New SCOTUS Judge II: The Wrath of Kavanaugh

[Bogative]

According to Bogative, we should take Kavanaugh's word on what words mean over everybody else who ever used said words.
It is a twisted conspiracy to take them the way they are used in general.

Or maybe words have different meanings to different people.

Example

According to The Great Zaganza a major league baseball pitcher legally changed his name to a slang word that meant anal sex and his twisted mother gave him the same nickname for ***** and giggles.

 

[Meadmaker]

I'm going pick a random date... August 23, 1994

What were you doing on that day?

Where did you go?

How did you get there?

How did you get home?

I went to work at the Delphi building in Troy, Michigan,, just behind the Oakland Mall. I drove there is my car, a burgundy colored Saturn station wagon, license plate number AKR 859. Nothing remarkable happened. I had gotten back from vacation the day before, and was catching up on what had happened when I had been gone for nine days on vacation.

It was a Tuesday.


People were surprised to see me on Monday, because I had facial hair for the first time in my life. I didn't shave while on vacation, a tradition for that particular vacation, which I took every year, but this time I had gone for a longer period than I usually go, so my beard was fuller. I put the shaving cream on my face when I got home Sunday night, and was about to shave it off, when I decided to leave it and see how I liked it.


I don't remember anything specific that happened in the evening, but I probably stopped at Alcove Hobby Shop to buy cards for Magic: The Gathering. I had heard of this interesting new game that a lot of my friends were into, and just before leaving on vacation, I had purchased my first deck. I walked up to the counter at the store and the attendant said, "No Dark!". That was the first day of release of a new expansion set, but they were sold out. I didn't know it was the first day of release, and I said I just wanted regular cards, so I bought a starter pack. I instantly loved the game, and was eager to buy more cards when I got back from vacation, so I would definitely have bought cards on Monday, August 22, but probably on Tuesday, August 23, as well. I bought a couple of booster packs most days for the first couple of weeks, and experimented with different decks.

Oh, I can't pretend to specifically remember driving to work that day, or driving home. However I do know that I drove to and from work every day in my car, and I know what car it was, and I know that it was an ordinary work day where I was trying to catch up what I had missed while on vacation. I can tell you the names of some of the people I talked to that day, but only because they were the same people I talked to every day during that period of my career.

Now, let's pick another random date. Let's say, I don't know, September 11, 2001. Not random? Yeah, that's true. It isn't. Neither is the day that Ms. Ford (allegedly) was assaulted.

 

[The Great Zaganza]

Or maybe words have different meanings to different people.

Example

According to The Great Zaganza a major league baseball pitcher legally changed his name to a slang word that meant anal sex and his twisted mother gave him the same nickname for ***** and giggles.

and when that catches on you might have a point. If suddenly everyone drops the old meaning and picks the new one.
But why would anyone care what I call a pitcher?


At the time Kavanaugh was in school, people used "devil's triangle, ralphing and boofing" in a specific way.
And your claim seems to be that he, and he alone, used them differently. And it should be enough for us to take his word that for him they meant something more harmless.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

When anyone says the language he used in his yearbook quotes means something different than what he says they mean.

"Have you farted yet?"

Riiight.

 

[Elagabalus]

...I don't remember anything specific that happened in the evening, but I probably stopped at Alcove Hobby Shop to buy cards for Magic: The Gathering. I had heard of this interesting new game that a lot of my friends were into, and just before leaving on vacation, I had purchased my first deck. I walked up to the counter at the store and the attendant said, "No Dark!". That was the first day of release of a new expansion set, but they were sold out. I didn't know it was the first day of release, and I said I just wanted regular cards, so I bought a starter pack. I instantly loved the game, and was eager to buy more cards when I got back from vacation, so I would definitely have bought cards on Monday, August 22, but probably on Tuesday, August 23, as well. I bought a couple of booster packs most days for the first couple of weeks, and experimented with different decks...

OK, STOP RIGHT THERE!

I went to work at the Delphi building in Troy, Michigan,, just behind the Oakland Mall. I drove there is my car, a burgundy colored Saturn station wagon, license plate number AKR 859. Nothing remarkable happened. I had gotten back from vacation the day before, and was catching up on what had happened when I had been gone for nine days on vacation.

It was a Tuesday.


People were surprised to see me on Monday, because I had facial hair for the first time in my life. I didn't shave while on vacation, a tradition for that particular vacation, which I took every year, but this time I had gone for a longer period than I usually go, so my beard was fuller. I put the shaving cream on my face when I got home Sunday night, and was about to shave it off, when I decided to leave it and see how I liked it...

Did you arrive to work hammered? How much do you think that you would remember?

 

[Bob001]

.....
Now, let's pick another random date. Let's say, I don't know, September 11, 2001. Not random? Yeah, that's true. It isn't. Neither is the day that Ms. Ford (allegedly) was assaulted.

I'm not quite sure what your point is here. On an uneventful day, all the details would have roughly equal weight. You would remember -- or forget -- them equally. On a day when something terrible happened -- like fearing you could be raped and "accidentally" killed -- that single event is very likely all you will remember, all that your mind will form memories of, because nothing else will matter. I doubt that the people who struggled down the stairs of the World Trade Center can tell you what they had for breakfast that morning or who else was in their subway car on the way to work. This just doesn't seem like a difficult concept.

 

[Meadmaker]

A 1990 warning from DC area headmasters (incl Georgetown Prep and Holton-Arms) to parents about student parties:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/arch...a1c-89bb-8b004e21825e/?utm_term=.1182a1b5719e

This is just weird. A 1990 warning that said teenagers sometimes drank is somehow evidence that is to the question of whether or not Brett Kavanaugh committed sexual assault in 1982? That's just weird.

My biggest question right now is how on earth did this d-bag pass his background checks in the first place? Does having a history of getting blackout drunk not count against an applicant?

It shouldn't.


I've talked about my heavy partying and my blackouts in high school and college. What that means is that I was drinking a couple of hundred times, drunk at least one hundred times, and experience memory loss of up to two hours on probably half a dozen occasions between the years 1978 and 1982. Is there any position at all in this world that that would disqualify me? I'm not qualified to sit on the Supreme Court, but I got a job that required a high level security clearance as an aerospace engineer, and based on the questions they asked my friends, I am 100% confident that they knew about my history of heavy drinking, which had pretty much stopped by 1984. (I got the clearance in 1987.)

Did they just not realize what a security risk I was, having blacked out from alcohol abuse as a college student five years earlier?

 

[The Great Zaganza]

Trauma and Memory has been studied in depth.
If you argue that Ford's memory should be better than it seems to be, that's an argument from ignorance.

 

[Slings and Arrows]

I would suggest FBI questions that might jog Dr. Ford’s memory:

1) Did you alert Leland to the danger she faced before you left her at a party where 2 men had just tried to rape you?

2) Did you try to get her to leave?

3) Did you call her that night to see if she got home safely?

-- Tammy Bruce (Sept 29, 2018)

With friends like that...

 

[Bob001]

This is just weird. A 1990 warning that said teenagers sometimes drank is somehow evidence that is to the question of whether or not Brett Kavanaugh committed sexual assault in 1982? That's just weird.
.....

The issue is whether Kav's memory is reliable when he says he never engaged in behavior like Ford describes. If he had a history of heavy drinking, let alone blackouts, his claims about his sterling behavior are less believable.

 

[Meadmaker]

OK, STOP RIGHT THERE!






Did you arrive to work hammered? How much do you think that you would remember?

No, I did not arrive to work hammered.

On the other hand, according to the reasoning on this thread, I have admitted to heavy drinking that included blackouts. Therefore, I cannot say with certainty that I did not arrive to work hammered, because maybe I was so drunk that I just can't remember showing up to work hammered.

One week before, on Tuesday, August 16, I got pretty drunk, but not to the point of blacking out. I was past that phase of my life by then.

 

[The Great Zaganza]

Did they just not realize what a security risk I was, having blacked out from alcohol abuse as a college student five years earlier?

It's not about what you did back than, but how much proof of your past misbehavior could influence your current work.

Kavanaugh has made himself vulnerable to blackmail by stating under oath that he did not do certain things in High School / College.
If anyone has proof that he did was his calendar and his accusers claim, they could use that to influence him as a Judge.

