Patriots Owner Robert Kraft Arrested in Prostitution Sting

[William Parcher]

SNYDER: Well, as you and I speak, one of the women that's here, we're treating her as a victim. She's in protective custody. She said that she was offered a job making a lot of money in America in a nail salon. And before she knew it, she came here and found herself in the sex trafficking industry in massage parlors.

That sounds great. It's not anything illegal and seems to have nothing to do with trafficking.

But where was this nail girl going to live and cook her food and can she afford rent and daily needs? How is she going to live in America when we cannot use Mandarin and she cannot use English?

Was the nail salon gig also to be a human trafficking thing where she ends up never leaving the nail salon?

 

[I Am The Scum]

I'm not sure what you are waiting for, a trial and verdict I guess? The police claim to have video of the traffickers picking up the women at the airport...

I believe CORed was addressing the "vast majority of prostitutes [in the US]," not just the ones in this particular case.

 

[CORed]

I believe CORed was addressing the "vast majority of prostitutes [in the US]," not just the ones in this particular case.

Correct. I am not questioning the notion that human trafficking happens, and it looks like this particular case may be an example. I can also say that I have knows a few women who worked in (Korean) massage parlors who did not live in the parlor, and, as far as I could tell, were doing so voluntarily.

If the girls are truly vicitims of human trafficking, kudos to the cops for not prosecuting. Usually the women actually providing the services are the ones who bear the brunt of any law enforcement action.

I hope it goes without saying that, to whatever degree it actually happens, women being forced into prostitution is a terrible thing. And by forced, I mean, forced through threats of violence, not "forced" by economic circumstances.

Too a large degree, I think claims of "human trafficking" have been used by law enforcement and religious fanatics as a means manufacturing victims for what is for the most part a victimless crime, to justify continued existence and prosecution of prostitution laws.

 

[carlitos]

That sounds great. It's not anything illegal and seems to have nothing to do with trafficking.

But where was this nail girl going to live and cook her food and can she afford rent and daily needs? How is she going to live in America when we cannot use Mandarin and she cannot use English?

Was the nail salon gig also to be a human trafficking thing where she ends up never leaving the nail salon?

You seem incredulous about immigrants finding places to live in America, and I really can't figure out why.



Also - yes, sometimes nail salons, domestic help, farm work or urban sweatshop work is human trafficking too.

 

[William Parcher]

You seem incredulous about immigrants finding places to live in America, and I really can't figure out why.

Not incredulous at all. But these people must be surrounded by others who use their language. They might be (rightfully) fearful to leave the others who use their language. In this instance, fearful to leave the spa because nobody out there uses Mandarin.

Also - yes, sometimes nail salons, domestic help, farm work or urban sweatshop work is human trafficking too.

She said she wanted to work in a nail salon. We don't know if she understood that she would be trafficked with the nail salon. We don't know if she would have agreed saying in Mandarin, "Traffick me. Please, traffick me."

 

[Checkmite]

Was the nail salon gig also to be a human trafficking thing where she ends up never leaving the nail salon?

What nail salon gig? The fictional one the victim was promised as a bait-and-switch before she ended up at the massage parlor?

 

[varwoche]

Not incredulous at all. But these people must be surrounded by others who use their language. They might be (rightfully) fearful to leave the others who use their language. In this instance, fearful to leave the spa because nobody out there uses Mandarin.

She said she wanted to work in a nail salon. We don't know if she understood that she would be trafficked with the nail salon. We don't know if she would have agreed saying in Mandarin, "Traffick me. Please, traffick me."

Is this bizarre JAQ part of your comedy stylings?

 

[William Parcher]

What nail salon gig? The fictional one the victim was promised as a bait-and-switch before she ended up at the massage parlor?

Nail gigs are either fake (this instance) or real. There are thousands of nail salons in America. Have those girls been trafficked? If they cannot use English do they stay in one place and never leave?

The point is, if this woman had gotten her wish of working in a nail salon, she could have still been a victim of human trafficking.

 

[William Parcher]

Is this bizarre JAQ part of your comedy stylings?

Yes, it's nothing but a pathetic horror show. Nothing I say or ask means anything ever. I expect that you will never engage me again. Never again.

 

[I Am The Scum]

Yes, it's nothing but a pathetic horror show. Nothing I say or ask means anything ever. I expect that you will never engage me again. Never again.

You're just not funny. Please stop.

 

[dudalb]

You're just not funny. Please stop.

Or is he edgy. I second the please stop.

 

[Puppycow]

In (a very tiny) amount of defense he could just be one of the rich people who has literally no idea how the world works and honestly thought getting dropped off in a 225,000 dollar car by a chauffeur at a strip mall wouldn't be seen as weird.

Perhaps he was just looking for some Grey Poupon?

 

[Puppycow]

If innocuous activities are being treated as trafficking in the way you suggest then I expect (1) an example that isn't so completely asinine that it defies credulity and (2) citations, what a concept!

