Cont: All things Trump + Russia Part 2

Status
Not open for further replies.
TheRealnz said:
Um no, it's 100% important. Where did you get this idea that it would be legal for Hillary to fund it & then conceal the payments? It's illegal in ordinance with the FEC. Of course, just because it's illegal doesn't mean Hillary or any of the Teflon Democrats will get nailed for it. Truth is, this is concrete proof of collusion on a much higher level than what the Trump campaign allegedly did.

Also - something else to consider... If this phony dossier was used to obtain a FISA surveillance warrant on Trump campaign officials - then there could be legal issues here because that would mean that the warrant was obtained based on false information.

The complaint from the nonprofit Campaign Legal Center said the Democrats effectively hid the payments from public scrutiny, contrary to the requirements of federal law. By law, campaign and party committees must disclose the reason money is spent and its recipient.

“By filing misleading reports, the DNC and Clinton campaign undermined the vital public information role of campaign disclosures,” said Adav Noti, senior director of trial litigation and strategy at CLC and a former FECofficial. “Voters need campaign disclosure laws to be enforced so they can hold candidates accountable for how they raise and spend money. The FEC must investigate this apparent violation and take appropriate action.”
Click to expand...

So based on a claim, you've somehow already determined the payments were a violation of FEC laws and illegal.

OK :rolleyes:

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/oct/25/fec-complaint-accuses-clinton-dnc-violations/
“Questions about who paid for this dossier are the subject of intense public interest, and this is precisely the information that FEC reports are supposed to provide,” said Brendan Fischer, director of federal and FEC reform at CLC. “Payments by a campaign or party committee to an opposition research firm are legal, as long as those payments are accurately disclosed. But describing payments for opposition research as ‘legal services’ is entirely misleading and subverts the reporting requirements.”

And what sort of punishment does violating these FEC laws entail ? A fine ? \

Also, what collusion is this evidence of ?

I won't hold my breath waiting for answers...
 
Kremlin approved talking points.

But interviews and records show that in the months before the meeting, Ms. Veselnitskaya had discussed the allegations with one of Russia’s most powerful officials, the prosecutor general, Yuri Y. Chaika. And the memo she brought with her closely followed a document that Mr. Chaika’s office had given to an American congressman two months earlier, incorporating some paragraphs verbatim.

The coordination between the Trump Tower visitor and the Russian prosecutor general undercuts Ms. Veselnitskaya’s account that she was a purely independent actor when she sat down with Donald Trump Jr., Jared Kushner, the president’s son-in-law, and Paul J. Manafort, then the Trump campaign chairman. It also suggests that emails from an intermediary to the younger Mr. Trump promising that Ms. Veselnitskaya would arrive with information from Russian prosecutors were rooted at least partly in fact — not mere “puffery,” as the president’s son later said.

In the past week, Ms. Veselnitskaya’s allegations — that major Democratic donors were guilty of financial fraud and tax evasion — have been embraced at the highest levels of the Russian government. President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia repeated her charges at length last week at an annual conference of Western academics. A state-run television network recently made them the subject of two special reports, featuring interviews with Ms. Veselnitskaya and Mr. Chaika.

The matching messages point to a synchronized information campaign. Like some other Russian experts, Stephen Blank, a senior fellow with the nonprofit American Foreign Policy Council in Washington, said they indicate that Ms. Veselnitskaya’s actions “were coordinated from the very top.”
Click to expand...
 
varwoche said:
Funny, I didn't know that "ordinary Russian citizens" had their talking points overseen by the Kremlin.
Edited by Agatha: 
Edited moderated content
Click to expand...

I disagree. If I'm on a project independently, and it makes sense to coordinate with another group on messaging, I'm still independent and not on their behalf.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
This is truly amazing (my emphasis added):

In recent closed-door interviews with the Senate intelligence committee, Podesta and Wasserman Schultz said they did not know who had funded Fusion GPS, the intelligence firm that hired British Intelligence Officer Christopher Steele to compile the dossier on Trump, the sources said.

Podesta was asked in his September interview whether the Clinton campaign had a contractual agreement with Fusion GPS, and he said he was not aware of one, according to one of the sources.

Sitting next to Podesta during the interview: his attorney Marc Elias, who worked for the law firm that hired Fusion GPS to continue research on Trump on behalf of the Clinton campaign and DNC, multiple sources said. Elias was only there in his capacity as Podesta's attorney and not as a witness.
Click to expand...

The scumbaggery here is mind-boggling. Marc Elias is, at a minimum, guilty of an egregious breach of ethics. More likely, Podesta is guilty of perjury, and Elias is guilty of suborning perjury.
 
sunmaster14 said:
This is truly amazing (my emphasis added):



The scumbaggery here is mind-boggling. Marc Elias is, at a minimum, guilty of an egregious breach of ethics. More likely, Podesta is guilty of perjury, and Elias is guilty of suborning perjury.
Click to expand...
I will accept podesta knew where I see evidence he knew.
 
sunmaster14 said:
This is truly amazing (my emphasis added):

The scumbaggery here is mind-boggling. Marc Elias is, at a minimum, guilty of an egregious breach of ethics. More likely, Podesta is guilty of perjury, and Elias is guilty of suborning perjury.
Click to expand...

