Cont: Brexit: Now What? Part 5

Status
Not open for further replies.
They could call it import tax - or what it really is a sales tax.

VAT is charged on all sorts of items where no value is added. You pay VAT on e-books you read on a Kindle or similar, but not on real paper books. Crazy.
 
IT still would be. The shipping agent in Hong Kong or whatever would merely be acting as a middleman - in just the same way that Parcel Farce with their quaint postcards do now. The shipping agent would collect the VAT, forward it to HMRC, and mark the individual parcel or the shipping container containing thousands of such parcels or whatever 'VAT paid' - maybe with some hologram sticker or something if it's decided that is required.

If the authorities ever detected a shipping agent cheating, then they could target and stop any parcels sent by that agent until the bills had been paid.

It would be less hassle for buyers, less work for the customs officers here, and HMRC would collect the VAT on all imported parcels using this system - not just the ones they catch with the present system.

In my experience the present system is something of a lottery and I often used to receive even parcels containing expensive items (and sometimes marked as such) without having to pay VAT or handling charges - though I was occasionally hit by the VAT plus handling fee hassle. Now I choose not to undergo that hassle (by using the system that goes via Germany for more expensive items) I pay the VAT every time - so I actually pay more than previously - but it's worth it to avoid the hassle and delay caused by the antiquated postcard system.

Except, as per Pitney-Bowes in the States, whoever is collecting the VAT and sending the package on to the UK would be required to inspect the contents of the package to confirm that they are what the declaration says they are. They won't do that without some sort of fee.
 
Last edited:
They could call it import tax - or what it really is a sales tax.

VAT is charged on all sorts of items where no value is added. You pay VAT on e-books you read on a Kindle or similar, but not on real paper books. Crazy.
It is called import VAT. it is not a sales tax. Sales taxes are different. VAT replaced UK sales tax in 1973. Import VAT is a VAT. It works in the same way as VAT charged by a UK shop.
VAT is paid at stages in the supply chain reflecting where value is added. The clue is in the name. Seriously it takes 30 seconds to understand the basics. Look it up. Learn something!
 
They could call it import tax - or what it really is a sales tax.

VAT is charged on all sorts of items where no value is added. You pay VAT on e-books you read on a Kindle or similar, but not on real paper books. Crazy.

If VAT is levied on imports it is to make sure the imported goods get the same tax treatment as goods produced locally in order to prevent a distortion of competition

And no, VAT is not a sale tax because tax payers are entitled to deduct from the TVA they owe to the State because of their sales the VAT they have paid on their purchases and on their imports.
 
Last edited:
East Germany comes to mind.

Many (most?) european nations take a rather ethnic view of citizenship. Given that it's recognized that northern Irish can be ethnicly Irish, there is nothing odd about them being entitled to Irish citizenship.

WP has this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citiz...on#Summary_of_member_states'_nationality_laws

The UK has deployed partition in various parts of their former empire. It has never worked.

One might be forgiven for thinking that they might review that position in light of it's universal failure, but they won't.
 
Accurate.

I rather like this bit:


DAVID CAMERON ENTERS.

DAVID CAMERON: OK.

DAVID CAMERON SCARPERS.


On the plus side, Cameron is now making hundreds of thousands of pounds at speaking engagements and for access to his Outlook address book, so at least there's good news for someone... (https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/dec/29/what-is-david-cameron-doing-now),



Totally unrelated, but this came as a total surprise:

"In contrast, Gordon Brown made more than £1m from giving speeches and writing memoirs after leaving his job as Labour prime minister, but gave the money either directly to charity or to help the Office of Gordon and Sarah Brown fund charity work."
 
I have one nagging worry about this. If it turns out that the process of leaving the EU is so complicated as to be impossible in practice, then the statement that "we could leave the EU any time we want to" isn't exactly correct. Unfortunately, there's a recipriverse excluson involved here (to borrow a Douglas Adams term for something that's defined as anything other than itself); if it turns out that we can't leave the EU, then the leavers had a point that our sovereignty was limited, whereas if it turns out that we can, then it turns out that they didn't. Either way, the only possible option is the wrong one.