I can give you a citation about the sorts of arguments around these issues:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_workers'_rights#Legalization

Legalization

Sex worker advocates who are fighting for legalization or decriminalization of prostitution contend that criminalizing consensual sex acts among adults creates a black market which worsens the problem of forced human trafficking rather than reducing it. They decry the paternalistic attitude of what they disparagingly call "rescue missions", law enforcement raids that regard all sex workers as in need of "saving" fail to distinguish the minority of sex workers who are coerced from the vast majority who engage in sex work voluntarily.[16] Furthermore, liberal feminists such as Ronald Weitzer and Gayle Rubin, argue that the definition of sex work as inherently violent has created a “moral panic” that influences political discourse.[9][17] They contend that this "panic" has led to the construction of a trafficking victim who may actually be a woman migrating for work. These feminists argue that this can backfire because it does not protect those women who voluntarily enter into sex work.[16]

 

[Pterodactyl]

See? I'm not ignorant I'm a feminist.

 

[Puppycow]

I'm not sure what you are waiting for, a trial and verdict I guess? The police claim to have video of the traffickers picking up the women at the airport, and corresponding video with those same men moving the women around from spa to spa. They are only busting the johns and the traffickers, not the women. The conditions were allegedly deplorable, and the whole reason that they were found out was because of women cooking dinner where they lived - at a strip mall massage place.

Here is the sheriff William Snyder describing the Jupiter spa where the bust took place.

Sherriff on how they discovered the spa had people living and eating there:

more

I just wanted to acknowledge this post. That all does look quite damning assuming that it's all true.

If they were not just working at the massage parlor but actually living there too, it strongly suggests some kind of sex trafficking operation.

 

[Puppycow]

Here is the sheriff William Snyder describing the Jupiter spa where the bust took place.

I think it's important to look at the whole thing from beginning to end though for a fuller understanding. It's pretty clear that this sheriff is some kind of moral crusader. I listened to the 5-minute audio clip. Towards the end he says:

And what I said before, there's no locks on the door - there are locks. There's the coercion point that keeps them in bondage. And the person with the key is not the trafficker. It's the men who go into these parlors and avail themselves of this human misery. In the three groups we have - the women, the traffickers and the men - I believe the men are the most guilty.

So that would explain why he let the whole investigation last for months, while the women were in capitivity the whole time, 24 hours/day 7 days/week, having unprotected sex with 8 to 15 men per day for at least 6 months (according to the sheriff). So that he could ensare and arrest more of the "monsters" who were paying for it. Because he thinks they are even worse than the traffickers who decieved and coerced these women.

So the men who paid for sex, as he sees it, have the highest culpability, above even that of the traffickers. They would have had evidence to arrest the traffickers much earlier, but that would be the end of the investigation, and the end of the opportunity to arrest more "johns".

 

[carlitos]

Is this bizarre JAQ part of your comedy stylings?

You're just not funny. Please stop.

ditto

 

[Checkmite]

The point is, if this woman had gotten her wish of working in a nail salon, she could have still been a victim of human trafficking.

You mean, the traffickers could have imprisoned her at a nail salon like she was baited with, rather than taken to a massage parlor instead? Yes, I think everybody realizes this is true. The traffickers could theoretically have sequestered any given victim at any front business. Who is disputing this?

 

[Puppycow]

So here's a problem: If, as they say, this is human trafficking, why has nobody been charged with human trafficking?

From Reason:

'No Allegations of Human Trafficking' and 'Women Could've Walked Out' In Florida Massage-Parlor Prostitution Stings

Authorities are walking back big claims about an international human-trafficking ring involving Patriots owner Robert Kraft.

Elizabeth Nolan Brown|Feb. 25, 2019 6:30 pm

Six months is a long time, however, and it's hard to reconcile the cops' timeline with their heroic rhetoric. If the women employed at these businesses were really the victims of "modern slavery," why did police take six months to get them out of that situation? Why did it require repeat intimate undercover visits and building misdemeanor prostitution charges against all sorts of random men before these "heroes" decided to intervene?

It's one of many elements that don't add up with what prosecutors are saying in public and what's actually happened in the case.

At a press conference (partially aired on CNN) today, Palm Beach District Attorney Dave Aronberg spent most of his time talking about the theoretical horrors that could occur in situations like this. "Modern day slavery," as Aronberg called it, "can happen anywhere, including in the peaceful community of Jupiter."

However, no human trafficking charges were filed among the hundreds of (current and coming) prostitution charges, he admitted, adding that first-time offenders (like Robert Kraft) are "very unlikely to get any significant" time behind bars.

"There's no allegation that any defendant engaged in human trafficking," said Aronberg.
Police keep calling the women that worked at Orchids of Asia and the other spas that were part of the sting "trafficking victims." But most have declined to cooperate with police as such.

There's more in the rest of the article.

If everything the sheriff claims is true, then they allowed sex slaves to be raped 8 or more times per day for months on end without intervening. Just so they could bust more "johns". Yet nobody has been charged with human trafficking.

 

[Elagabalus]

So here's a problem: If, as they say, this is human trafficking, why has nobody been charged with human trafficking?

From Reason:

'No Allegations of Human Trafficking' and 'Women Could've Walked Out' In Florida Massage-Parlor Prostitution Stings



There's more in the rest of the article.

If everything the sheriff claims is true, then they allowed sex slaves to be raped 8 or more times per day for months on end without intervening. Just so they could bust more "johns". Yet nobody has been charged with human trafficking.

So Reason is a Russkie troll site? Who knew?