You mean your cherry picking and aspersions , right ?

On Tuesday, that law firm, Perkins Coie, wrotein a letter thatit had retained Fusion GPS as part of its representation of the Clinton campaign and the DNC. The disclosure of the Democratic funding source for Fusion GPS is raising new questions for the congressional Russian investigators. The Perkins Coie letter suggested its clients -- the Clinton campaign and the DNC -- did not learn about the matter until recently.

But yeah, in your world Podesta is a perjurer.
 
Last edited:
phiwum said:
Perhaps this is my bias showing, but I don't recall anyone arguing that everything in the dossier is fact. At best, some have argued that it can't be dismissed without investigation.

On the other hand, logger has said that the dossier notations nothing but lies.
Click to expand...

:confused: I don't believe I implied that anyone thought the entire dossier was fact? Also, I have no idea what logger says.
 
Emily's Cat said:
:confused: I don't believe I implied that anyone thought the entire dossier was fact? Also, I have no idea what logger says.
Click to expand...

Perhaps I am unclear what you meant when you said this:

Most of my objection in this thread has been to cases where that speculation has been treated as factual, and argued as such, in the absence of any supporting evidence.
Click to expand...

Aside from logger, I haven't seen any speculation treated as fact. Even Sunmaster, with whom I disagree and who I think has too much confidence in his speculations, called his theory "educated extrapolation".

I have not read every post, so it may be that I've missed whatever triggered your criticism.
 
phiwum said:
Aside from logger, I haven't seen any speculation treated as fact. Even Sunmaster, with whom I disagree and who I think has too much confidence in his speculations, called his theory "educated extrapolation".
Click to expand...


This is pretty hilarious:

TheL8Elvis: "And remember, parts of the Steele dossier have been confirmed "
First sentence of his following quote: "Also, NBC’s Ken Dilanian reminds us that PARTS of the Steele dossier seem to line up with known facts "
 
Last edited:
TheL8Elvis said:
You mean your cherry picking and aspersions , right ?

On Tuesday, that law firm, Perkins Coie, wrotein a letter thatit had retained Fusion GPS as part of its representation of the Clinton campaign and the DNC. The disclosure of the Democratic funding source for Fusion GPS is raising new questions for the congressional Russian investigators. The Perkins Coie letter suggested its clients -- the Clinton campaign and the DNC -- did not learn about the matter until recently.
Click to expand...

The letter does nothing of the sort. It can be found here. Where does it suggest that its clients didn't learn about the matter until recently?

But yeah, in your world Podesta is a perjurer.
Click to expand...

Yes, in my world Podesta is a serial perjurer. That world is known as Earth to most people. It orbits around a star called Sun (or sometimes Sol) in the Milky Way galaxy.
 
Childlike Empress said:
This is pretty hilarious:

TheL8Elvis: "And remember, parts of the Steele dossier have been confirmed "
First sentence of his following quote: "Also, NBC’s Ken Dilanian reminds us that PARTS of the Steele dossier seem to line up with known facts "
Click to expand...

Yeah, those facts which had already been published in newspapers by the time Steele added them to the dossier. That Steele guy is so crafty. He should patent the idea of mixing truth with fiction in order to enhance the credibility of the fiction. Sort of like putting fudge sauce, whipcream, and little sprinkles on cow dung.
 
sunmaster14 said:
The letter does nothing of the sort. It can be found here. Where does it suggest that its clients didn't learn about the matter until recently?
Click to expand...

Let me spell it out for you:

http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/26/polit...ie-wasserman-schultz-trump-dossier/index.html
On Tuesday, that law firm, Perkins Coie, wrote in a letter that it had retained Fusion GPS as part of its representation of the Clinton campaign and the DNC.

Perkins Coie retained Fusion GPS - not the Clinton campaign and DNC. When asked previously,m the Clinton campaign and DNC denied knowledge. Now, apparently they don't deny knowledge. Presumably, that suggests they found our recently.

But please, if you have other evidence beyond your *snicker* "spidey senses" , do tell...

sunmaster14 said:
Yes, in my world Podesta is a serial perjurer. That world is known as Earth to most people. It orbits around a star called Sun (or sometimes Sol) in the Milky Way galaxy.
Click to expand...

I'll wait for you to provide evidence of Podesta being a serial perjurer....
 
sunmaster14 said:
Yeah, those facts which had already been published in newspapers by the time Steele added them to the dossier. That Steele guy is so crafty. He should patent the idea of mixing truth with fiction in order to enhance the credibility of the fiction. Sort of like putting fudge sauce, whipcream, and little sprinkles on cow dung.
Click to expand...

More naked assertions from you. *yawn*
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom