Transgender man gives birth

Aepervius said:
That would be more like , "your honor we were in bed and it turned out it was a man with full pieces, and I badly reacted with emotion , disgust and rage".

It does not make it acceptable at all, but it explains it, and it is a high risk of reaction if you outright lie to somebody you are getting intimate with. Love and sex are not exactely a rational stuff, and violent reaction CAN be expected. There is a reason crime of passion is a term, sudden rage.

So you can either outright lie as a TG and risk that, or you can be honest and tell it before this come to this point.

What we should be discussing is how long before it should be told, and NOT whether this should be told.
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Do you really believe this? I ask as I have previously taken you for a rather rational individual.
 
Aepervius said:
I don't think it is a valid defense. it is a valid explanation in intimate situation of why-did-it, but that should not bear a difference in outcome of penalty.
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If you think it's a valid explanation, you grant that the murderer did have a valid reason for his murder. There's a small step from that to justifying the murder. Hell, you even assign part of the blame for the murder on the victim!

The reason I'm so disgusted by this line of reasoning is because, as ponderingturtle showed, this actually happens.
 
uke2se said:
See GlennB. My interpretation wasn't so bad after all.
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You may not like it, but outright lie and then expect a polite "you are not my type let me get my clothes and get out of the bedroom" is the most stupid thing I ever heard. Human react with rationality in some situation and with emotion in otehr. Play with their emotion in an intimate situation and outright lie to them , and you should expect a humane reaction, and yes that include violence.

That is if you are asking me if a man caught being cuckholded by his wife in flagrnat delis, and getting violent with both , the wife and the other man has no blame. They have no blame for the murder, the husband has 100% of the blame, but they are not *blameless* for the whole situation, sorry.
 
Aepervius said:
I don't think it is a valid defense. it is a valid explanation in intimate situation of why-did-it, but that should not bear a difference in outcome of penalty.
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That is for the jury to decide if it excuses their behavior, at least in 49 states.
 
Aepervius said:
You may not like it, but outright lie and then expect a polite "you are not my type let me get my clothes and get out of the bedroom" is the most stupid thing I ever heard. Human react with rationality in some situation and with emotion in otehr. Play with their emotion in an intimate situation and outright lie to them , and you should expect a humane reaction, and yes that include violence.

That is if you are asking me if a man caught being cuckholded by his wife in flagrnat delis, and getting violent with both , the wife and the other man has no blame. They have no blame for the murder, the husband has 100% of the blame, but they are not *blameless* for the whole situation, sorry.
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They are blameless for their murder. That's the point. You are rationalizing murdering someone for lying to you about what gender they were born with. Actually, not even lying. Simply failing to disclose before hand, like they were carrying a sexually transmitted disease.
 
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uke2se said:
If you think it's a valid explanation, you grant that the murderer did have a valid reason for his murder. There's a small step from that to justifying the murder. Hell, you even assign part of the blame for the murder on the victim!

The reason I'm so disgusted by this line of reasoning is because, as ponderingturtle showed, this actually happens.
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You are ascribing me stuff I never said. As I said we are human and this is a valid explanation, but not a valid defense or justification and should lead to a difference in penalty.

If you are unable to recognize the difference between the two, then you are not acting rationally.
 
Aepervius said:
You are ascribing me stuff I never said. As I said we are human and this is a valid explanation, but not a valid defense or justification and should lead to a difference in penalty.

If you are unable to recognize the difference between the two, then you are not acting rationally.
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I'm able to recognize the difference, but I am not willing to go along with your assertion that this is a valid explanation. There is nothing valid about murdering someone for failing to disclose their birth gender before a sexual encounter. It doesn't explain anything, because it's not normal to react with murderous intent when faced with this situation.

You also said, I would remind you, that the murder victim had some blame. Let's not forget that.
 
uke2se said:
Do you really believe this? I ask as I have previously taken you for a rather rational individual.
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This is sex. This is intimacy. Feeling betrayed can lead to violent reaction. To take up on a meme of last year, this goes to your thalamus and not your cortex. To pretend rationality plays a role, is to pretend your are speaking of robot, and not human.

Have you ever been in such situation ? Some of us seem to speak out of experience. Some don't seem to.
 
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uke2se said:
They are blameless for their murder. That's the point. You are rationalizing murdering someone for lying to you about what gender they were born with. Actually, not even lying. Simply failing to disclose before hand, like they were carrying a sexually transmitted disease.
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Well I disagree then. Take what you think of that. But the fact remain that some people WILL react that way - it may not be necessarily rage, it may be simple disgust, and a simple accident but it could happen. One can take the risk, or one can simply prevent that risk.
 
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Aepervius said:
Well I disagree then. Take what you think of that. But the fact remain that some people WILL react that way. One can take the risk, or one can simply prevent that risk.
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Obviously some people will react that way. We call those people murderers. Let's not make excuses for them.
 
uke2se said:
If you think it's a valid explanation, you grant that the murderer did have a valid reason for his murder.
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:nope:

Aepervius, you're wasting your time. Either you're not being given a fair hearing, or the people you're discussing with can't distinguish an apple from a refrigerator.
 
uke2se said:
It doesn't really matter, but yes.
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Well it does matter since I was in such situation too but obviously our reaction differs. Mine was disgust and push away violentely from me what I recognized suddenly now as a male groping me. Maybe you are bi or whatnot , but I am not. Nobody was wounded or murdered, expcet maybe pride, but pushing a little bit stronger , and falling on a bad angle could have led to that. If you see him as blameless so be it. I don't.

If I have a message to anybody TG , is never let it come to that point and not tell the other. Not telling is a disgusting behavior, an abuse of trust, and near enough assault.
 
Aepervius said:
Well it does matter since I was in such situation too but obviously our reaction differs. Mine was disgust and push away violentely from me what I recognized suddenly now as a male groping me. Maybe you are bi or whatnot , but I am not. Nobody was wounded or murdered, expcet maybe pride, but pushing a little bit stronger , and falling on a bad angle could have led to that. If you see him as blameless so be it. I don't.

If I have a message to anybody TG , is never let it come to that point and not tell the other. Not telling is a disgusting behavior, an abuse of trust, and near enough assault.
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Not telling someone something is now considered assault to you?

Well I guess if someone's assaulting you it's okay to kill them, I think I'm following you now.

Curious.
 
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Aepervius said:
Well it does matter since I was in such situation too but obviously our reaction differs. Mine was disgust and push away violentely from me what I recognized suddenly now as a male groping me. Maybe you are bi or whatnot , but I am not. Nobody was wounded or murdered, expcet maybe pride, but pushing a little bit stronger , and falling on a bad angle could have led to that. If you see him as blameless so be it. I don't.

If I have a message to anybody TG , is never let it come to that point and not tell the other. Not telling is a disgusting behavior, an abuse of trust, and near enough assault.
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I'm straight, and I didn't much enjoy it either. That said, I did not react violently. Pushing someone away is perfectly fine. We are talking about physically assaulting someone to the point of murder.
 
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