Destroyed Atlantis = Menorah

[King of the Americas]

I am. Those pictures are not from the Atlantic ocean.

Are you thinking Gulf of Mexico, Arctic Ocean...? Maps are hard...

 

[King of the Americas]

How about the fact that this sort of stone is common over there?

You've been told this before but in addressing "all" objections you seem to be missing quite a few of them.

ACTUALLY, most ancient city planners adopted (like today) specific building codes, colors, and themes. For Plato to specifically list these colors likely meant these were in fact the large part of this city's distinct physical characteristics.

 

[King of the Americas]

Yes, Homer too.
Unless you can point us to the thick brass walls that surround the isle of the Wind God.
Or tell us on which junkie-infested island the narcotic lotos was harvested. Or where the autonomously moving, clashing rocks of the Symplegades can be found.

The fact that he used real world locations in his stories does not mean that all locations in his stories are real.

Keep digging...
He claimed it was bigger than Asia and Libya combined. That's not modern day Asia and Libya, but it means Anatolia and Northern Africa. So... quite specific, and huge.

Is it called 'digging' underwater? Maybe dredging? In any case, yes, I want more underwater investigations off the coast of Spain. I'm doing what I can. Preliminarily speaking I can see LOTS of underwater ruins all along the Spanish coast, one very round.

Bigger than Asia...? AND Libia? Sure but in what direction? If the land extended up the Spanish coast and he never saw the edge of it, I am sure it would seem unending.

 

[Belz...]

Ahh, No. They don't. Science employs a peer-review process wherein letters matter.

The peer review process exists to CHECK THE EVIDENCE, not the people presenting it.

Stop compounding your ignorance with arrogance.

 

[Pixel42]

Atlantis sunk due to earthquakes and rising sea levels.

But (according to Plato, AIUI) it wasn't a small settlement on the shore of continental Europe, it was a large one on a separate island miles out in the Atlantic. So I'm still not seeing what these particular submerged ruins could possibly have to do with it.

 

[Belz...]

Are you thinking Gulf of Mexico, Arctic Ocean...? Maps are hard...

For someone who claims to address "all" argument you sure waste a lot of time with sarcasm.

Plato said that Atlantis was out in the Atlantic ocean. Or are you ignoring that part because it doesn't fit your narrative?

ACTUALLY, most ancient city planners adopted (like today) specific building codes, colors, and themes.

Most? In the neolithic? Citation, please.

 

[Porpoise of Life]

Is it called 'digging' underwater? Maybe dredging? In any case, yes, I want more underwater investigations off the coast of Spain. I'm doing what I can. Preliminarily speaking I can see LOTS of underwater ruins all along the Spanish coast, one very round.

Bigger than Asia...? AND Libia? Sure but in what direction? If the land extended up the Spanish coast and he never saw the edge of it, I am sure it would seem unending.

See, Plato has to be taken literally, until he doesn't...
It has to be a circular city plan, so the link to your symbol fits, there have to be specifically color coded stone quarries nearby... but an island? A big island? Naaaah... maybe Plato was wrong where his story doesn't fit my conclusions...
And in 'which direction' the island lay or stretched does not matter. There couldn't have been an island of that size in the Atlantic.
You're on the one hand claiming that Plato was recounting verifiable facts as accurately as possible, because not doing so would damage his reputation... And then you turn around and claim he might have just made up a really specific mention of the size of of a lost continent because he couldn't be bothered to walk a bit?
You're so inconsistent...

Also, Plato never saw anything, because he claimed that it had disappeared over 9000 years before he was born.

How about if instead of 'just asking questions' (which isn't working, because each prospective 'gotcha' only shows how little you know), you provide some actual evidence?

 

[Belz...]

Bigger than Asia...? AND Libia? Sure but in what direction? If the land extended up the Spanish coast and he never saw the edge of it, I am sure it would seem unending.

Careful now. It seems like you're calling Plato a liar or an unrealible historian.

 

[King of the Americas]

For someone who claims to address "all" argument you sure waste a lot of time with sarcasm.

Plato said that Atlantis was out in the Atlantic ocean. Or are you ignoring that part because it doesn't fit your narrative?



Most? In the neolithic? Citation, please.

What's life without whimsy?

No, I just don't know 'exactly' what that means... I mean that could mean simply there was no bridge to it, that you'd need a boat to get to it.

