What will happen at the Democratic Convention?

[thaiboxerken]

While the ratings were better overall, Donald decisively beat Hillay head to head.

By what measure? You've just dismissed the only objective measure.

 

[The Big Dog]

By what measure? You've just dismissed the only objective measure.

by the ratings measure, obviously...

 

[thaiboxerken]

by the ratings measure, obviously...

What ratings? Have a link?

 

[acbytesla]

by the ratings measure, obviously...

You know. You saying this doesn't make it so.

I think the DNC was much better than the RNC but that isn't an objective measure. I've read TV ratings for the DNC was also higher. But that doesn't mean it was better or more persuasive.

Check the polling in a week or 2 and then maybe we could say one was better than the other....maybe.

 

[AlaskaBushPilot]

The neocons were disillusioned Democrats, upset mostly with foreign policy. Not enough war and hyperpower bullying across the globe. The abandonment of Viet Nam.

They don't care what party they belong to, it's the War Party regardless. After re-packaging themselves as Republicans they gained the most power under Bush the Stupid.

Sure, they'll follow Hillary back to the democratic Party. They are apoplectic about Trump.

The excuse that Hillary is so weak as a woman she has to go full-on War Party to show strength - just sophistry, and very poor optics for Hillary. It is an old excuse, just being feminized for Hillary. I saw Gore people using it because he was a Democrat and had to out-neocon Bush.

Hillary represents the Banks, Saudi Arabia, and the rest of the donor list to the Clinton Foundation and the speaking fee list.

Someone asked why she would do it - why run for the presidency, how much richer could she get.

That's pretty simple. She wants the power. She showed her lust for it most especially during her destroy Libya project. That whole affair really demonstrated her recklessness, just as reckless as Bush. The cackling of Hillary over the sodomy and murder of Qadaffi and the utter arrogance of the Boy President and his Mission Accomplished in Iraq - very similar behavior. Not what I want in a president.

Check out the Greens. Check out the Libertarians. Check out Webster Tarpley, he's with the Tax Wall Street party and he has a lot of interesting books, shows, interviews & etc. on Tarpley dot net. I don't think they actually are on the ballot much of anywhere but Tarpley is a very keen historian and has very good commentary on the money powers behind the establishment. What to look for. He was at some of the Anti-Trump protests, particularly the one in NYC - Alex Jones show actually interviewed him there.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Khizr Khan is on Lawrence O'Donnell tonight admonishing McConnell and Ryan for not repudiating Trump.

He's emotional and tearing up about it. It's almost as moving as the Convention speech.


Khans on @Lawrence are moral compass of the election. McConnell and Ryan should be haunted by his words.Regular people with something to say

 

[Foolmewunz]

Webster Tarpley? Really?

 

[Denver]

Trump is speaking in Denver now.
He loves Denver.
He will also do great things with trade.
And so on.

 

[snoop_doxie]

He was at some of the Anti-Trump protests, particularly the one in NYC - Alex Jones show actually interviewed him there.

Alex Jones?

Why not Matt Moneymaker?

They both make money from the gullibility of others.

"Looking for Neocons: The Beginning"

 

[Travis]

As a Bernie supporter I have spent the last couple of months resigning myself to the fact that, as expected, I would have to suck it up and vote for Hillary. I did watch many hours of the DNC coverage this week in the hopes that it would make me feel a bit more excited about the lever I would have to pull. A lot of late nights later I still can't say I am thrilled with the notion, despite some valiant efforts by some of the speakers.
{snip}

By night three I was honestly ashamed I had ever supported Bernie. I was really wishing I could go back and undo my support for him. It had all started with promise and then ended with delusional idiots chanting stuff at the party where they were supposed to rally around their party's nominee.

I was all for advancing competing ideas in the primaries but at the end of it all you are supposed to fall in line and keep the GOP out of the White House which is the really important end game.

Shouting "no more war" is stupid even when a real dumb war is on us but it gets elevated to a whole new level of idiocy when you are shouting it at Leon Pannetta and a bunch of generals who are explicitly giving speeches about how Trump will lead us into new wars we don't want.

Progressives had a chance to effect change the only way change actually happens --- by working with the system from the inside --- and they threw it all away by resorting to their old idiotic nonsense of protest activism. Protest activism is ineffectual precisely because it alienates and causes people to draw lines of distinction. You won't get me to change my mind by standing outside my house and shouting things but you might if you play nice and come inside for a talk.

 

[Travis]

I actually started wondering if progressives even really wanted change. I had long suspected from my college days that many in the progressive movement sabotage themselves because for them achieving change isn't the real goal it is just advocating for it that is fun. Could it be that many aren't really in it for change and are just hangers on for a movement where they get to be contrary and rebellious?

 

[TragicMonkey]

By night three I was honestly ashamed I had ever supported Bernie. I was really wishing I could go back and undo my support for him. It had all started with promise and then ended with delusional idiots chanting stuff at the party where they were supposed to rally around their party's nominee.

But you didn't support Bernie. You apparently supported the group of people you thought were cool, and when they became uncool you got embarrassed.

I'm curious: what else do you choose based on the behavior of others? Do you like chocolate, but only if dorky people aren't eating it? Are you deeply religious because Richard Dawkins is a jerk so he ruined atheism? Do you like bands only until they become popular? Do you support ISIS because Trump says they're bad and you want to be different than Trump?

Maybe you should select your political positions and candidates for themselves, and not for how fashionable or irritating the other supporters are. Embarrassment is a stupid thing that certainly shouldn't sway your judgment on matters you consider important.

By all means, vote for Hillary. Unless some other Hillary-voting person says or does something that embarrasses you, in which case I guess you'll vote for Stein or write in "Kanye West" because he's cool enough for you to be associated with.

 

[Stacko]

I guess we'll find out Sept 26, which is the first scheduled Trump/Clinton debate.

Scuttlebutt is Donald's camp hasn't even begun engaging in negotiations on venue and moderator. There's a significant chance that he doesn't agree to them at all. Everyone that isn't in the cult of personality around the great pumpkin that advises him knows how ill equipped he is to handle a one on one debate. Just look at what he did to Katy Tur when she pressed him on his insane Russia go hack Hillary comment during that press conference. There's good chance that Hillary presses him on one of goldmine of ludicrous things he said and he responds with a go **** yourself.

 

[TragicMonkey]

I actually started wondering if progressives even really wanted change. I had long suspected from my college days that many in the progressive movement sabotage themselves because for them achieving change isn't the real goal it is just advocating for it that is fun. Could it be that many aren't really in it for change and are just hangers on for a movement where they get to be contrary and rebellious?

Gee, Holden Caulfield, why don't you just accuse everyone on earth of being "phonies" and be done with it?

 

[Foolmewunz]

By night three I was honestly ashamed I had ever supported Bernie. I was really wishing I could go back and undo my support for him. It had all started with promise and then ended with delusional idiots chanting stuff at the party where they were supposed to rally around their party's nominee.

I was all for advancing competing ideas in the primaries but at the end of it all you are supposed to fall in line and keep the GOP out of the White House which is the really important end game.

Shouting "no more war" is stupid even when a real dumb war is on us but it gets elevated to a whole new level of idiocy when you are shouting it at Leon Pannetta and a bunch of generals who are explicitly giving speeches about how Trump will lead us into new wars we don't want.

Progressives had a chance to effect change the only way change actually happens --- by working with the system from the inside --- and they threw it all away by resorting to their old idiotic nonsense of protest activism. Protest activism is ineffectual precisely because it alienates and causes people to draw lines of distinction. You won't get me to change my mind by standing outside my house and shouting things but you might if you play nice and come inside for a talk.

I know we live in Instant World, but a whole lot of us have actually changed people's minds by standing outside of Draft Boards, Hotels, City Halls, Police Headquarters, the Capital, the Supreme Court, the White House, Stonewall, the DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL CONVENTION IN CHICAGO IN '68, etc....

I want people shouting "No More Wars". I want the Dems to question this new coziness with flag-waving in lieu of programs and ideas. I don't find this in the least bit embarrassing. I'm proud of them. Pride in country is fine. Wrapping yourself in the flag is not. We need pacifist voices. We need dissenters. The slither to the right at the DNC made me VERY uncomfortable. It's those dissidents, pacifists, anti-corporatists and anti-militarists that I'm counting on to keep that self-serving instinct from taking over the Democratic Party.

Far from embarrassing, I am proud of those idiots. ["Idiots" because, as with everyone else, anyone who disagrees with ME is an idiot. ]

 

[AlaskaBushPilot]

Webster Tarpley? Really?

Making faces, yes - this is your standard argument.

I really like Tarpley, yes. Because I actually do believe in free speech and tolerance as opposed to the extreme intolerance you exhibit.

As a historian, he's quite imposing and that is why I listen to him. The European history especially. I don't belong to his party and couldn't care less about his tax plan. I just think people need some very good history background when making political decisions, especially those pertaining to war. Seems to me this is really his specialty - the machinations leading to the major historical European wars. I don't have to buy into any one of his particular theories to learn from him.

His anti-war position and mine are the same. That makes him insane by establishment standards so I expect you to take on that S.O.P. with both of us. He is insane. I am insane for not saying he is insane.

So you make faces.

 

[AlaskaBushPilot]

Alex Jones?

Yeah. Isn't that interesting? I knew Webster Tarpley was protesting at Trump's NYC event. So I was looking for it. That's who did the interview.

Why not Matt Moneymaker?

Sure, why not?

If Matt Moneymaker had been assigned by CNN, ABC or Alex Jones to interview Webster Tarpley at a Trump rally protest - sure I would listen.

It was fun. Because the Alex Jones people know about Webster Tarpley, they actually agree with each other on a couple of things despite being polar opposites otherwise.

Why would I care who did the interview? Nobody else was doing it.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

I actually started wondering if progressives even really wanted change. I had long suspected from my college days that many in the progressive movement sabotage themselves because for them achieving change isn't the real goal it is just advocating for it that is fun. Could it be that many aren't really in it for change and are just hangers on for a movement where they get to be contrary and rebellious?

It's alright. At least you're not latching on to Stein in lieu of Bernie for "ideological/vote your conscience" nonsense.

 

[Foolmewunz]

Making faces, yes - this is your standard argument.

I really like Tarpley, yes. Because I actually do believe in free speech and tolerance as opposed to the extreme intolerance you exhibit.

As a historian, he's quite imposing and that is why I listen to him. The European history especially. I don't belong to his party and couldn't care less about his tax plan. I just think people need some very good history background when making political decisions, especially those pertaining to war. Seems to me this is really his specialty - the machinations leading to the major historical European wars. I don't have to buy into any one of his particular theories to learn from him.

His anti-war position and mine are the same. That makes him insane by establishment standards so I expect you to take on that S.O.P. with both of us. He is insane. I am insane for not saying he is insane.

So you make faces.

I make faces. It's human. It's a human reaction to "really bad ideas". Quit the tone policing. It doesn't work. If you want to eschew emotion, feel free to do so. I will respond in the fashion I choose. I am not concerned, in the least, about "losing points" based on faux dignity.

Webster Tarpley is a conspiracy-mongering idiot. Suggesting, with a straight face, that members read their Tarpley to get a better understanding of history is like suggesting one study their Carrot Top to have a more rounded knowledge of Haute Couture. You can't think of other authors/writers who better express anti-war or anti-militarist sentiments?

 

[AlaskaBushPilot]

But you didn't support Bernie. You apparently supported the group of people you thought were cool, and when they became uncool you got embarrassed.

I'm curious: what else do you choose based on the behavior of others? Do you like chocolate, but only if dorky people aren't eating it? Are you deeply religious because Richard Dawkins is a jerk so he ruined atheism? Do you like bands only until they become popular? Do you support ISIS because Trump says they're bad and you want to be different than Trump?

Maybe you should select your political positions and candidates for themselves, and not for how fashionable or irritating the other supporters are. Embarrassment is a stupid thing that certainly shouldn't sway your judgment on matters you consider important.

By all means, vote for Hillary. Unless some other Hillary-voting person says or does something that embarrasses you, in which case I guess you'll vote for Stein or write in "Kanye West" because he's cool enough for you to be associated with.

lol. That was so appropriate for what just happened with me too.

I'm looking for information on the internet. Someone interviewed Webster Tarpley, a PhD historian. It's bad enough I need to be embarrassed to listen to this historian. Not that I am his political representative or lackey, but that I would even listen to him.

I listened to Hillary Clinton's address at the DNC too, even though I disagree with her policies and governance. How embarrassed I should be, I guess.

But the internet search gives me Alex Jones channel as the interviewing station. Their field reps are out at this NYC anti-Trump protest.

Now I have to be extremely embarrassed because it is Alex Jones channel doing the interview.

I have explained many times that republican-leaning press is your best bird-dog for democratic excesses. The democrat-leaning press is your best bird-dog for republican excesses. The alternative media is your best bird-dog for establishment excesses, i.e. both parties.

I read all of them. So you take it from everyone. Shaming you for any source other than their own preferred sources. Confirmation bias. Close my mind to anything but what I believe and shame the hell out of anyone doing otherwise.

If Martin Luther King comes back from the dead then I would be just fine listening to David Duke interview him.

The person who needs to be embarrassed is the one who will actually refuse to even look at information just because the source might have different political interests. Rather than understanding the information in the context of those political interests.

A KKK interview of Martin Luther King would actually be pretty damned interesting, and Alex Jones interviewing Webster Tarpley is that sort of thing.