Ed Dueling protests spark state of emergency in Virginia.

[BobTheCoward]

And I don't believe that you don't already know the answer but simply disagree that there really is that difference or that it matters.

Same game, different thread. No desire to play.

If I disagreed, I would tell you. But you have no right for you claim to go unchallenged. You say there is a difference. What is it?

 

[NoahFence]

And orders of magnitude more threatening to me than the antisemitism coming from the right. As I have pointed out countless times. I would sooner walk into a den of Illinois Nazis and debate their antisemitism with them than I would with a bunch of Communists or Antifa or SJWs on the campus of Yale University.

As would I.
We're in the protected class. It's rather enjoyable, isn't it?

 

[Tommy Jeppesen]

Plus, if you're a communist you get to wear those cool, red Che Guevara tee-shirts!

Also, I'd change your post to say "in the beginning communism is cosmopolitan and about world peace"...

Yes, the idea is great but Utopian, so it gets in trouble in the real world and then you get the purges to arrive at the true communistic human.

 

[sunmaster14]

You do that. I wouldn't bet on the outcomes though.

But to be fair it will vary depending on your race, gender, sex and so on.
So turn up a black transgender gay Jewish man and report back to us.
Then do the same as a white cisgender straight rich christian man and report back to us.

Here's the fundamental difference. Neo-Nazis may dislike me or distrust me for being Jewish, but they know that it is illegal to attack me physically, and they may even feel it is morally wrong unless I "start" something.

Whereas on the extreme left (I like to call it the Ctrl-Left rather than the Alt-Left), it is perfectly justified (in fact, it is practically a duty) to beat the crap out of a Nazi. So the risk there is that, during our discussion, they relabel me a Nazi and then beat me up. It is almost a certainty that I get relabeled a Nazi by such people when they find out that I do not support Obamacare.

 

[jimbob]

You permitted "aim" for Communism to be counted as a feature.

Yes, because the intended goal is utopian, whilst the intended goal of fascism is dystopian.

The fact that both end up creating totalitarian regimes with mass killing and starvation means that I support neither, but at least the intent of the sincere ones is positive.

 

[dudalb]

In the end communism is cosmopolitan and about world peace, where as fascism is about war between countries and who is the best.

I presume you are being sarcastic or ironic.

 

[sunmaster14]

As would I.
We're in the protected class. It's rather enjoyable, isn't it?

What protected class would that be?

 

[Tommy Jeppesen]

This strikes me as rather simplistic. To the extent Communists preached world solidarity, it was a ruse to help spread revolution (usually by violent means). Hitler may or may not have wanted to take over the world, but world domination is not intrinsic to Fascism as it is to Communism.

No, Fascism is about eternal struggle between nations (and races in Nazism). The Utopian idea in communism is world peace, the problem is how to get there. Communism requires another kind of human, than the kind that we are.

 

[dudalb]

Yes, because the intended goal is utopian, whilst the intended goal of fascism is dystopian.

The fact that both end up creating totalitarian regimes with mass killing and starvation means that I support neither, but at least the intent of the sincere ones is positive.

The fact is Utopians in power are bad,bad, news. They tend to get frustrated when their schemes for a perfect world don't work, and decide the problem is imperfect people,and seek to eliminate the imperfect people to bring about the perfect world.
And,in the end,that Communism has a utopian goal makes it no less of a murderous philoposhy in practice.

 

[Tommy Jeppesen]

I presume you are being sarcastic or ironic.

No.

 

[Tommy Jeppesen]

The fact is Utopians in power are bad,bad, news. They tend to get frustrated when their schemes for a perfect world don't work, and decide the problem is imperfect people,and seek to eliminate the imperfect people to bring about the perfect world.
And,in the end,that Communism has a utopian goal makes it no less of a murderous philoposhy in practice.

Correct.

 

[BobTheCoward]

Yes, because the intended goal is utopian, whilst the intended goal of fascism is dystopian.

The fact that both end up creating totalitarian regimes with mass killing and starvation means that I support neither, but at least the intent of the sincere ones is positive.

Better positioned for economic crisis i wouldn't say is dystopian.

