Cont: Mueller Investigation pt3

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Segnosaur said:
He was also from a wealthy family. I suspect extensive tutoring might have been involved. And some people are saying bribery. You know, the best people are saying it. I don't believe it myself but its what people are saying.


The Republican "clown car" primaries were not exactly an ideal measure of his ability to "recognize what the base wanted". For the first 2 months, he didn't get anywhere near 50% of the popular vote. (You don't have to be particularly good to win a primary, you just have to be better than an almost equally bad alternative.)

Plus, Trump did receive assistance from others... Bannon, Fox News, Russia. Had those not assisted him he would probably not have become the republican candidate.


I disagree.

Yes, he is a narcissist, amoral, etc. But, there were times when he COULD have acted intelligently (egotistically/immorally, but still intelligently) but chose not to.
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He didn't get benefits from Fox News in the primaries. They were opposed to Trump until he was the clear winner.
 
Toontown said:
Your post contains roughly as infinitesimal an amount of substance as a Trump rally speech.

You attacked the messenger, failed to address the point, dubiously proclaimed the entertainment value of seeking out Trump hate which you dubiously claim to find hilarious, then committed the fallacy of attributing what you perceive as the fine doings of the U.S. to Trump, rather than the 325 million people who comprise a country that was already fabulously wealthy and successful when Trump was born.

Predictably, the bottom line remains unchanged after all your obfuscation attempts. A Richie Rich who had invested an equal inheritance at the same time Trump got his would now be @5 billion ahead of Trump, after spending a lifetime dodging AIDS or whatever.

As for his meteoric rise to POTUS, it is my sad duty to inform you that this is NOT evidence that the U.S. is doing well. OTC, Trump's seizure of the White House, with the help of the Russians, is a disturbing indication of the decay of U.S. democracy.
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https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/01/...o-describe-how-good-the-jobs-numbers-are.html

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-gdp-growth-q3-third-quarter-strong-2018-8

Prediction: Things will keep getting better. Even after this fiasco of a probe ends. Also, certain members of the last administration and certain agency officials might be worried about upcoming prosecutions more so than Trump.
 
River said:
Prediction: Things will keep getting better. Even after this fiasco of a probe ends. Also, certain members of the last administration and certain agency officials might be worried about upcoming prosecutions more so than Trump.
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See, when you don't define "seems", counterpoint can just come right up for whatever you say.

Wages aren’t growing when adjusted for inflation, new data finds

Wages aren’t growing when adjusted for inflation, a new report released Tuesday showed.

According to the Labor Department, median weekly earnings fell 0.6% in inflation-adjusted dollars in the second quarter, compared to the same time period of 2017.

That’s now the third straight quarter where inflation has outpaced wage growth.
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River said:
I'm sure Toontown has much bigger accomplishments than becoming potus under their belt. I'm just here for the entertainment. The Trump hate in this thread is hilarious. Meanwhile, the USA seems to be doing just fine. (insert the boy who cried wolf here)
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Kind of like me with the Bigfoot threads. In that case, carry on.
 
LSSBB said:
See, when you don't define "seems", counterpoint can just come right up for whatever you say.

Wages aren’t growing when adjusted for inflation, new data finds
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Well... The two things aren't mutually exclusive, regardless, and which is being treated as important seems to depend a bit on one's politics. The GOP has quite clearly shown that it strongly supports business... to the point where "By the people, For the people, Of the people" likely needs one or more of those "peoples" needs exchanged with "businesses." By the Republican action of giving them significantly more money to work with, it's no surprise that GDP is up. Supposedly, more money total will trickle down to the rest of us somehow. It's just too bad that their strategy seems to pretty much be 1. Make businesses richer! 2. ??? 3. Profits for everyone, nevermind that it's consistently failed to work like that!

Well, all that is, of course, a pleasant lie being spread by candidates and officials who don't want to own up to what they're actually doing. Pandering to the Kochs, because the Kochs corrupted the Republican party and ideology really badly in their long and well funded campaigning to get what they want. It's somewhat said to look at a bunch of things in the rather "extreme" Libertarian platform of 1980, where one of the Kochs ran as VP and compare it to what the Republican party was transformed into and what they've pretty clearly been pushing towards.

But... all this is a somewhat off topic tangent caused by one who, I suspect, would believe that the investigation is a farce even if confronted with even more hard evidence of crimes by various members of the Trump campaign related to Russia.
 
River said:
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/01/...o-describe-how-good-the-jobs-numbers-are.html

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-gdp-growth-q3-third-quarter-strong-2018-8
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Yes, he inherited a good economy.

But how are his policies impacting things? Well, the US trade deficit is now up 9.6% compared to last month, and exports have dropped by 1%. The trade deficits with both China and the EU are at record highs. This is likely to negatively impact GDP growth.

So that's what Trump's actual policies are doing to the economy.
 
phiwum said:
He didn't get benefits from Fox News in the primaries. They were opposed to Trump until he was the clear winner.
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Yes, but while that process seemed interminable, it was a very short time before it was pretty clear (without yet having the delegate count) he was going to win. Their time in the wilderness wasn't that long. Plus, he was still phoning into his buddies who got him primetime coverage, so while the purported "news" shows weren't yet fellating him in public, he had no negative press on Fox to speak of.

But the real culprits, as everyone should recall, were CNN and the other sluts. Trump meant ratings so they covered Trump. The did something then that they don't even do now, gave him gavel to gavel coverage at his rallies. The facile excuse from CNN is that they owed it to their stakeholders to cover the most coverable. No pretense of honesty or fairness, just worship of the almighty dollar.
 
River said:
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/01/...o-describe-how-good-the-jobs-numbers-are.html

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-gdp-growth-q3-third-quarter-strong-2018-8

Prediction: Things will keep getting better. Even after this fiasco of a probe ends. Also, certain members of the last administration and certain agency officials might be worried about upcoming prosecutions more so than Trump.
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In addition to your Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc fallacy, you may have invented an entirely new fallacy.

I'll call it the Argument By Prediction fallacy. You predict a warm fuzzy future, therefore Trump must be the cause of the predicted warm fuzzy future.

Actually, you haven't really succeeded in inventing a new fallacy. Yours is a form of non-sequitur. The implied conclusion does not follow from the prediction.

By the same reasoning you're using, I will likewise predict a series of unfortunate events during Trump's tenure. Those unfortunate events that occur during Trump's tenure must, by your form of reasoning, be Trump's fault.
 
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Toontown said:
In addition to your Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc fallacy, you may have invented an entirely new fallacy.

I'll call it the Argument By Prediction fallacy. You predict a warm fuzzy future, therefore Trump must be the cause of the predicted warm fuzzy future.

Actually, you haven't really succeeded in inventing a new fallacy. Yours is a form of non-sequitur. The implied conclusion does not follow from the prediction.

By the same reasoning you're using, I will likewise predict a series of unfortunate events during Trump's tenure. Those unfortunate events that occur during Trump's tenure must, by your form of reasoning, be Trump's fault.
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Sugaring the well?
 
Squeegee Beckenheim said:
Yes, he inherited a good economy.

But how are his policies impacting things? Well, the US trade deficit is now up 9.6% compared to last month, and exports have dropped by 1%. The trade deficits with both China and the EU are at record highs. This is likely to negatively impact GDP growth.

So that's what Trump's actual policies are doing to the economy.
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Trump inflated the budget deficit to $1 trillion. Deficit spending (AKA economic stimulus) can provide short term economic boost, at least until inflation and increasing interest rates kill it off. The problem is that if you start adding economic stimulus to an economy that is already strong you can create asset bubbles that can cause major problems down the road. See the Bush tax cuts for an example of this.
 
lomiller said:
Trump inflated the budget deficit to $1 trillion. Deficit spending (AKA economic stimulus) can provide short term economic boost, at least until inflation and increasing interest rates kill it off. The problem is that if you start adding economic stimulus to an economy that is already strong you can create asset bubbles that can cause major problems down the road. See the Bush tax cuts for an example of this.
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Do you know off the top of your head how our current deficit growth compares to the Reagan years or Bush years in relative terms?
 
River said:
I'm sure Toontown has much bigger accomplishments than becoming potus under their belt. I'm just here for the entertainment. The Trump hate in this thread is hilarious. Meanwhile, the USA seems to be doing just fine. (insert the boy who cried wolf here)
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Part of me, a tiny part, wants Trump to survive both physically and "Presidentally" until the 2020 debates. That'll be some fun times.

"Mr. President, you claimed on multiple times that new steel mills were opening. At one time you claimed six new mills were opening. There have been no openings, and there were many from the steel industry who claimed that there were no plans to open new mills. Do you have any comment on this?"

"That's fake news."

"I can roll a tape of you claiming all that I just said."

"You doctored the tape."

Democrat challenger asks for a chair, sits back and smiles.
 
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