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All things Trump + Russia Part 4

Can we all agree that Russia won the cold war?

When the berlin wall came down, and the USSR was broken up, Americans had a reason to feel at least a little smug... they "beat the Russians" (or at least outlasted them). What had been their main global opponent was no more. They "won the cold war".

Now, just a few decades later, the U.S. president was installed through assistance from Russia (not to mention Russian interference with the politics in other countries). Furthermore, the president seems to be eager to kowtow to Russia (recognizing Crimea as Russian, giving them free reign in Syria, and not taking significant steps to stop them from interfering in future elections.) And a large segment of the electorate (i.e. republican supporters), as well as republican politicians, seem quite comfortable with that arrangement. In other words, it looks like Russia was the ultimate victor in the cold war.
 
Segnosaur said:
Can we all agree that Russia won the cold war?

When the berlin wall came down, and the USSR was broken up, Americans had a reason to feel at least a little smug... they "beat the Russians" (or at least outlasted them). What had been their main global opponent was no more. They "won the cold war".

Now, just a few decades later, the U.S. president was installed through assistance from Russia (not to mention Russian interference with the politics in other countries). Furthermore, the president seems to be eager to kowtow to Russia (recognizing Crimea as Russian, giving them free reign in Syria, and not taking significant steps to stop them from interfering in future elections.) And a large segment of the electorate (i.e. republican supporters), as well as republican politicians, seem quite comfortable with that arrangement. In other words, it looks like Russia was the ultimate victor in the cold war.
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They took a hit. We took a hit. Admittedly, it looks pretty bad for the US right now.
 
It looks like Trump is going to let Russia have Syria. Makes sense, after all, he's decided that their annexation of Crimea is okay.
 
The very best that Trumpers can hope for now is that Donnie will personally get away with "plausible deniability" when his toadies go down for conspiracy. Of course, we still don't know why Trump is so intent on advancing Putin's agenda, so "plausible" is not really very plausible until that's explained.
 
Segnosaur said:
Can we all agree that Russia won the cold war?

When the berlin wall came down, and the USSR was broken up, Americans had a reason to feel at least a little smug... they "beat the Russians" (or at least outlasted them). What had been their main global opponent was no more. They "won the cold war".

Now, just a few decades later, the U.S. president was installed through assistance from Russia (not to mention Russian interference with the politics in other countries). Furthermore, the president seems to be eager to kowtow to Russia (recognizing Crimea as Russian, giving them free reign in Syria, and not taking significant steps to stop them from interfering in future elections.) And a large segment of the electorate (i.e. republican supporters), as well as republican politicians, seem quite comfortable with that arrangement. In other words, it looks like Russia was the ultimate victor in the cold war.
Click to expand...

I rather enjoyed writing this, so even if it goes off-topic, I'll leave it in here.
Russia is barely competent, but did its share. Still, it was a near-enough GOP win, with Russian help getting over the top. Four-plus decades of GOP laser-like concentration on the Southern Strategy, tied to an excellent understanding of the critical role of state legislatures in dominating national politics, and that of media concentration in dominating narratives, allowed the Republicans to gain a stranglehold on all the choke points. Now, democracy is dying. Actually, it is being murdered before our eyes. With eager cries of twisted, demented hatred.

Democrats play clean softball, Republicans dirty hardball. Time for the Dems to grow a pair and get nasty using facts, starting by calling liars (false witness Jesus haters), tax evaders (stealing your jobs) and child terrorizers (your kids may be the next targeted by wingnut shooters, hint, hint) by their name. Remind everyone Trump dropped trou for Putin like a feckless coward when it was a known fact the country was under attack. In short, treat the GOP as what it is: the lying, dissembling American Nazi Party. It can reverse all policy and miraculously retain full GOP voter support, providing only one core agenda remains: white supremacy. It is now abundantly clear these are backstabbing, disloyal, treasonous Confederates. So start calling Trump a coward and traitor now, and repeat it until he is inert politically. Work hard to associate facing hard truths with personal courage, and cutting and running from facts with craven cowardice ("Fraidy-cat FOX mews"). It is what fighting for democracy deserves, and it is high time to strip the fake mantle of strength from cowering moral weaklings. ("Not saying how many kids we are mistreating now, nya, nya!" Sick.)

Those Republicans who were honorable, and there have been many, have left the party. All who remain today are the mortal enemies of democracy and the rule of law. (Secret motto: All for coin, naught for integrity. Goes with an obscene hand gesture suggesting the scrotum is a coin purse.)

Deficits: if white racists do it, good; anyone else, gosh, ain't white enough
Immigration: white skin good, the rest can forget it
Families: holy cornerstone of society if white, rats breeding disease if non-white
... and so on down the line.

GOP = CSA = Nazis = Dirty, rotten, lying, cowardly, child-terrorizing scoundrels
Originally, I came to the thread to comment on the recent report released by the Senate on Russian interference, which I see has been mentioned. The caregiver and protector in me took over. Can't cotton to blatant, in-your-face evil, sorry. Acquiescence is how fascism wins.
 