 

[Meadmaker]

I'm not quite sure what your point is here. On an uneventful day, all the details would have roughly equal weight. You would remember -- or forget -- them equally. On a day when something terrible happened -- like fearing you could be raped and "accidentally" killed -- that single event is very likely all you will remember, all that your mind will form memories of, because nothing else will matter. I doubt that the people who struggled down the stairs of the World Trade Center can tell you what they had for breakfast that morning or who else was in their subway car on the way to work. This just doesn't seem like a difficult concept.

I'm confident that quite a few of them could tell you what they had for breakfast that morning.

I am even more confident that even more of them could tell you what they had for dinner.

 

[quadraginta]

Based solely on what you've seen/read so far, do you believe Kavanaugh was completely honest in his testimony Thursday?

Mostly. Nothing that would disqualify him from the position.

There was a time when the GOP considered perjury to be such an egregious offense that they impeached a sitting president for refusing to admit that he had been given a knob job by a consenting adult. Had they had the needed two thirds majority in the Senate they certainly would have gotten him removed from office.

Why do you think this attitude of theirs toward perjury has changed?

Do you believe Kavanaugh's clear and emphatic statements under oath that he never suffered any sort of memory impairment at all as a result of excessive alcohol consumption while in high school?

If you don't, why would this perjury not prove him unfit for the SCOTUS position?

What has changed?

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

No, I did not arrive to work hammered.

On the other hand, according to the reasoning on this thread, I have admitted to heavy drinking that included blackouts. Therefore, I cannot say with certainty that I did not arrive to work hammered, because maybe I was so drunk that I just can't remember showing up to work hammered.

One week before, on Tuesday, August 16, I got pretty drunk, but not to the point of blacking out. I was past that phase of my life by then.

What is your point? You can remember X ergo Ford is lying if she says she doesn't?

That is absurd.

I had similar things happen as Ford did and my memory is very clear on the actual events and quite vague on details surrounding it. My anecdotes are much more relevant than yours.

 

[quadraginta]

Latest from Trump:

NBC News incorrectly reported (as usual) that I was limiting the FBI investigation of Judge Kavanaugh, and witnesses, only to certain people. Actually, I want them to interview whoever they deem appropriate, at their discretion. Please correct your reporting!

Linky.

Is this true? Is he just referring to what he is claiming to want, and not the FBI's actual instructions?

It would certainly give the FBI a great deal of cover for interviewing whoever they wanted, since we have been told by the White House that Trump's tweets are official White House statements.

 

[Meadmaker]

and when that catches on you might have a point. If suddenly everyone drops the old meaning and picks the new one.
But why would anyone care what I call a pitcher?


At the time Kavanaugh was in school, people used "devil's triangle, ralphing and boofing" in a specific way.
And your claim seems to be that he, and he alone, used them differently. And it should be enough for us to take his word that for him they meant something more harmless.

Actually......I never heard the term "devil's triangle", to mean anything at all. On the other hand, we made up "house rules" to our drinking games, and made up phrases to go with them.

I must agree with "ralphing". I can't imagine it meaning anything other than vomiting, and it would rarely be used except in the context of vomiting due to heavy drinking. As for "boofing", I've only ever heard it used as one thing, but there are local slang variations. (See my earlier post about "hooter" meaning fellatio in my town.) The weird thing is that I don't get why Kavanaugh would lie about that. It appears he did, but I'm at a loss as to why he would.

He seemed sincere when he said it, but of course the idea that we could judge truth or falsehood based on the apparent sincerity of the speaker is laughable.

ETA: But the big mystery is why anyone thinks that the phrase "Have you boofed yet" constitutes evidence in a sexual assault investigation.

 

[Bogative]

Why do you think this attitude of theirs toward perjury has changed?

Perjury hasn't been proven.

Do you believe Kavanaugh's clear and emphatic statements under oath that he never suffered any sort of memory impairment at all as a result of excessive alcohol consumption while in high school?

Did he deny having "any sort of memory impairment", I thought he just denied getting "blackout" drunk?

 

[The Great Zaganza]

Perjury hasn't been proven.

you are evading the question.
If it can be shown that Kavanaugh lied in front of the Committee, would that disqualify him because of perjury?

Or is this a special case where it depends a lot on the topic, the severity, the number of false claims?

 

[quadraginta]

Perjury hasn't been proven.


Did he deny having "any sort of memory impairment", I thought he just denied getting "blackout" drunk?

Maybe you should watch his testimony.