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US/Canada Trade War ?

Spindrift said:
Reports? No proof?
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There's a lobbying effort to redefine what subsidizing is in this case.

At the heart of the trade quarrel is that the majority of Canadian lumber comes from Crown lands, managed by provincial governments. In the U.S. timber is harvested from private lands meaning the stumpage price is generally higher.

The U.S. Lumber Coalition, a powerful lobby group, claims this has led to Canada’s pricing of lumber being artificially low. The Canadian government maintains that timber sold at Crown auctions are designed to reflect market rates.

“What they are saying in the U.S. is the Canadian government is essentially giving this land away cheaper than it should be and that is an illegal subsidy,” BMO economist Alex Koustas told Global News. “However, it’s been established through a number of panels and resolution panels that is not the case.”

Both resolution panels from the World Trade Organization and under the North American Free Trade Agreement had found that Canadian softwood lumber production is not subsidized.
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As noted it hasn't gone well when put to the test.
 
Spindrift said:
Reports? No proof?
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It opens up a whole philosophical question about "What is a subsidy?"

In this case, the argument is that since BC stumpage fees are lower than WA stumpage fees, this must mean Canadians are subsidizing their softwood lumber industry.


SO! It sounds like logger is saying that lower taxes = subsidy?
 
Spindrift said:
Edited by Agatha: 
Edited to remove breach in quote
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Edited by Agatha: 
Edited to remove response to breach


The sad state of forest management can be laid at the little feet of leftists.
 
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blutoski said:
It opens up a whole philosophical question about "What is a subsidy?"

In this case, the argument is that since BC stumpage fees are lower than WA stumpage fees, this must mean Canadians are subsidizing their softwood lumber industry.


SO! It sounds like logger is saying that lower taxes = subsidy?
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Funny how the left looks at these issues. Thankfully the used to be democrat working class will look at Trump as a saviour. ;)
 
logger said:
The reports are Canada is subsidising its timber industry. So not quite the free market there chief. But as usual I'm happy to inform you.
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Whatever helps your rationalize why you're not as good a logger as the Canadians so you can sleep at night. Call them being better and having a functional government that provided education and healthcare to it's citizens a 'subsidy' even. That way you don't have to for a second think that you might be getting help from the government or deal with the cognitive dissonance.
 
tyr_13 said:
Whatever helps your rationalize why you're not as good a logger as the Canadians so you can sleep at night. Call them being better and having a functional government that provided education and healthcare to it's citizens a 'subsidy' even. That way you don't have to for a second think that you might be getting help from the government or deal with the cognitive dissonance.
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Lol
It has nothing to do with being good at logging, hilarious!
And somehow your socialistic ways forced you to slip in education and healthcare. ******* hilarious!
Isn't government supposed to level the playing field? Here is a perfect opportunity to do just that. What's more important is people will give him the credit for it.
 
Ziggurat said:
When you voluntarily buy something from the government, the purchase price is not a tax.
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Not exactly that cut and dry. The actual price is made up of 3 components:

- Stumpage Price
- Forestry Futures Trust Charge
- Forest Renewal Trust Charge

The Stumpage Price is itself made up of 3 components:

- Minimum Price, updated annually and set by species and product sector
- Residual Value Price, updated monthly based on market values
- Administrative Charge, $1.00/cubic meter for any exported out of country

All of those amounts are set by the government.

Hence, a part of what the logging companies have to pay can be seen as a tax added to the base price of the commodity. Those taxes are meant to cover the administrative expenses, and the efforts to ensure sustainability as well as to aid forest recovery after natural loss (fire, disease, etc).
 
Shalamar said:
The tariffs will likely drive UP the price of lumber, and thus new home building. Likely causing layoffs in the home building industry.
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Actually it will not cause layoffs. Lumber has been about the same price for decades. It could use a small uptick.
 
Spindrift said:
A savior? Trump doesn't give a crap about the working class.
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Lol
Him causing lumber to be bought in the US and somehow you don't think these towns are going to notice. Its no wonder your side has lost these people. I used to argue with them about Clinton, they loved him. They were lukewarm about Bush but they damn sure love Trump.
 
Molinaro said:
Not exactly that cut and dry. The actual price is made up of 3 components:

- Stumpage Price
- Forestry Futures Trust Charge
- Forest Renewal Trust Charge

The Stumpage Price is itself made up of 3 components:

- Minimum Price, updated annually and set by species and product sector
- Residual Value Price, updated monthly based on market values
- Administrative Charge, $1.00/cubic meter for any exported out of country

All of those amounts are set by the government.

Hence, a part of what the logging companies have to pay can be seen as a tax added to the base price of the commodity. Those taxes are meant to cover the administrative expenses, and the efforts to ensure sustainability as well as to aid forest recovery after natural loss (fire, disease, etc).
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Yes it is that cut and dry. The stumpage price is by far the largest portion.
 
Spindrift said:
A savior? Trump doesn't give a crap about the working class.
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Let's see how far he gets on his plan for coal jobs.


Trump promised to bring back coal jobs. That promise ‘will not be kept,’ experts say.

“I made them this promise,” Trump said, “we will put our miners back to work.”

But industry experts say coal mining jobs will continue to be lost, not because of blocked access to coal, but because power plant owners are turning to natural gas. At least six plants that relied on coal have closed or announced they will close since Trump’s victory in November, including the main plant at the Navajo Generating Station in Arizona, the largest in the West. Another 40 are projected to close during the president’s four-year term.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...t-be-kept-experts-say/?utm_term=.10dd522f6e54
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logger said:
lol
Leftists got the stupid dolphin ban in place.

As far as a loss, it will effect Mexico more than the US.
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It's all just the beginning considering that Mexico will be seeking millions of dollars from the United States. Trump has proven to the whole world in less than 100 days that he is unfit to be president, which isn't surprising considering the Trump has the honor of being president with the lowest approval rating of any new president. I wonder why Trump doesn't brag about the honor of having the lowest approval rating of any new president.

Now, Trump has back-stepped on the border wall and has turned 180 degrees on some of his promises. Seems that Mr. Reality has been kicking Trump on his backside, which is why he has been changing his tune. How hilarious!! I wonder if Putin has filed for a divorce from Trump after Mr. Reality kicked him on his backside in regard to his cozy relationship with Trump before the election.
 
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