Plato also speaks of navigable waters, as though all the the shoals were mapped and known.

---

Ummm... No, not right now.

I'd just say that if you search ancient monolithic sites, you'll see each one has its own theme, much of Greece today still paints their stone home white with matching colors.

"HOA's" ...need I go on?

 

[The Greater Fool]

Plato was not a fictional writer in the spirit of Tolkien, George Lucas, or Rowling. He was a teacher who wrote to preserve and inform.

Enreddening by me.

Plato was indeed a teacher... of PHILOSOPHY. His "inform" purpose was to enlighten and advocate his position and philosophy. His "preserve" purpose was not to record history but to ensure his philosophy was available to his contemporaries and posterity.

You are correct that his writing / goal was not simply to entertain as in the case of Tolkien, Lucas, and Rowling. Rather it was to advocate his philosophy in the vein of Orwell, Vonnegut*, and even Heinlein (in many cases). These authors, by the way, also created detailed locations out of whole cloth and referenced real locations. All these created fictional stories referencing real locations and detailed descriptions of fictional locations* to advance their philosophy.

* Tralfamadore must be real, though no evidence exists to demonstrate this. After all, Vonnegut begins the story with "All this happened, more or less" which obviously means he had access to information we obviously don't. We must accept Tralfamadore as a real location.

 

[Belz...]

What's life without whimsy?

What's an argument with it?

No, I just don't know 'exactly' what that means... I mean that could mean simply there was no bridge to it, that you'd need a boat to get to it.

What does Plato say, exactly, about the size of Atlantis?

Ummm... No, not right now.

I'd just say that if you search ancient monolithic sites, you'll see each one has its own theme, much of Greece today still paints their stone home white with matching colors.

"HOA's" ...need I go on?

So it's your personal belief, then.

 

[King of the Americas]

See, Plato has to be taken literally, until he doesn't......

A. What does that even mean?

B. Please state by which authority 'you' claim knowledge of what "has" to be done?

---

Plato HAS to be taken literally, 'every single word'?

Why?

 

[Porpoise of Life]

I don't believe your reading comprehension is bad enough to repeatedly misunderstand me.
You know what I meant: you are applying your own standards only when they suit you.
In fact, I explained that in the part of the post you deleted from your quote.

ETA: and of course, instead of either supporting your own claims or addressing anyone's points, you deliberately misunderstand something and use it as a distraction.

 

[Belz...]

A. What does that even mean?

Uh-huh. Sure. I'm sure you don't understand what he means even though he explained it at length.

 

[King of the Americas]

Uh-huh. Sure. I'm sure you don't understand what he means even though he explained it at length.

Ahhh, I think I understand your confusion...

Story A contains a falsehood, so the rest of story A is an unreliable historical source.

You gotta toss that idea. History isn't ONE tale, ONE person's account. ANY 'one' piece of evidence is tainted with personal bias and perspective. History has to be peer-reviewed with other pieces of evidences to 'find' the consistency, so that with all of them we can reach the best possible understanding of what really happened.

 

[The Greater Fool]

Ahhh, I think I understand your confusion...

Story A contains a falsehood, so the rest of story A is an unreliable historical source.

You gotta toss that idea. History isn't ONE tale, ONE person's account. ANY 'one' piece of evidence is tainted with personal bias and perspective. History has to be peer-reviewed with other pieces of evidences to 'find' the consistency, so that with all of them we can reach the best possible understanding of what really happened.

Cool. Refresh this for me: What are the sources outside of Plato that mention Atlantis?

 

[King of the Americas]

Cool. Refresh this for me: What are the sources outside of Plato that mention Atlantis?

We have the tale, now we look for evidence of it...a sunken city/island, where he said to find it, out of what he said it was made out of...

 

[Porpoise of Life]

Funny how many similarities there are in debating style between believers in Atlantis, Bigfoot, Aliens, Chupacabras and psychics.

Same damn tactics every time.

 

[King of the Americas]

Funny how many similarities there are in debating style between believers in Atlantis, Bigfoot, Aliens, Chupacabras and psychics.

Same damn tactics every time.

^Not an argument of any kind^

 

[Porpoise of Life]

You're right. It wasn't meant to be an argument. It's an observation. I'm not basing any argument on it. Partly because that would border on the fallacious, partly because you've been ignoring everyone's arguments anyway.