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Trump runs for POTUS / Trumped Up! Part V

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A far less charitable comment about the situation is that they desire a strongman leader because they, themselves, are not strong.

It is still too charitable. "strongman leader" is PC named version of "authoritanian Supreme Leader". Since it is a little too long, many people tend to say simply "Fuhrer". Or even "Führer", if they want to show they care sufficiently to find umlaut in five seconds on gogole. ;)
 
Well, Trump met this 5-star general (he can't remember the name) who told him that all global problems could be solved in a month.
I did some research and I think I've found Trump's main military advisor. He's only a one-star general though, but he's a perfect match for Trump: like to flail his arms around, spouts incomprehensible garbage, has the attention span of an amoebe, and goes off the rails.

 
I'm not sure what is worse, you're rewriting history to serve your absurd narrative or that you think having 20 million Americans killed to be acceptable. No, now I'm being ridiculous of course.

He thinks he's being funny by quoting Dr, Strangelove.
 
What leads you to that ridiculous conclusion ? There are a lot of companies making very healthy profits in very competitive markets.

The thing is that in a well run business, you try to anticipate where the risks are (in the case of my business it's the fallout from a messy Brexit) and try to take mitigating actions. In the case of my business we're building up a cash reserve which will allow us to give each permanent employee six months pay (in addition to their statutory redundancy) instead of maximising the returns for the directors.

Trump on the other hand crashes from disaster to disaster with apparently no contingency despite receiving clear and timely warnings from industry experts. Of course he knows better, presses on and the business goes under. Doesn't sound like the kind of guy you want in charge of a country.

Don't let logger get to you Don. There are many posters on the forum that attempt to talk as if they know something, but we know that they are talking out their ass.
 
Running the federal government is not like running a business, so his acumen (or lack of it) as a businessman is not terribly relevant.
Yet The Trumpet, and many of his supporters, claim it is. Therefore his numerous failures as a businessman are relevant.

More important is the ability to make tough decisions and take risks, and then take the heat that follows.
Or flip-flop, blame others and deny responsibility.
 
“We are going to convey my top generals..."


For someone who claims to have such a great vocabulary, you'd think he'd know the word "convene."

Steve S
 
Don't let logger get to you Don.

Oh, don't worry I'm not. I just wanted to make sure that people weren't under the impression that multiple bankruptcies weren't standard operating practice for those of us who own and run business.
 
Wow, talk about mindlessly buying into the myth. JFK was an uber douchebag and a fraud. Almost certainly worse than Trump as a human being. He forced himself on a 19 year old intern in the White House and later coerced her into giving one of his friends a blow job in the swimming pool while he watched. He was weak and frail and dishonest, and his Daddy bought him everything, including the Presidency. His brothers were no better, although Bobby was probably the smart one at least. Trump has zero class, but that's more than JFK had. And at least Trump has done some legitimate work in his life.


Re: Highlighted #1 - is that a knock? That can't be a knock. You do understand that festering human pile of **** you root for falls into that category as well? You wouldn't want to be guilty of self-contradictory statements, would you?


Re: Highlighted #2 - Epic example of cognitive dissonance. Textbook. Trump has done nothing but hurt everyone in his wake. JFK was a war hero. Oh yea, Trumpkins don't like war heroes. My bad.

I eagerly await your minimizing the PT109 incident. Can't wait.
 
Donald Trump has a plan for dealing with Congress. You will find it on the Issues page of his website.

Congress has not come together to work in the best interests of the American public for decades. Trump will put an end to that by (A) getting them all together in the same room, (B) using his exceptionally insightful ability to size up opponents and what they want, and (C) applying common sense.​

That's it. That is his entire plan to work with Congress.

It is such a strange blend of naïveté and willful ignorance.

Is that real??? (Blocked at work)
 
Oh, don't worry I'm not. I just wanted to make sure that people weren't under the impression that multiple bankruptcies weren't standard operating practice for those of us who own and run business.

Of course they're not. Less than 5 percent of the fortune 500 in the last 20 years have been in bankruptcy. Trump's suggestion that bankruptcy shows how smart of businessman he is is absurd. And it's utterly moronic for people to fall for that line of bs.
 
A'isha said:
I'm not sure what is worse, you're rewriting history to serve your absurd narrative or that you think having 20 million Americans killed to be acceptable. No, now I'm being ridiculous of course.

He thinks he's being funny by quoting Dr, Strangelove.


I believe it was General Buck Turgidson said that.
 