 

[NoahFence]

What protected class would that be?

White males.

 

[Giordano]

https://www.economist.com/blogs/economist-explains/2017/08/economist-explains-11

Perhaps you were having problems with your reading comprehension. Your citation was one of the very sites I had found previously and on which I based my posted statement that the historical and philosophical origins of Anti-fa included groups in Europe. But where precisely in this citation does it support your statement (now posted multiple times in this thread) that most members of Anti-fa (a group that was organized in the USA and that refers to itself by that name) are Americans living outside America? I've read it through the Economist articles 3 times now and I have yet to find any such statement.

But I do appreciate you reminding me of this reference because I had forgotten that the same article states:

"There is no evidence that Antifa protesters initiated violence in Charlottesville this weekend."

Here, I'll repeat it and highlight it if you just skimmed the article the first time:

"There is no evidence that Antifa protesters initiated violence in Charlottesville this weekend."

Oh my- that would appear to seriously undermine the basis for most of your posts in this thread, wouldn't it? But of course the Economist is know for fake news and being a strong supporter of anarchist movements so you can't trust them, right?

 

[sir drinks-a-lot]

The fact is Utopians in power are bad,bad, news. They tend to get frustrated when their schemes for a perfect world don't work, and decide the problem is imperfect people,and seek to eliminate the imperfect people to bring about the perfect world.
And,in the end,that Communism has a utopian goal makes it no less of a murderous philoposhy in practice.

Well put.

 

[jimbob]

I presume you are being sarcastic or ironic.

No, that is the *intent*. It is utopian:

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his need"

The reality is that it is inherently authoritarian - someone has to decide who needs what, and how much they can contribute, and that someone tends to decide that they need more luxuries than other people, so if falls down on many levels.

A system that lacks the checks and balances of a liberal democracy, where the governed can alter their government is unstable and relies on the goodwill and competence of the rulers. As a result, communism will veer towards totalitarianism. However, if you ignore practicality, it is at least aiming for elimination of poverty and inequality.

 

[The Big Dog]

Perhaps you were having problems with your reading comprehension. SNIP

Oh yeah, after that opening sentence let me get right on replying to you.

You see

 

[Giordano]

Here's the fundamental difference. Neo-Nazis may dislike me or distrust me for being Jewish, but they know that it is illegal to attack me physically, and they may even feel it is morally wrong unless I "start" something.
Whereas on the extreme left (I like to call it the Ctrl-Left rather than the Alt-Left), it is perfectly justified (in fact, it is practically a duty) to beat the crap out of a Nazi. So the risk there is that, during our discussion, they relabel me a Nazi and then beat me up. It is almost a certainty that I get relabeled a Nazi by such people when they find out that I do not support Obamacare.

You really believe that?!! Of course no thug would ever think of doing anything illegal!

And then again they might not beat you up physically- they might just try to destroy your business, your private life, and your reputation instead:
http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-neonazi-website-lawsuit-20170418-story.html

 

[Oystein]

Antifa = Anti Fascist. In other words, REAL AMERICANS. Get that through your thick skull.

dawg.

There certainly are people in the antifa that stick that label to themselves who are not "real" Scotsmen. I mean Americans.

Parts of the European antifa are as antisemitic and as antidemocratic as their fascist counterparts. I have little doubt this is true for the new US antifa as well.
In my opinion, this has become so bad over here, that those "non-hard-left" marching with the antifa are as anti-democratic as those "non-hard-right" who are marching with nazis.

This is not do say that democrats should not counterprotest nazis just because antifa does. Just don't walk together.

 

[Shalamar]

No, that is the *intent*. It is utopian:

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his need"

The reality is that it is inherently authoritarian - someone has to decide who needs what, and how much they can contribute, and that someone tends to decide that they need more luxuries than other people, so if falls down on many levels.

A system that lacks the checks and balances of a liberal democracy, where the governed can alter their government is unstable and relies on the goodwill and competence of the rulers. As a result, communism will veer towards totalitarianism. However, if you ignore practicality, it is at least aiming for elimination of poverty and inequality.

And they are even far worse shots than Stormtroopers on the Death Star.