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thaiboxerken said:
It looks like Trump is going to let Russia have Syria. Makes sense, after all, he's decided that their annexation of Crimea is okay.
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No he won't. he can't. It's not his to give!
Assad can, and propably will. In case you hadn't heard the terrorists are about to be defeated.
 
Squeegee Beckenheim said:
Senate Intelligence Committee concludes that Russia had a clear preference for Trump in the 2016 election, that politics played no part in the intelligence community assessment which said the same, and that neither did the Steele Dossier
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No ******
2 candidates.
One promises to normalize relations with russia and join forces to defeat ISIS and the other threatens to shoot down russian planes if they try to defeat ISIS.

And they prefered the one who wouldn't shoot down their planes?
 
magellan said:
No ******
2 candidates.
One promises to normalize relations with russia and join forces to defeat ISIS and the other threatens to shoot down russian planes if they try to defeat ISIS.

And they prefered the one who wouldn't shoot down their planes?
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Two candidates. One had been compromised by dirty financial transactions, by hiring a Russian agent as campaign manager, and by a pee tape. The other had to take a pee during a debate.
 
magellan said:
No he won't. he can't. It's not his to give!
Assad can, and propably will. In case you hadn't heard the terrorists are about to be defeated.
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If you mean the terrorists, you also must also mean the pro-democratic opposition of the Assad government. And while we have no interest in ISIS winning that war, Assad is no bargain. He has on multiple occasions gassed and murdered thousands of his own people.

This isn't and has never been this simple issue that you are making it out to be.
 
acbytesla said:
If you mean the terrorists, you also must also mean the pro-democratic opposition of the Assad government. And while we have no interest in ISIS winning that war, Assad is no bargain. He has on multiple occasions gassed and murdered thousands of his own people.

This isn't and has never been this simple issue that you are making it out to be.
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It is worth pointing out that there had been a moderate opposition to the Assad regime, but unsurprisingly, Assad and Russia decided to concentrate on them first, so that the alternative was worse than Assad.
 
jimbob said:
It is worth pointing out that there had been a moderate opposition to the Assad regime, but unsurprisingly, Assad and Russia decided to concentrate on them first, so that the alternative was worse than Assad.
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The US has wanted Assad gone as much as we wanted Saddam and Qadaffi gone. All of which were/are ruthless violent and cruel undemocratic leaders. The Russians backed Assad and simply don't give a damn about how many people he murders as long as it provides stability as well as money.
 
acbytesla said:
The US has wanted Assad gone as much as we wanted Saddam and Qadaffi gone. All of which were/are ruthless violent and cruel undemocratic leaders. The Russians backed Assad and simply don't give a damn about how many people he murders as long as it provides stability as well as money.
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I disagree. Syria is in a strategic location in the Middle East and provides a warm water base outside the Black Sea.

Russia wants a client state there
 
acbytesla said:
The US has wanted Assad gone as much as we wanted Saddam and Qadaffi gone. All of which were/are ruthless violent and cruel undemocratic leaders. The Russians backed Assad and simply don't give a damn about how many people he murders as long as it provides stability as well as money.
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Are you able to hear yourself?

"The russians spent thousands of dollars on facebook ads! We are under attack!!!!!" "Putin once said if he could choose he would prefer the one who didn't threaten to shoot down russian planes while they are fighting US armed terrorists - how dare he!"

"The US has wanted Assad gone as much as we wanted Saddam and Qadaffi gone." (Actually I don't blame you for Quadaffi, that was the french - just as an aside)

That's not for you to decide! Porochenko has been "killing his own people" in the donbas for 4 years. Why don't you want him gone?
 
varwoche said:
Two candidates. One had been compromised by dirty financial transactions, by hiring a Russian agent as campaign manager, and by a pee tape. The other had to take a pee during a debate.
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”That’s a problem for a lot of Americans: They just don’t love the two choices. Do you pick someone who’s under federal investigation for using a private email server?

"Or do you pick someone who called Mexicans rapists, claimed the president was born in Kenya, proposed banning an entire religion from entering the US, mocked a disabled reporter, said John McCain wasn’t a war hero because he was captured, attacked the parents of a fallen soldier, bragged about committing sexual assault, was accused by 12 women of committing sexual assault, said some of those women weren’t attractive for him to sexually assault, said more countries should get nukes, said that he would force the military to commit war crimes, said a judge was biased because his parents were Mexicans, said women should be punished for having abortions, incited violence at his rallies, called global warming a hoax perpetrated by the Chinese, called for his opponent to be jailed, declared bankruptcy six times, bragged about not paying income taxes, stiffed his contractors and employees, lost a billion dollars in one year, scammed customers at his fake university, bought a six-foot-tall painting of himself with money from his fake foundation, has a trial for fraud coming up in November, insulted an opponent’s looks, insulted an opponent’s wife’s looks, and bragged about grabbing women by the pussy?

"How do you choose? Because it’s so...it’s so even.” — Seth Meyers
 
a fair number also bought the absurd lie that she sold uranium to Russia.


Which is an odd thing to be mad about seeing as though they now believe Russia is our only friend.
 
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