Patriots Owner Robert Kraft Arrested in Prostitution Sting

[William Parcher]

I don't know what to say. DM reported him as being the name that is bigger than Kraft. Maybe they think that because he is involved in big politics.

Maybe it's Kraft who is the biggest name.

 

[Puppycow]

John Childs is not a familiar name to me.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bl...m-namesake-firm-in-wake-of-prostitution-sting

Private equity rich guy apparently.

I'm going to guess he's not a "bigger name" than Robert Kraft to most people.

 

[William Parcher]

We could ask the question...

Who was the person who actually decided that there was a bigger name than Kraft, and according to what criteria did they decide?

 

[Thermal]

We could ask the question...

Who was the person who actually decided that there was a bigger name than Kraft, and according to what criteria did they decide?

*Michael Cohen sits shaking his head with arms folded across chest*

 

[JoeMorgue]

The more basic question is if there was a "bigger name" then Kraft... why did the news bury the lead so to speak? Why not open with the "Bigger name" and then mention Kraft?

 

[William Parcher]

The more basic question is if there was a "bigger name" then Kraft... why did the news bury the lead so to speak? Why not open with the "Bigger name" and then mention Kraft?

It's possible that police leaked Kraft's name before any other name and before the full list was available to reporters.

 

[William Parcher]

IIRC, Kraft's name was leaked to the press before his arrest warrant was issued.

 

[timhau]

Perhaps he was counting on not being recognized by the prostitute. A "high class" prostitute might be more likely to recognize him and figure out who he is in real life. At a place like this, just another unremarkable old man.

... whose chauffeur drives him around in a Bentley.

 

[JoeMorgue]

In (a very tiny) amount of defense he could just be one of the rich people who has literally no idea how the world works and honestly thought getting dropped off in a 225,000 dollar car by a chauffeur at a strip mall wouldn't be seen as weird.

 

[varwoche]

It often is just two consenting adults making a business deal. A person has access to an event like the Superbowl. They say to another adult, "There's good money involved if I get you into the event so you can have sex for money with rich people. We can split the money."

The second adult consents. They head off to the Superbowl, make a bunch of money but get raided by police. One of those consenting adults is now a human trafficker.

Human trafficing is a catchall phrase that makes innocuous activity sound really bad in order to help with conviction rates.

If innocuous activities are being treated as trafficking in the way you suggest then I expect (1) an example that isn't so completely asinine that it defies credulity and (2) citations, what a concept!

 

[JoeMorgue]

Consent is not the same thing as enjoyment or "being really into it."

A prostitute who doesn't like prostituting but is still an open and willing participant in the transaction isn't a sex slave, they're just a person who hates their job. There's a support for that. It's called everybody. We meet at the bar every night after work.

 

[CORed]

If innocuous activities are being treated as trafficking in the way you suggest then I expect (1) an example that isn't so completely asinine that it defies credulity and (2) citations, what a concept!

I see claims made all the time that the vast majority of prostitutes are victims of human traficking. However, the evidence offered in support of these claim is laughably slim to non-existent. As far as I am concerned, the burden of proof is on the people making these claims, and they have not met that burden.

 

[carlitos]

I see claims made all the time that the vast majority of prostitutes are victims of human traficking. However, the evidence offered in support of these claim is laughably slim to non-existent. As far as I am concerned, the burden of proof is on the people making these claims, and they have not met that burden.

I'm not sure what you are waiting for, a trial and verdict I guess? The police claim to have video of the traffickers picking up the women at the airport, and corresponding video with those same men moving the women around from spa to spa. They are only busting the johns and the traffickers, not the women. The conditions were allegedly deplorable, and the whole reason that they were found out was because of women cooking dinner where they lived - at a strip mall massage place.



Here is the sheriff William Snyder describing the Jupiter spa where the bust took place.

KELLY: Good afternoon. So what tipped you off to sex trafficking in these massage parlors?


SNYDER: The original tip came in by way of a state health care worker. And when the worker went in, she noticed suitcases and other indications that perhaps somebody was living in this small storefront. She called us at the sheriff's office, and we began what turned into an eight-month investigation.


KELLY: You described it as a small storefront massage parlor. We're talking brothels in a strip mall. Describe the conditions that these women were living and working in.