Re: Highlighted #1 - is that a knock? That can't be a knock. You do understand that festering human pile of **** you root for falls into that category as well? You wouldn't want to be guilty of self-contradictory statements, would you?


Re: Highlighted #2 - Epic example of cognitive dissonance. Textbook. Trump has done nothing but hurt everyone in his wake. JFK was a war hero. Oh yea, Trumpkins don't like war heroes. My bad.

I eagerly await your minimizing the PT109 incident. Can't wait.

Trump likes Torpedo boat captains who don't have their boat sunk.
 
[SNIP] Bankruptcy is a natural and healthy part of capitalism. It's why we have such a rich and developed bankruptcy code. Almost every business eventually goes bankrupt. It's almost as inevitable as death for a human being. Bankruptcy provides an ordered mechanism of making the best use of the corpse.

Edited by kmortis: 
Removed to comply with Rule 12

I've been attempting half heartedly to validate the core of this claim, but I'm not finding the stats I'm looking for. My Google fu is weak today, I guess.

The specific stats I'm looking for:
  • Percentage of new business filing that end in bankruptcy within (5 or 8) years.
  • Percentage of existing businesses of arbitrary size category that have declared bankruptcy on the core business, as opposed to on a subsidiary business purchased by a company to bundle all the parent company's debts in one place.
  • Percentage of small businesses who file bankruptcy that are owned by larger companies that don't.

I've seen the data for these questions over the years. It kinda validates sunmaster14 and logger's statements re business bankruptcy but only kinda. It's a cherry picking /data spin issue.
 
Yes, but his leadership qualities are heads and tales above what we now or what the dems want us to have. She'll certainly start more wars. ;)

I expect Hillary to engage in more robust and confrontational foreign policy than Obama has.

You think she'll start wars? So do I. In fact, I have a list of places I think the US needs to get more involved with in the next 8 years.
 
I believe it was General Buck Turgidson said that.

I hate to say this since it is considered film blasphemy but I really can't stand Kubrick with the exception of Spartacus and I've never seen Dr. Strangelove, but my guess is that I should. I just couldn't stand 2001, Clockwork Orange, Full Metal Jacket, The Shining, Eyes Wide Shut so much. But as a cinephile, there are some movies you're supposed to see including every Kubrick movie.
 
God did good business when he created Scots.

Donald Trump is real danger to US security, says Alex Salmond
http://www.theguardian.com/politics...al-danger-to-security-of-america-alex-salmond

Alex Salmond, Scotland’s former first minister, has warned US voters that Donald Trump is an emotionally stunted “manchild” who presents “a real and present danger to the security of the American republic”.

Salmond said his many dealings with Trump over the property tycoon’s controversial golf course near Aberdeen and a nearby windfarm had persuaded him that Trump was so unstable that the prospect of him becoming US president “should give us all the heebie-jeebies”.

That's just warm-up. He really gets into his stride later.

“It is a matter of debate as to whether it is more comforting to believe that a candidate says disgusting things not because he believes them but because he thinks they might benefit him in a campaign,” Salmond said in an article for the Daily Record.


“It is an open question whether a demagogue is preferable to a genuine racist.”

On Trump's promises:
Salmond had endorsed Trump’s claims that he was justified in bulldozing a legally protected dunes system, designated as a site of special scientific interest under the UK’s environment laws, because the resort would create thousands of jobs and involve a £750m sports, hotel and housing development of national importance.

In fact, eight years after winning approval for the resort, Trump now only employs 95 people, many of whom are seasonal or part-time, and has only invested about £30m in the course, a single-storey club house, and a small boutique hotel.

More on character:
“Indeed in the course of a single phone call he would veer alarmingly from bonhomie, to bullying, to pleading and then back to a jocular mood. Emotionally he is a Peter Pan – the boy who never grew up."

Finishing with a Glasgow kiss-off:
“As this presidential campaign now reaches its climax, they should consider using such an approach again.
“Because while many disgruntled Americans are still attracted to the Trump anti-establishment, anti-Washington, anti-big government rhetoric there are only a few who want to risk a manchild in the White House.
“The truth is indeed out there because: ‘In your guts you know he’s nuts’.”
 
I'd like you to provide evidence of the fact that often in bankruptcies, creditors get paid in full. My experience, through companies I have worked for and with is that when a customer or supplier enters bankruptcy, it's very rare for unsecured creditors to get anything more than single digit percentages at best and even secured creditors get a fraction of what they are owed.

There are many examples where the creditors took the company out of Chapter 11 bankruptcy and were not only made whole, but made a killing. Charter Communications is one example. Orange County went through a Chapter 9 bankruptcy (which is the code governing municipalities), and the creditors were made whole. It depends largely on why it went into bankruptcy. If it was a cash flow issue, or some bond convenants were breached, then Chapter 11 is usually forced by the creditors in order to protect their claims. Another example is AMBAC (a bond insurer), which went bankrupt in 2010. Its "claim" bonds are trading well over 100 cents on the dollar.

The canonical recovery value used in the credit default swap market for corporations (both US and European) is 40%. That's for senior unsecured debt. Of course, that implies that the recovery will actually be much larger than 40% because there is generally a huge risk premium to be earned in buying defaulted debt, and the recovery value is defined as the market value of the debt just after a default. Often, recovery values are much higher, sometimes exceeding 100%, which is weird but does happen.

Secured debt, by the way, is very likely to be paid back in full in general. Junior creditors are very likely not to be paid back in full. On the other hand, they are usually paid a very high interest so that they might prove to be winners overall if the bonds pay for 5-10 years.


You made a claim that 95% of businesses end in bankruptcy - I'd like to see you back this up. As I said, in my experience there are two usual ways for a business to finish up; to be purchased in full or in part by another business or to be wound up in an orderly fashion.

I didn't actually claim that 95% of businesses end in bankruptcy. I used it as a mathematical example that if a business has a 1% chance of bankruptcy every year, which is on the low side in the US, at least as implied by the credit default swap market, then it is virtually inevitable that it will go bankrupt in the long term. This is simply a consequence of mathematics. The probability is doesn't go bankrupt in N years is 0.99^N, which is a small number for large N.

The vast majority of businesses are owned and operated by a single person. If I think of Martin the Handyman, Dave the Moleguy, Mike and Annie who used to own the wine shop in town or any of the dozens of IT contractors who have been through my doors over the decades then unless they screw up badly their businesses were or will be wound up in an orderly fashion when they decide that they don't want to work any more. They will pay the last bills, draw the last of their capital out of the company and then they and their accountant will shut the business down.

Even larger businesses in difficulty tend not to go bankrupt in my experience. Some do, many in high profile ways, but they seem to share a common trait - they are badly run and those managing them haven't made provision for choppy economic waters. Even where the business is completely done - good management allows shareholders to retrieve some value by selling off the fixed assets, intellectual property or brand value even if it is for a small percentage of its true value.

It is far more often that a company avoids bankruptcy by renegotiating with its creditors when it gets into a little trouble or breaches some covenants. That's because bankruptcy can be a long and expensive process. Still, one side or the other might force a bankruptcy depending on how the negotiations go. A company manager who avoids bankruptcy by conceding to the terms demanded by the creditors might actually be doing a worse job for the owners than one who enters bankruptcy. You have to look at the details.

Unless you can provide some figures to back up your claim of "95% of businesses go bankrupt" then I think you are mistaken and Donald Trump is unusual in having quite so many businesses fail from under him.

Once again, the 95% figure is a strawman. Regardless, Donald Trump's six bankruptcies (5 of which involved casinos, and 4 of which happened in 1992) are not unusual in the least given the number of businesses he's been involved in. Most investors have invested in companies that go bust. Usually though don't get tainted by them. It's different for Trump because he slaps his name on everything.
 
I hate to say this since it is considered film blasphemy but I really can't stand Kubrick with the exception of Spartacus and I've never seen Dr. Strangelove, but my guess is that I should. I just couldn't stand 2001, Clockwork Orange, Full Metal Jacket, The Shining, Eyes Wide Shut so much. But as a cinephile, there are some movies you're supposed to see including every Kubrick movie.

Think of it less as a Kubrick and more a Peter Seller's movie ;)
 
I've been attempting half heartedly to validate the core of this claim, but I'm not finding the stats I'm looking for. My Google fu is weak today, I guess.

The specific stats I'm looking for:
  • Percentage of new business filing that end in bankruptcy within (5 or 8) years.
  • Percentage of existing businesses of arbitrary size category that have declared bankruptcy on the core business, as opposed to on a subsidiary business purchased by a company to bundle all the parent company's debts in one place.
  • Percentage of small businesses who file bankruptcy that are owned by larger companies that don't.

I've seen the data for these questions over the years. It kinda validates sunmaster14 and logger's statements re business bankruptcy but only kinda. It's a cherry picking /data spin issue.

Why don't you present it? Whereas I'm convinced that half of all businesses fail, I'm pretty sure that most of them don't declare bankruptcy.
 
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