that's why they removed Peterson, but when you put it up against Kiwi corporates suspending ads on Google & Farcebook in protest of their slack attitude towards hate speech, it's another move that suggests people have had enough and want to see some real change.

As always, if you want to make change, use dollars. Petitions won't work, but taking away income streams will.

Finally, I'll note that if this looks like a derail, it clearly isn't - because it's all driven by the terrorist attack.

 

[The Atheist]

Meanwhile, Jacinda's international stature knows no bounds, with NYT openly decaring: "America deserves a leader as good as Jacinda Ardern"

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=12215416

Funny how stuff works - she is certainly the woman for the time.

 

[cullennz]

https://www.whitcoulls.co.nz/product/mein-kampf-978039592503437930

Please post a link to a discussion by Perterson criticising Islam


Thanks

 

[cullennz]

Meanwhile, Jacinda's international stature knows no bounds, with NYT openly decaring: "America deserves a leader as good as Jacinda Ardern"

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=12215416

Funny how stuff works - she is certainly the woman for the time.

She has done very very well, but the inevitable calls from some quarters for a Nobel Peace Prize are slightly OTT.

Just my opinion.

If there had to be one given for this I would give to the Imam

 

[Samson]

Meanwhile, Jacinda's international stature knows no bounds, with NYT openly decaring: "America deserves a leader as good as Jacinda Ardern"

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=12215416

Funny how stuff works - she is certainly the woman for the time.

Yes.
The time that allows her to appoint a chief justice who she knows is diametrically opposed to justice for all.
Weird construct, and your protestations that there are other matters on her plate are misguided.
Justice for these Muslims can never be aided by Jacinda Ardern on the basis of WHAT I KNOW SHE KNOWS.

 

[Stout]

I'm happy to lump Islamist extremists in with the right. It's the same poisonous ideas covered in religion.

Stout was trying to be cheeky and insinuate that people wearing head scarfs in solidarity with the victims in Christchurch would lead to the entire country becoming a patriarchal hellscape. I was making the point that that is what the righties want.

I said nothing about a "patriarchal hellscape" but if you want to interpret it that way then have at 'er.

What I was suggesting was that, if women in Iran are getting huge prison sentences for taking these things off and Islam literally means submission it's a strange choice of symbol to choose to show solidarity with the shooting victims.

But who knows, maybe the burkini will be the next hot fashion item ?

 

[Samson]

I said nothing about a "patriarchal hellscape" but if you want to interpret it that way then have at 'er.

What I was suggesting was that, if women in Iran are getting huge prison sentences for taking these things off and Islam literally means submission it's a strange choice of symbol to choose to show solidarity with the shooting victims.

But who knows, maybe the burkini will be the next hot fashion item ?

Appeasement?

 

[angrysoba]

I said nothing about a "patriarchal hellscape" but if you want to interpret it that way then have at 'er.

What I was suggesting was that, if women in Iran are getting huge prison sentences for taking these things off and Islam literally means submission it's a strange choice of symbol to choose to show solidarity with the shooting victims.

But who knows, maybe the burkini will be the next hot fashion item ?

It's one thing for a country to make it a crime not to wear a headscarf, such as Iran, and another thing for people to freely wear it if they want, as New Zealand does.

Do you honestly have a problem with people choosing to wear headscarves?

 

[angrysoba]

Appeasement?

Appeasement? Who is being appeased? What kind of twattishness is this?

 

[theprestige]

Do you honestly have a problem with people choosing to wear headscarves?

Kind of?

In Islam, the headscarf is a symbol and a tool of patriarchal oppression. When you wear one to show solidarity, you're showing solidarity with a system of patriarchal oppression. It'd be like someone shooting up an evangelical church service, and women showing solidarity by staying in the kitchen all day.

 

[Stout]

It's one thing for a country to make it a crime not to wear a headscarf, such as Iran, and another thing for people to freely wear it if they want, as New Zealand does.

Do you honestly have a problem with people choosing to wear headscarves?

No, it just seems an odd choice that's all. Were something like this to happen in a church, should we expect people to wear giant crucifixes ?

ETA, theprestige said it better than I did.

 

[angrysoba]

Kind of?

In Islam, the headscarf is a symbol and a tool of patriarchal oppression. When you wear one to show solidarity, you're showing solidarity with a system of patriarchal oppression. It'd be like someone shooting up an evangelical church service, and women showing solidarity by staying in the kitchen all day.

No, it just seems an odd choice that's all. Were something like this to happen in a church, should we expect people to wear giant crucifixes ?

ETA, theprestige said it better than I did.

In the case of the policewoman guarding the cemetery, she might simply want to be respectful while a funeral is going on.

 

[Stout]

In the case of the policewoman guarding the cemetery, she might simply want to be respectful while a funeral is going on.

That's probably the case but identifying yourself as being a member of that religion is an odd choice

 

[uke2se]

That's probably the case but identifying yourself as being a member of that religion is an odd choice

Who's doing that?

I have my own reservations about the usage of the hijab, but I am not the person to abjudicate whether it's a part of a patriarchal system of oppression or not. I leave that to Muslim women.

 

[Stout]

Who's doing that?

I have my own reservations about the usage of the hijab, but I am not the person to abjudicate whether it's a part of a patriarchal system of oppression or not. I leave that to Muslim women.

Are you seriously suggesting that if you see someone with a huge crucifix around their neck that they're not a Christian or that someone wearing a nun's habit is just wearing a costume ?

You may want to defer to Muslims, some people don't.

 

[theprestige]

In the case of the policewoman guarding the cemetery, she might simply want to be respectful while a funeral is going on.

I thought it went without saying, that in cases where it's not a show of solidarity, it's not a show of solidarity. You seem to have gotten the right end of the stick here, but grabbed entirely the wrong stick for some reason.

 

[uke2se]

Are you seriously suggesting that if you see someone with a huge crucifix around their neck that they're not a Christian or that someone wearing a nun's habit is just wearing a costume ?

You may want to defer to Muslims, some people don't.

A head scarf isn't the same as a crucifix. In my 90s hip-hop phase, I wore head scarves.

In this case, it's apparently about showing solidarity with a religious group, which has the effect of triggering islamophobes.

 

[William Parcher]

When Muslim women wish to show solidarity with non-Muslim women they do so by removing their own headscarves.

 

[Stout]

A head scarf isn't the same as a crucifix. In my 90s hip-hop phase, I wore head scarves.

In this case, it's apparently about showing solidarity with a religious group, which has the effect of triggering islamophobes.

So you're a woman who wore a hajib as part of a costume ? That's cool next time try wearing a native American headdress to a music festival and passing your sel foff as an Indian.

You could be right though, the policewoman guarding the funeral might be wearing just a head scarf, It was a warm sunny day and she thought she'd put on something to protect herself from the sun. Who knows, she tomorrow she might just decide to throw on a burka it is, after all, just a piece of comfortable clothing like a big black Mother Hubbard Dress.

You could also be right about those women in Iran who want the freedom to live without a hajib, they could just be islamobhobes and if they are, then 38 years in jail and 148 lashes is.....what ?