SNYDER: They were staying inside the massage parlor for 24 hours a day, seven days a week. They were actually sleeping on the tables where they provided the illicit sexual activity.




...


SNYDER: Well, as you and I speak, one of the women that's here, we're treating her as a victim. She's in protective custody. She said that she was offered a job making a lot of money in America in a nail salon. And before she knew it, she came here and found herself in the sex trafficking industry in massage parlors.


We have NGOs helping us along with Mandarin-speaking interpreters, and we're doing our very best to try to get these women some kind of help. You alluded to it earlier, and it's true, they tend not to want to cooperate because of the coercion point. And oftentimes, and this woman said it, she feels that her family in China is at risk if she cooperates with law enforcement.

Sherriff on how they discovered the spa had people living and eating there:

According to Snyder, investigators were tipped off through a complaint filed by the Health Department in July 2018.


“They were cooking on the back steps of the business. These women were sleeping in massage parlors, on the massage tables and had no access to transportation,” said Synder, who noted the victims were averaging eight clients a day. “If you do the math, that is about 1,500 men a year, with no days off.”

more

"Over my dead body will any of these women be prosecuted," said Snyder, adding that the women are currently undergoing mental and physical examinations at local treatment facilities.

...


Snyder said it was clear the women were trafficked, hoping to silence talk of the possibility they were consensual sex workers. "These women are treated as human chattel and they are moved around. "Any notion out there that this is some kind of local prostitution or that these women are willing participants is categorically untrue," said Snyder.



...



"They were almost in a zombie-like appearance, it's really sad. Their lives are ruined," said Snyder. The women were performing sexual acts on a minimum of eight johns a day, according to Snyder, with no breaks or days off.



"There are men that went in there and utilized these women's services that would not have allowed their dog to be in such wretched conditions," said Snyder.

​

​

 

[ponderingturtle]

It often is just two consenting adults making a business deal. A person has access to an event like the Superbowl. They say to another adult, "There's good money involved if I get you into the event so you can have sex for money with rich people. We can split the money."

The second adult consents. They head off to the Superbowl, make a bunch of money but get raided by police. One of those consenting adults is now a human trafficker.

Human trafficing is a catchall phrase that makes innocuous activity sound really bad in order to help with conviction rates.

except of course that in this case the workers at the shop seem to be rather coerced with the issue of them living in the massage parlor.

 

[applecorped]

Oh noes! Kraft Legacy tainted!!

 

[William Parcher]

In this case we have women charged with both trafficking and prostitution. Apparently, trafficking is not lucrative enough that you can then go onwards without prostituting yourself for money. Or, this is more complicated than can be easily understood from our armchairs.

 

[timhau]

In this case we have women charged with both trafficking and prostitution. Apparently, trafficking is not lucrative enough that you can then go onwards without prostituting yourself for money.

Or alternatively, they get promoted to 'management' after a while, but are still required to turn tricks every now and then.

 

[William Parcher]

Or alternatively, they get promoted to 'management' after a while, but are still required to turn tricks every now and then.

Well, "management" might be the racketeering charges that we see here also. Is the trafficking charge for procuring girls in China or picking them up at the American airport, or what?

 

[William Parcher]

KELLY: You described it as a small storefront massage parlor. We're talking brothels in a strip mall. Describe the conditions that these women were living and working in.

SNYDER: They were staying inside the massage parlor for 24 hours a day, seven days a week. They were actually sleeping on the tables where they provided the illicit sexual activity.

There is an underlying fundamental issue that must be mentioned. These women cannot use the English language and Americans cannot use the Mandarin language. If they leave the spa for any reason they will have great difficulties because nobody out there will be able to communicate with them. This would still be the situation if these women weren't trafficked and were doing this with full consent and knowledge of what goes on at the spa.

So they all sleep and cook at the spa. What would be the alternative here? House, apartment, motel, street, or what? Is the madam supposed to provide housing for all of them? Do they pay rent? They can't use the English language. Even a non-trafficked prostitute who comes with full consent and knowledge still has to deal with housing and utilities and daily needs and whatever else.

 

[carlitos]

Yes, the alternative to living in a strip mall massage parlor would indeed be a house, apartment, motel, street or what.