Dave
 
I have one nagging worry about this. If it turns out that the process of leaving the EU is so complicated as to be impossible in practice, then the statement that "we could leave the EU any time we want to" isn't exactly correct. Unfortunately, there's a recipriverse excluson involved here (to borrow a Douglas Adams term for something that's defined as anything other than itself); if it turns out that we can't leave the EU, then the leavers had a point that our sovereignty was limited, whereas if it turns out that we can, then it turns out that they didn't. Either way, the only possible option is the wrong one.

Dave

What do mean? The UK will be out of the EU in less than 6 months; nothing complicated about it.
 
Yes, leaving isn't the problem.
The problem is leaving and still having all the nice shiny things that we still want.
 
What do mean? The UK will be out of the EU in less than 6 months; nothing complicated about it.

It must be nice living under that rock.

Are we in or out of the customs union? If we're out, what happens to the Irish border? Does it break the Good Friday agreement, and if so, does the IRA reform and decide it's time to start making trouble again? If we're in for two years then out, all that's happened is that the can's been kicked down the road a bit. And if we're in indefinitely, then we haven't actually left. And if none of those is acceptable and we leave without a deal, what happens ot the Irish border?

"Nothing complicated about it" is a ridiculous claim.

Dave
 
It must be nice living under that rock.

Are we in or out of the customs union? If we're out, what happens to the Irish border? Does it break the Good Friday agreement, and if so, does the IRA reform and decide it's time to start making trouble again? If we're in for two years then out, all that's happened is that the can's been kicked down the road a bit. And if we're in indefinitely, then we haven't actually left. And if none of those is acceptable and we leave without a deal, what happens ot the Irish border?

"Nothing complicated about it" is a ridiculous claim.

Dave

No he is quite right in the sense he was using. It is very straightforward, we are out of the EU on that day. Everything that relied on our EU treaty then disappears in a puff of smoke.

Of course were that leaves us is the worst of all possible places....
 
The EU has issued Brexit preparedness notices over a year ago. The UK government has finally managed to put together and release some of its own in the last few weeks. There is no big secret about this.

Are we in or out of the customs union?
No deal, no customs union.

If we're out, what happens to the Irish border?
It will be an international border between the EU-member Ireland and the UK. I wouldn't care to guess what Ireland decides to do about it.

Does it break the Good Friday agreement,
I don't see how the agreed cooperation can be continued across such a border. So, probably.

and if so, does the IRA reform and decide it's time to start making trouble again?
Who knows but the peaceful path seems a more promising road to unification.

If we're in for two years then out, all that's happened is that the can's been kicked down the road a bit.
An earlier leave date would have required a withdrawal agreement. There is no legal way to skip the 2 year negotiating period without an agreement.

And if we're in indefinitely, then we haven't actually left.
That's not an option on the table.

"Nothing complicated about it" is a ridiculous claim.
Next March 29, at midnight, the UK will be out of the EU. No further action is required. No agreements need to be made.
 
I have one nagging worry about this. If it turns out that the process of leaving the EU is so complicated as to be impossible in practice, then the statement that "we could leave the EU any time we want to" isn't exactly correct. Unfortunately, there's a recipriverse excluson involved here (to borrow a Douglas Adams term for something that's defined as anything other than itself); if it turns out that we can't leave the EU, then the leavers had a point that our sovereignty was limited, whereas if it turns out that we can, then it turns out that they didn't. Either way, the only possible option is the wrong one.

Dave


the answer is that it is difficult but not impossible to leave and needs to be carefully managed. Unfortunately the people we have in charge of it couldnt manage a pee without flooding the bathroom.

if you actually want to leave you do it in a controlled and staged manner. that would probably mean maybe 3 to 5 years of being in the EEA or something. We would put in place the things we need to and negotiate with the EU sensibky in achievable positions.

Unfortunately Brexit has now simply become a matter of pure obstinance for some who simply want us out as soon as possible no matter the damage.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom